Is God eventually going to punish evil humans ?

[stevevw]

It is sometimes true that bad things happen to people who reject God, or who sin excessively, but we would surely be wrong to look at every bad thing that happens in the world and conclude that it happened because of some particular evil. I think of what Jesus said:

“1 ¶ There were present at that season some who told Him about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. 2 And Jesus answered and said to them, "Do you suppose that these Galileans were worse sinners than all [other] Galileans, because they suffered such things? 3 "I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish. 4 "Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all [other] men who dwelt in Jerusalem? 5 "I tell you, no; but unless you repent you will all likewise perish."” (Lu 13:1-5 NKJV)

That sort of implies that ultimately something bad will happen to everyone who doesn't repent. That we are all sinners and doomed to hell unless we repent.

But I also think the bible spoke of sin and its consequences. Not so much accidents. But evenso many accidents are the result of some sort bad situation. Not that it is always spiritual but more human neglect.

More broadly I think the idea that we reap what we sow is a truth. That also doen't mean that innocents cannot have bad stuff happen to them by others who have gone down a path that leads to destruction.

I also think the example of Sodom and Gahmorrah shows that God will not punish those who believe in Him. As God would not destroy S&G if there were even 1 innocent left. But I am pretty sure that He would save that innocent person and still destroy S&G as punisment for their sin and unrepentence.

So you could say they reaped what they sowed. Just like the Egyptians and the plagues. Or the Isrealites and the plagues after turning away from God. In some ways as society moves away from God it may be that some form of modern day plagues will come again. Even if thats Global warming and natural disasters, modern self created disease epidemics. social problems or world war.

Even if Gods people are harmed or killed as a consequence that is Gods will and these people did not themselves perish because of their own making. They will still be saved which is ultimately what counts.

 

[Robban]

And if so what's the wait for ? God could just snap his mighty fingers and boom all the evil people are erased out of existence I don't know why God simply won't do this.

A clue.

Psalms 73:16-17

 

[dlamberth]

And if so what's the wait for ? God could just snap his mighty fingers and boom all the evil people are erased out of existence I don't know why God simply won't do this.

That's the same as asking if God can erase Himself out of existence.

 

[Tinker Grey]

That's the same as asking if God can erase Himself out of existence.

How is it the same? He created the world by speaking it into existence. He can't undo creation just as easily?

 

[David Lamb]

How is it the same? He created the world by speaking it into existence. He can't undo creation just as easily?

But undoing His creation isn't the same as erasing Himself out of existence. God is not part of His creation - He didn't create Himself!

 

[Tinker Grey]

But undoing His creation isn't the same as erasing Himself out of existence. God is not part of His creation - He didn't create Himself!

And yet, that's what the person I responded to said. Hence the question.

 

[Occams Barber]

But undoing His creation isn't the same as erasing Himself out of existence. God is not part of His creation - He didn't create Himself!

Which brings up the fascinating question:

"Who, or what, created God?"

OB

 

[David Lamb]

Which brings up the fascinating question:

"Who, or what, created God?"

OB

If God Himself had to have a creator, then God would not be Almighty God - His "creator" would. The bible teaches that God is everlasting. For example:

“Before the mountains were brought forth, Or ever You had formed the earth and the world, Even from everlasting to everlasting, You [are] God.” (Ps 90:2 NKJV)

 

[MassimoTheChristian]

That's the same as asking if God can erase Himself out of existence.

How is that in any way similar why does God need evil so much unless he himself is evil ?

 

[David Lamb]

How is that in any way similar why does God need evil so much unless he himself is evil ?

Sorry, but who has suggested that God needs evil? I haven't seen any post where this is suggested. Indeed, God doesn't need anything outside of Himself.

 

[MassimoTheChristian]

Sorry, but who has suggested that God needs evil? I haven't seen any post where this is suggested. Indeed, God doesn't need anything outside of Himself.

Then why create humanity ?

 

[David Lamb]

Then why create humanity ?

God created humanity and everything else because it pleased Him to do so, not because He needed to.

 

[ViaCrucis]

And if so what's the wait for ? God could just snap his mighty fingers and boom all the evil people are erased out of existence I don't know why God simply won't do this.

From a theological/religious/biblical perspective the answer would be found in 2 Peter 3:9,

"The Lord is not slow to fulfill His promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance."

If the point were "punish the bad guys", then sure--just get it over with.
But if the point is heal, save, and bring all of creation into a state of restoration and goodness--then that's altogether different.

If I get angry and hit someone, sure a judge could just throw me in a cell and let me rot.
Or the judge could order me to go through anger management as part of a broader program of restoration and rehabilitation.

Which is a better outcome? Bad people get hurt? Or bad people stop being bad?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

Then why create humanity ?

Why is there something rather than nothing?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[stevil]

And if so what's the wait for ? God could just snap his mighty fingers and boom all the evil people are erased out of existence I don't know why God simply won't do this.

I know why god won't do this.
The same reason why god won't protect children from murderers and rapists.
The same reason why god won't protect believers from illnesses and misfortune
The same reason why god won't answer prayer

You may as well ponder why your pillow doesn't fluff its stuffing and boom all the evil people are erased out of existence
It makes no sense to get angry at your pillow for not protecting children or believers or for not granting wishes.
It makes no sense to get angry or disappointed in god. If you are angry or disappointed, then your expectation are set a little too high.

