No person can come to Christ by their own freewill !

[Brightfame52]

No man/person can come to Jesus Christ in believing except it be for performance of God ! Its like when Jesus says here Jn 3:20-21

20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.

21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

Coming to the Light, which is coming to Jesus who is the Light of the world Jn 8:12;9:5,12:46 is wrought by God, its His accomplished work for men to come to Christ Jn 6:65

65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

 

[Brightfame52]

The reason why men by nature cant come to Christ by their so called freewill is because mans natural carnal mind is enmity against God Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

That word enmity is the greek word echthra:

hostility; by implication, a reason for opposition:—enmity, hatred.

Man naturally in his thoughts, purposes is against God, hates God, so hates Christ who is God Jn 1:1 ! This characterizes mans lost state by nature, so thats why its declared that no man can come to Christ save the Father draws him Jn 6:44,65, or except a man is born again ! 10

 

[Brightfame52]

No man can come to Christ naturally because by nature as Paul writes concerning the gentiles in Eph 2 they are helpless and without hope in themselves pertaining to Salvation Eph 2:12

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

Man naturally, is without spiritual strength Rom 5:6

For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. We were by nature powerless to help ourselves, in a dead lost spiritual state ! 10

 

[ThatDumbChicken]

Saved sinners don't ask other Christians to celebrate them.

Explain Hebrews 11. Why is the writer celebrating though who had faith?

 

[Brightfame52]

Explain Hebrews 11. Why is the writer celebrating though who had faith?

The writer isnt celebrating them, you reading that into the narrative. If anything he is celebrating Faith, the Gift of God. No natural man has the Faith of Heb 11 in them naturally.

 

[David Lamb]

Explain Hebrews 11. Why is the writer celebrating though who had faith?

Hebrews 11 isn't celebrating the people who had faith, but their God-given faith. The opening of the chapter describes faith:

“1 ¶ Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good testimony. 3 By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.” (Heb 11:1-3 NKJV)

The following verses go on to give examples of people in the Old Testament , but there ius nothing in the chapter to indicate celebration of those people.

 

[Brightfame52]

If God was to leave a man to himself, what we are naturally, we would never be saved, we would never seek the True God , which is the God of Election Rom 3:11

11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

We would never come to Christ, the True Christ that came only to save a particular people and not everyone without exception Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Who laid down His Life only for His Sheep Jn 10:11,15

11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.

15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.

The Christ who was only commissioned to Give Eternal Life to Gods chosen Jn 17:2-3

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they[the elect given Him of the Father] might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

Man naturally wont come to this Jesus Christ Jn 5:40

“And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

By nature we are at enmity against this Christ Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 11

 

[Spiritual Jew]

Why would I assume for the sake of argument that all men have free will when you are not willing to assume for the sake of argument that salvation belongs to God, that it is His to give to those He chooses, HOW he chooses?

Did I say that salvation doesn't belong to God? No, I did not.

I'm asking you to assume something for the sake or argument because I'm trying to get you to look at it from my perspective and consider it from my perspective instead of only looking at things from one perspective. Are you afraid to consider any other thing than you've been taught? You come across as brainwashed if you're not even willing to consider any other view than what you have been taught.

You think if all people have free will and salvation is partly dependent on man's choice then, somehow, salvation doesn't belong to God. But, if God determined that He wanted to give all people free will and that He requires all people to choose to repent and to acknowledge that they can't save themselves and atone for their own sins, then would that mean salvation doesn't belong to God alone? No. How could salvation belong to man in that case after man has just admitted that he can't save himself, but that only God can save him?

If you were drowning in the ocean and someone threw out a life preserver to you and you grabbed on to it to keep from drowning, did you save yourself or did the person who threw you the life preserver save you? Would the salvation of your physical life belong to you or the one who gave you a way to be saved from drowning?

 

[Spiritual Jew]

Hebrews 11 isn't celebrating the people who had faith, but their God-given faith. The opening of the chapter describes faith:

“1 ¶ Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good testimony. 3 By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.” (Heb 11:1-3 NKJV)

The following verses go on to give examples of people in the Old Testament , but there ius nothing in the chapter to indicate celebration of those people.

Hebrews 11 says nothing about God giving anyone faith. Faith is the act of us trusting in God instead of ourselves. How is that something that is given to us? How can faith be forced? I don't think you understand what faith is. If faith is given to us rather than it being an act of of the will, then we are just robots. But, how can robots have faith?

 

[Spiritual Jew]

I just explained that to you. The unregenerate sometimes get angry at the preaching. Stephen called them insulting names Acts 7

51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:

They just resisted his preaching, has nothing to do with God drawing them. You just impose that meaning on it.

