Amid surge in deportations, ethicist makes case for protecting undocumented immigrants

[Akita Suggagaki]

"The media narrative says that there is a 'migrant crisis,' and that migration is a problem and an issue to be solved … and that migrants are different from 'us,'" said Kuczewski. "In reality, they are a blessing. Is education and formation on this our highest duty? Can we use this as a teachable moment? Can we change hearts and minds?"

Amid surge in deportations, ethicist makes case for protecting undocumented immigrants

Kuczewski of Loyola University Chicago says it’s necessary to flip the narrative about immigration.

www.chausa.org

 

[rambot]

My extended family hid Jews from the Nazis in Amsterdam.

I would not HESITATE to do the same for these migrants.

A hotelier did it for Jesus and his family too.


Imagine having a neighbour who gets picked up and just disappears....and then thinking "Oh well".
What the heck?

 

[ozso]

All of a sudden deportation becomes a heinous Gestapo act, whereas it wasn't seen as such during the other administrations. As a matter of fact I remember the current administration being chided for not having deported as many as the previous administration, which = crocodile tears.

Also it sends out a clear message that when a certain party is in charge, border control and immigration laws go bye bye.

 

[ozso]

My extended family hid Jews from the Nazis in Amsterdam.

I wonder how they would feel about Jews currently being ostracized, harassed and abused on college campuses and elsewhere by the pro-Hamas left.

 

[rambot]

I wonder how they would feel about Jews currently being ostracized, harassed and abused on college campuses and elsewhere by the pro-Hamas left.

If they saw what the Israeli government was doing?

Not sure. But my mom and dad are more on gazas side.

They tend to support the oppressed.

 

[ozso]

If they saw what the Israeli government was doing?

Not sure. But my mom and dad are more on gazas side.

They tend to support the oppressed.

How does ostracizing, harassing and abusing American Jews accomplish supporting the oppressed?

 

[rambot]

How does ostracizing, harassing and abusing American Jews accomplish supporting the oppressed?

They wouldn't be doing that now. They'd be hiding El Salvadoreans guaranteed.

 

[ozso]

They wouldn't be doing that now. They'd be hiding El Salvadoreans guaranteed.

I didn't say they'd be doing it, I asked how you think they'd feel about it. But I get the desire to shift away from current others being oppressors and persecutors of Jews to being harborers of illegal aliens. Not that most who virtue signal about harboring illegal aliens would ever actually let them live in their house.

 

[Jermayn]

"The media narrative says that there is a 'migrant crisis,' and that migration is a problem and an issue to be solved … and that migrants are different from 'us,'" said Kuczewski. "In reality, they are a blessing. Is education and formation on this our highest duty? Can we use this as a teachable moment? Can we change hearts and minds?"

Amid surge in deportations, ethicist makes case for protecting undocumented immigrants

Kuczewski of Loyola University Chicago says it’s necessary to flip the narrative about immigration.

www.chausa.org

Illegal immigration is a touchy subject, and I am back and forth on mass deportations, however, we all have to admit that there are many aspects of our economy that can only handle so much.

 

[rambot]

I didn't say they'd be doing it, I asked how you think they'd feel about it. But I get the desire to shift away from current others being oppressors and persecutors of Jews to being harborers of illegal aliens.

You are also free to pretend that the illegal, unjust and misanthropic actions of the Israeli goverment plays absolutely ZERO role in this discussion....but in fact, it is the reason why I refused to answer that question.

Not that most who virtue signal about harboring illegal aliens would ever actually let them live in their house.

Ahh yes....the famous "virtue signal". Where people are meant to feel shame for talking about doing the right thing.

 

[ozso]

You are also free to pretend that the illegal, unjust and misanthropic actions of the Israeli goverment plays absolutely ZERO role in this discussion....but in fact, it is the reason why I refused to answer that question.


Ahh yes....the famous "virtue signal". Where people are meant to feel shame for talking about doing the right thing.

You're the one who brought up Jews, I just ran with it. And of course you didn't like where I was so easily able to take it.

The point is they talk about it going on and on about how compassionate and empathetic they are, and what a noble cause it is to harbor illegal aliens, but would never in a million years actually share their home with one.

 

[rambot]

You're the one who brought up Jews, I just ran with it. And of course you didn't like where I was so easily able to take it.

The point is they talk about it going on and on about how compassionate and empathetic they are, and what a noble cause it is to harbor illegal aliens, but would never in a million years actually share their home with one.

Why do you think that?
People have done so the WORLD over: Why do you think they would stop just because it's happenning in America?

You think people don't care enough about their friends to hide them if it came to it?

 

[ozso]

Why do you think that?
People have done so the WORLD over: Why do you think they would stop just because it's happenning in America?

In such situations, usually most people are all talk. Here's some examples of it being put to the test: click

You think people don't care enough about their friends to hide them if it came to it?

