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SC Senate Passes Bill Banning Affirmative Care For Minors

rjs330

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told you, the women I know don't care all that much. so I'm really not aware of what the women you know want. Yes, under some circumstances women want privacy, but in my understanding of it they want privacy from everybody, other women included, not just trans women.
I actually don't believe you. I don't think you have any idea what the women you know care about. Why don't you you take a survey of all of them and asked them if they would care if a bearded man came into their bathrooms. Ask them if they cared if a man went into thier locker room and got baked with them. Then ask them if it was okay if they did that with their daughters present.

They might want privacy from everyone, but they don't have privacy from everyone. Maybe someday all women's spaces will be completely private. But that's not happening any time soon.

Thats not the problem. The problem is what happens in the mean time.
What men's issues are we considering?
Men's access to women's spaces.
 
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BCP1928

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I actually don't believe you. I don't think you have any idea what the women you know care about. Why don't you you take a survey of all of them and asked them if they would care if a bearded man came into their bathrooms. Ask them if they cared if a man went into thier locker room and got baked with them. Then ask them if it was okay if they did that with their daughters present.
(Just as a funny side note, I hope you know what "get baked" usually means as slang) But no, we've talked about it--naturally, it's an issue.
Depending on his demeanor, they might run him off or just ignore it. But just seeing a man's "parts" is no harm to anyone.
They might want privacy from everyone, but they don't have privacy from everyone. Maybe someday all women's spaces will be completely private. But that's not happening any time soon.

Thats not the problem. The problem is what happens in the mean time.

Men's access to women's spaces.
Why is that different from women's access to men's spaces? Serious question, why is the situation not symmetrical?
 
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rjs330

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Just as a funny side note, I hope you know what "get baked" usually means as slang) But no, we've talked about it--naturally, it's an issue.
Depending on his demeanor, they might run him off or just ignore it. But just seeing a man's "parts" is no harm to anyone.
That's hilarious. I meant naked. I doubt very much if the women were okay with a dude in their locker rooms getting naked with them and their daughters. I guess with your attitude we might as well completely do away with any men's and women's spaces and all get naked together, shower together everything. After all it's no big deal.
Why is that different from women's access to men's spaces? Serious question, why is the situation not symmetrical?
Who said it wasn't. I know my wife wouldn't be happy with women coming into my locker room and getting naked. I wouldn't want that either. Or them getting naked with my son.
And we generally don't have to worry about a woman winning the sporting events against the boys and taking away their scholarships or injuring them in rhe ring or on the playing field because they are bigger and stronger. You know that's why they made women's sports right?
 
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Ana the Ist

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I was going to bring that up but you beat me to it. We weren't demanding that everyone say Merry Christmas or trying to force people to say it by law or policy.

It's a bit odd to see historical revisionism of days you were alive and can recall....isn't it? The closest thing that I can think of to "speech tyranny" that one could argue Christians were engaging in was wayyy back under Obama when gay marriage was decided upon by the SCOTUS and some Christians wanted their marriages to be called marriages....and the legal term for a gay marriage to be called a civil union.

It's not exactly the same sort of demand that trans activists make regarding pronouns....but it was an attempt at using a different term, legally, for gay marriages. I can recall that on that particular and brief issue...I was still on the side of free speech and equality (though legal terminology isn't really much of a free speech issue) and argued that gay marriage should legally be called marriage if indeed they were being granted all the same legal rights ad any other couple in a legally recognized marriage. This, of course, wasn't a demand upon the gay married couple and how they refer to themselves in their everyday lives....it was strictly a dispute over the appropriate legal term.

Nowadays, that dispute seems rather quaint and whimsical compared to the people who not only believe that they are making reasonable demands by insisting upon the control of names, and pronouns, and not merely on some legal certificate but from the mouths of everyone around them, every day, at all times....a demand so blatantly ridiculous that if I hadn't believed that they were suffering a mental illness before the concepts of "preferred pronouns" and "deadnames".....I almost certainly would be convinced this were mental illness

Even the people who genuinely believe it is both appropriate and polite to concede to demands if pronouns.....we're they to meet someone on the street who demands they be referred to as the "queen of England", they would ignore said person and move along.