Give me a break. You dodge every challenge to your view. Why can't you engage in honest discussion? It says they were resisting the Holy Spirit. What was the Holy Spirit doing that they were resisting? The Holy Spirit was doing something in relation to them, not someone else, that they were resisting. He was speaking to their hearts about their need to repent and believe the gospel that Stephen was preaching to them. That is what they were resisting. You are denying the obvious here.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

If God was to leave a man to himself, what we are naturally, we would never be saved, we would never seek the True God , which is the God of Election Rom 3:11

Of course. No one disagree with this. But, thankfully, He doesn't do that. He speaks to people in their hearts and has His word preached to them. At that point, people are required to choose how to respond. You deny that people can resist it when God reaches out to them, but they can. God wants all people to be saved (1 Timothy 2:3-6), which is why He commands all people everywhere to repent (Acts 17:30) and why He sent His Son to die for the sins of the whole world (1 John 2:1-2). Your doctrine is based on cherry picked scriptures that you take out of context instead of on all of scripture.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

No man can come to Christ naturally because by nature as Paul writes concerning the gentiles in Eph 2 they are helpless and without hope in themselves pertaining to Salvation Eph 2:12

12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

Man naturally, is without spiritual strength Rom 5:6

For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. We were by nature powerless to help ourselves, in a dead lost spiritual state ! 10

You don't get it. No one here who disagrees with your Calvinist view, including me, is saying that we are saved by our own spiritual strength. Instead, I'm saying that man (mankind - all people) is required by God to repent (Acts 17:30) and acknowledge that he is weak and is a lost sinner who can't save himself and needs God's mercy to save him instead.

 

[Brightfame52]

Give me a break. You dodge every challenge to your view. Why can't you engage in honest discussion? It says they were resisting the Holy Spirit. What was the Holy Spirit doing that they were resisting? The Holy Spirit was doing something in relation to them, not someone else, that they were resisting. He was speaking to their hearts about their need to repent and believe the gospel that Stephen was preaching to them. That is what they were resisting. You are denying the obvious here.

The natural man resist the preaching of the Gospel, he is at enmity against God with his natural mind, so what you expect. Stephen called them unregenerate men.

 

[Brightfame52]

Of course. No one disagree with this. But, thankfully, He doesn't do that. He speaks to people in their hearts and has His word preached to them. At that point, people are required to choose how to respond. You deny that people can resist it when God reaches out to them, but they can. God wants all people to be saved (1 Timothy 2:3-6), which is why He commands all people everywhere to repent (Acts 17:30) and why He sent His Son to die for the sins of the whole world (1 John 2:1-2). Your doctrine is based on cherry picked scriptures that you take out of context instead of on all of scripture.

God wants all the elect everywhere to be saved and they shall be saved.

 

[Brightfame52]

You don't get it. No one here who disagrees with your Calvinist view, including me, is saying that we are saved by our own spiritual strength. Instead, I'm saying that man (mankind - all people) is required by God to repent (Acts 17:30) and acknowledge that he is weak and is a lost sinner who can't save himself and needs God's mercy to save him instead.

Acts 17:30 is to all the elect everywhere. God doesnt command the vessels of wrath whom He fits for destruction to repent, He wants them to continue in sin and add to their final wrath.

 

[ThatDumbChicken]

2 Peter 3:9

The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.

Please explain.

 

[Brightfame52]

2 Peter 3:9

The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.

Please explain.

Thats the elect, and has nothing to do with the natural man having a freewill to believe in Christ

 

[ThatDumbChicken]

If I try to replace "everyone" with "the elect" in my Bible, it makes a smudge.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

The natural man resist the preaching of the Gospel, he is at enmity against God with his natural mind, so what you expect. Stephen called them unregenerate men.

Your responses keep getting weaker and weaker. You need to give up your false doctrine already and accept the truth. The natural man is referenced in 1 Corinthians 2:14 and the context there is that the natural man can't understand the deeper things of God. The meat or solid food of His word. That does not include the gospel, which is a very simple and straightforward message. Even the carnal Christians that Paul rebuked in 1 Corinthians 3:1-3 believed the gospel, so your understanding of what someone is capable of doing with their natural mind is flawed. If they hear the truth and their lost state is revealed to them, then they must decide whether to repent and believe or not and nowhere does it say that anyone is not able to do that.

Tell me how it can be that unregenerate men are said to have no excuse for suppressing the truth in unrighteousness while not glorifying God and being thankful to Him, but somehow have an excuse for not repenting and believing, according to your doctrine. That excuse is that they are simply unable to do so.

Why does God condemn people for rejecting Christ (John 3:18) if, as you believe, they were unable to do so? In your view God gets angry with people and condemns them for no reason.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

God wants all the elect everywhere to be saved and they shall be saved.

LOL. You have no conscience about twisting scripture to make it say what you want it to say. All people everywhere does not equate to "all the elect everywhere". You should be ashamed of how you butcher scripture.