I doubt most of the proclaimers are friends with illegal aliens.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

It's not the job of medical ethicists and healthcare staff to act as "policy barriers" to policies they don't agree with.

The same gripe people have with "the bureaucracy" would apply here as well.

The institution of healthcare isn't a 4th branch of government that "checks" any of the other branches.

The healthcare staff and healthcare administrators are voters just like everyone else. They shouldn't be able to leverage elevated "perks of their job" to try to act as a bulwark against policy they don't like.

 

[wing2000]

It's not the job of medical ethicists and healthcare staff to act as "policy barriers" to policies they don't agree with.

The same gripe people have with "the bureaucracy" would apply here as well.

The institution of healthcare isn't a 4th branch of government that "checks" any of the other branches.

The healthcare staff and healthcare administrators are voters just like everyone else. They shouldn't be able to leverage elevated "perks of their job" to try to act as a bulwark against policy they don't like.

Really? that's your takeaway from an ethicist speaking at a Catholic Univeristy webinar?

"....according to medical ethicist Mark G. Kuczewski of Loyola University Chicago, who told attendees of an April 2 CHA webinar that amid these changes, it is important for Catholic health care facilities to remain a welcoming, safe environment for these immigrants and to take steps to protect and support them. He said that working within the law, they should ensure they have policies in place to keep enforcement officers out of spaces they legally may be stopped from entering. These facilities also should educate employees about how to welcome the stranger and teach immigrants how to protect themselves."

 

[rambot]

In such situations, usually most people are all talk. Here's some examples of it being put to the test: click

Randomly dropping strangers off at a door is one thing. Of course people did that too and people stepped up to do so. As I've mentioend, I wouldn't hesitate to do it for someone I knew.

I'm not sure if my wife would be keen. I have a student who was sexually assaulted. The perverts son started to harass the family; even led to them burning their van in the driveway. I BEGGED my wife to allow the kid to stay at our home because the parents were wanting to keep the kid safe from the threats.
She refused. I'm not happy about it but it's not only my house.

I doubt most of the proclaimers are friends with illegal aliens.

All I know is that they'd walk a 1000miles to fall down at MY door.

 

[ozso]

Randomly dropping strangers off at a door is one thing. Of course people did that too and people stepped up to do so. As I've mentioend, I wouldn't hesitate to do it for someone I knew.

I'm not sure if my wife would be keen. I have a student who was sexually assaulted. The perverts son started to harass the family; even led to them burning their van in the driveway. I BEGGED my wife to allow the kid to stay at our home because the parents were wanting to keep the kid safe from the threats.
She refused. I'm not happy about it but it's not only my house.

All I know is that they'd walk a 1000miles to fall down at MY door.

No they wouldn't because YOU don't have enough to offer them to make it worth their while.

 

[rambot]

No they wouldn't because YOU don't have enough to offer them to make it worth their while.

Yes I do. MY love! I mean, they seem really interested in it. THEY'RE the ones telling me that they would walk that far JUST to fall down at my door?

Clearly they're interested in me too.

 

[ozso]

Yes I do. MY love! I mean, they seem really interested in it. THEY'RE the ones telling me that they would walk that far JUST to fall down at my door?

Clearly they're interested in me too.

I thought you were talking about illegal aliens. Apparently you've gone off on some tangent.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Really? that's your takeaway from an ethicist speaking at a Catholic Univeristy webinar?

"....according to medical ethicist Mark G. Kuczewski of Loyola University Chicago, who told attendees of an April 2 CHA webinar that amid these changes, it is important for Catholic health care facilities to remain a welcoming, safe environment for these immigrants and to take steps to protect and support them. He said that working within the law, they should ensure they have policies in place to keep enforcement officers out of spaces they legally may be stopped from entering. These facilities also should educate employees about how to welcome the stranger and teach immigrants how to protect themselves."

They're encouraging healthcare institutions to make sure they have policies to keep law enforcement officers out, and wanting to educate employees on how to teach undocumented people how to "protect themselves" (which I'm assuming means "avoid detection", yes?)

The thing he's describing is an oxymoron.

"We're working within the law by helping people circumnavigate the parts of the law we disagree with"


Would that rationale fly for any other aspects of law & law enforcement with regards to policy initiatives and directives?

For example, if you voted for a particular leader specifically because of a certain policy initiative of, for instance, reducing and targeting weapons sales online. If a particular ISP declared their philosophical objection to that law, and started talking about how they're going to leverage their "elevated privileges" to help run cover for people in violation (like preemptively deleting logs, denying law enforcement access to servers, intentionally implementing weak record-keeping policies as to minimize paper trails to make LEO's jobs more difficult, etc...)

What would your reaction on that be?

To me, that's basically more of the "even if we lose, we win" ploys. Where one can attempt to negate election consequences by setting up artificial policy roadblocks. "We lost, but we're going to pull a bunch of special exclusive levers, that only we have access to, in order to make sure the winners can't do anything"