Lie down, relax, maybe a pillow will give your head a wonderful soft hug and you can get some well needed rest.

 

[Hugo B]

He won't, and He never did. It is in favour of evil humans that Jesus came into the world. He came specially for this kind of people, not for the righteous. The Ligh can only shine into the darkness, and, only a sinner needs a Saviour.

"He hath not dealt with us after our sins; nor rewarded us according to our iniquities." says His prophet David (Psalm 103)
He knows what we are made of, our frame. He knows that we did not choose to have sin in us. It came because of the devil.

If God punish the evil humans, why did Jesus came ? He prefered to be condemned, instead of man. He does not impute us our faults, nor incriminate us. It is the devil who constantly accuse man. And it is to destroy his works that the Son of God came into the world.

Hugo

 

[David Lamb]

He won't, and He never did. It is in favour of evil humans that Jesus came into the world. He came specially for this kind of people, not for the righteous. The Ligh can only shine into the darkness, and, only a sinner needs a Saviour.

"He hath not dealt with us after our sins; nor rewarded us according to our iniquities." says His prophet David (Psalm 103)
He knows what we are made of, our frame. He knows that we did not choose to have sin in us. It came because of the devil.

If God punish the evil humans, why did Jesus came ? He prefered to be condemned, instead of man. He does not impute us our faults, nor incriminate us. It is the devil who constantly accuse man. And it is to destroy his works that the Son of God came into the world.

Hugo

Yes you're right that we wouldn't need a Saviour if God did not forgive sinners. But does that mean that God causes all sinner to go free from punishment? No. The bible makes clear that it is those sinners who believe on the Lord Jesus Christ who are forgiven, saved. For example, Jesus said::

“"He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.” (Mr 16:16 NKJV)

And when the jailer at Philippi asked how to be saved, the apostles didn't say, "Don't worry, everyone will be saved anyway. God doesn't punish people's sins." No, they said:

“Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household."” (Ac 16:31 NKJV)

 

[Hugo B]

That is not what I said David. You're right, if someone does not want this fee gift of Christ, God won't force him. It is not His kind, but of the devil.

The keeper of the prison, who "heard Paul and Silas pray, and sing praises unto God" later "brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
"And they said [Paul and Silas], Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. [Acts 16]
There is nothing "to do". Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, believe in what you heard of Him.

How can someone be saved if he refuses the free gift of God ? Can a man save himself...? If someone does not like God's goodness, if he does not believe on that He is good, what does he have left ?
He'll strive to do his best to put the law into action, to be pleasant to God with his works, his capacities, but it will never be enough. Because "The Lord did not desire sacrifice and offering; mine ears hast thou opened [says His prophet David]: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required." (Psalm 40)

The only thing that is pleasant to Him, and the only thing that Jesus was looking for in man, is faith. This direct link, this intimacy, this channel of communication that it is, between the Lord and man, through Jesus-Christ.

Hugo

 

[David Lamb]

That is not what I said David. You're right, if someone does not want this fee gift of Christ, God won't force him. It is not His kind, but of the devil.

The keeper of the prison, who "heard Paul and Silas pray, and sing praises unto God" later "brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
"And they said [Paul and Silas], Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. [Acts 16]
There is nothing "to do". Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, believe in what you heard of Him.

How can someone be saved if he refuses the free gift of God ? Can a man save himself...? If someone does not like God's goodness, if he does not believe on that He is good, what does he have left ?
He'll strive to do his best to put the law into action, to be pleasant to God with his works, his capacities, but it will never be enough. Because "The Lord did not desire sacrifice and offering; mine ears hast thou opened [says His prophet David]: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required." (Psalm 40)

The only thing that is pleasant to Him, and the only thing that Jesus was looking for in man, is faith. This direct link, this intimacy, this channel of communication that it is, between the Lord and man, through Jesus-Christ.

Hugo

Sorry I misunderstood you Hugo. I thought your opening words ("He won't, and He never did.") were in answer to the question posed by the title of this thread: "Is God eventually going to punish evil humans?" It seemed to me that you were saying that God would never punish evil humans. Your subsequent post shows that you didn't mean that, so I apologise.

 

[Hugo B]

Sorry I misunderstood you Hugo. I thought your opening words ("He won't, and He never did.") were in answer to the question posed by the title of this thread: "Is God eventually going to punish evil humans?" It seemed to me that you were saying that God would never punish evil humans. Your subsequent post shows that you didn't mean that, so I apologise.

You don't have to David, because you did understand what I said. The Lord won't punish, and He never did. He is the same eternally. The same way, you never saw Jesus punish anyone, because he prefered to be punish Himself, in favour of the world. How can the One who save the world, punish it ?
If He does not impute us our faults, what is He punishing us for ? The law punish man, if he did bad, but the Lord do not. Punishment, accusation and condemnation are from the devil, and that is, among other things, what the Son of God detroyed on the cross in His death.
It is the non-faith, disbelief [that come from the devil], that punishes man, because it prevents him to profit of the free gift of God.

Hugo