And the queen of England is more of a social construct than merely a woman is.

t was that some places gad created policies to force their employees to say Happy Holidays instead of .Terry Christmas by threat of disciplinary actions. Removing free speech. Hmm.. sounds kind of familiar. The current iteration is quite a bit more prevalent and year around.

Historical revisionist propaganda is pretty central to their new ideology. How many have mentioned the 3/5ths compromise as an example of systemic racism baked into our constitution despite not understanding who supported the compromise and why?

Their new ideology ascribed tenets first....then seeks validation of those tenets afterwards....while rejecting any evidence contrary to those tenets.
 
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KCfromNC

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There are no attacks.
Which group is continually being called mentally ill, delusional, lying about biology, and so forth?

Heck, in this very thread using the exact same argument about LGBT people against religious believers was viewed as "contemptuous".
No. I don’t find your reasoning credible nor should it be taken seriously, sorry.
If only this feeling were backed by any sort of reason to believe it reflects reality.
 
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KCfromNC

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Should people have choices or no?

In some cases yes, in other cases no. For example, people can choose what flavor of ice cream to order. They can't choose to murder other people on a whim. Or to address the OP, in some GOP controlled states, choose to work with their doctor to figure out the best care for a particular issue if it goes against what the GOP wants to force people to do. Obviously the situation isn't black and white.

But back to the subject at hand, does a person self-identifying as something create a burden on others to go along with those feelings? And is the answer different if the something is religion vs. gender identity? Why should one be legally protected to the point of giving special privileges to ignore the law while affirming the other is, as mentioned in the OP, specifically legislated against.
 
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BCP1928

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That's hilarious. I meant naked. I doubt very much if the women were okay with a dude in their locker rooms getting naked with them and their daughters. I guess with your attitude we might as well completely do away with any men's and women's spaces and all get naked together, shower together everything. After all it's no big deal.
Yes, I realize that some people have been raised very fastidious about such things and should not be discomfited unreasonably. But yeah, how much we see of each other naked is purely cultural and occasional departure from custom is, as you say, no big deal.
Who said it wasn't. I know my wife wouldn't be happy with women coming into my locker room and getting naked. I wouldn't want that either. Or them getting naked with my son.
Sure, but unless there is lewd or predatory behavior, no actual harm is done.
And we generally don't have to worry about a woman winning the sporting events against the boys and taking away their scholarships or injuring them in rhe ring or on the playing field because they are bigger and stronger. You know that's why they made women's sports right?
That is a serious issue which involves sports officials and experts in sports medicine and is entirely beyond the competence of either of us.
 
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RileyG

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In some cases yes, in other cases no. For example, people can choose what flavor of ice cream to order. They can't choose to murder other people on a whim. Or to address the OP, in some GOP controlled states, choose to work with their doctor to figure out the best care for a particular issue if it goes against what the GOP wants to force people to do. Obviously the situation isn't black and white.

But back to the subject at hand, does a person self-identifying as something create a burden on others to go along with those feelings? And is the answer different if the something is religion vs. gender identity? Why should one be legally protected to the point of giving special privileges to ignore the law while affirming the other is, as mentioned in the OP, specifically legislated against.
Thank you for the clear answer.

No. Biological males do not belong in women only spaces. I don’t care if they identify as women or not, they’re still men.

It’s logical. It’s science.
 
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RileyG

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Which group is continually being called mentally ill, delusional, lying about biology, and so forth?

Heck, in this very thread using the exact same argument about LGBT people against religious believers was viewed as "contemptuous".

If only this feeling were backed by any sort of reason to believe it reflects reality.
That’s how I view the transgender issue. Being mentally I’ll is not an attack. It is what it is.
 
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BCP1928

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Thank you for the clear answer.

No. Biological males do not belong in women only spaces. I don’t care if they identify as women or not, they’re still men.

It’s logical. It’s science.
It's just custom. Custom is not necessarily either logical nor scientific. Sometimes it changes.
 
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RileyG

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It's just custom. Custom is not necessarily either logical nor scientific. Sometimes it changes.
Custom? It’s a custom for a man to identify as a woman? What?
 
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BCP1928

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Custom? It’s a custom for a man to identify as a woman? What?
It's been going on for centuries as far as we know, and probably for the whole of human existence. "Custom" is how we handle it as a society.
 
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RileyG

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It's been going on for centuries as far as we know, and probably for the whole of human existence. "Custom" is how we handle it as a society.
So? It’s still their choice. Their chromosomes and biology still says they are the sex they truly are.
 
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rjs330

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Nowadays, that dispute seems rather quaint and whimsical compared to the people who not only believe that they are making reasonable demands by insisting upon the control of names, and pronouns, and not merely on some legal certificate but from the mouths of everyone around them, every day, at all times....a demand so blatantly ridiculous that if I hadn't believed that they were suffering a mental illness before the concepts of "preferred pronouns" and "deadnames".....I almost certainly would be convinced this were mental illness
It's clearly a mental illness. So many do not want it to be called that. We've seen it on this thread. It's the only illness that I know of that requires everyone around you to act in certain ways or say certain things that affirm your illness in order for you to have better mental health. In essence everyone else is responsible for you mental health, not you.
we're they to meet someone on the street who demands they be referred to as the "queen of England", they would ignore said person and move along.

And the queen of England is more of a social construct than merely a woman is.
Yup, but some would say it's okay to call them that, because what harm does it do if they want it. Just be polite.
Their new ideology ascribed tenets first....then seeks validation of those tenets afterwards....while rejecting any evidence contrary to those tenets.
Absolutely. Let's just alter historical events and only use the parts we want to. While we're at it we'll tweet it to make it say something it doesn't. And ignore all evidence presented that contradicts. What gets me is they just keep saying the same things over and over again despite being shown the evidence. It's like they've never heard it.
 
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rjs330

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Which group is continually being called mentally ill, delusional, lying about biology, and so forth?
Since when is speaking truth and using biology and science an attack?

Are people who think they are the opposite sex mentally ill?
Biology us just biology. If you say its not are you not lying?
If only this feeling were backed by any sort of reason to believe it reflects reality.
That's precisely the point of this. People who are trans or support the gender ideology belive sonething that does not reflect reality. It's a faith based system.
 
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Ana the Ist

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Kids are not adults. We do our best to protect them from predators, but trans women are not any more likely to be pedophiles than the general population.

Actually they are.

I used to make the same point back in the day....because we didn't have any data on sexual orientation in the census and therefore the accusation that the lgbtq community was more inclined to sexually assault children wasn't backed up by any data.

However, now that we do have that data, research has been done showing that despite only making up less than 3% of the population.....they're guilty of about 20% of SA cases against minors.

Generally speaking, we're talking about a group that is multiple times more likely to sexually assault children than straight people.
 
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BCP1928

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Since when is speaking truth and using biology and science an attack?

Are people who think they are the opposite sex mentally ill?
Biology us just biology. If you say its not are you not lying?

That's precisely the point of this. People who are trans or support the gender ideology belive sonething that does not reflect reality. It's a faith based system.
No, just a linguistic convention. You want to gender people solely on the basis of their biology, OK, I'm sure you have your reasons, and that's the way we do it most of the time, anyway. But some people want to gender exceptional cases differently. I don't see any problem with it. I'm just choosing pronouns to use in the workplace or with a customer. I am not making any profound statement about the fundamental nature of man or woman.
 
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KCfromNC

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Since when is speaking truth and using biology and science an attack?

Are people who think they are the opposite sex mentally ill?
Biology us just biology. If you say its not are you not lying?

That's precisely the point of this. People who are trans or support the gender ideology belive sonething that does not reflect reality. It's a faith based system.
Just checking - the argument is that having an identity based on non-scientific beliefs is mental illness and delusion? And that it is perfectly fine to tell people that to their face?
 
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KCfromNC

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Thank you for the clear answer.
If only I'd get one in return.

Remember, the questions were
But back to the subject at hand, does a person self-identifying as something create a burden on others to go along with those feelings? And is the answer different if the something is religion vs. gender identity?
I can't help but feel those were sidestepped because they kinda undermine the whole train of thought.
 
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