What do you believe about January 6th?

[disciple Clint]

No



Yes.

At the time, the USCP was evacuating Members from the Chamber, which the mob was trying to enter from multiple doorways. USCP officers used furniture to barricade a set of glass doors separating the hallway and Speaker’s Lobby to try and stop the mob from entering the Speaker’s Lobby and the Chamber, and three officers positioned themselves between the doors and the mob. Members of the mob attempted to break through the doors by striking them and breaking the glass with their hands, flagpoles, helmets, and other objects. Eventually, the three USCP officers positioned outside the doors were forced to evacuate. As members of the mob continued to strike the glass doors, Ms. Babbitt attempted to climb through one of the doors where glass was broken out. An officer inside the Speaker’s Lobby fired one round from his service pistol, striking Ms. Babbitt in the left shoulder, causing her to fall back from the doorway and onto the floor. A USCP emergency response team, which had begun making its way into the hallway to try and subdue the mob, administered aid to Ms. Babbitt, who was transported to Washington Hospital Center, where she succumbed to her injuries.


Yes. As you can see from the account above Ms. Babbitt was attempting to enter an area that was being barricaded to prevent entry from a violent mob.





There is literally video of the event on social media.

I find it interesting that a 12 year old child playing with a toy gun is OK to gun down because the officer was "in fear for his life" and "had to make a split second decision" but a woman that is part of a violent mob breaking in to a restricted area of government is now some sort of innocent martyr.

Well let me make it simple, according to your own account you have 3 armed officers confronted by one unarmed woman, and one of them needs to use deadly force??? She presented about as much threat to three officers as a kitty cat in a cage with thee wolves. It was a bad shoot I can see that from all the evidence (most of which has been withheld). As for your 12 year old who modified to toy gun to make it look identical to a real gun and then made moves that any reasonable person would consider to be an indication of the intent to use that gun against the officer, you have no case but then that has already been proven in the legal system.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Well let me make it simple, according to your own account you have 3 armed officers confronted by one unarmed woman

and the rest of the mob outside the door.

 

[disciple Clint]

and the rest of the mob outside the door.

Well did the officer run out and shoot them? AT what point do people who object to police violence become people who endorse the police killing of an unarmed person. How many double standards is it possible to have, I am not directing this at you, but to all those, if you look at the posts there are several, who seem to think that this shooting was somehow justified.

 

[Vylo]

Out of your list of sixteen we have FOUR legitimate incidents of abuse of the use of force by police. I wasted my time doing researcher you should have done. Stop believing in a false narrative that is being pushed by people who are only trying to benefit themselves, if they were truly interested in saving black lives they would do something about black on black murders.

Daniel Shavier, On December 7, 2017, after a six-week trial, a jury acquitted Brailsford of all charges

Eric Garner No charges on officers

George Floyd, convicted

Breonna Taylor None of the officers involved in the raid have been charged in Taylor's death.

, Philando Castille, officer acquitted

Dante Wright Potter was charged by the Washington County Attorney's Office with second-degree manslaughter,

, Antiana Jefferson, Based on footage from Dean's body camera which captured the shooting, a warrant was issued for his arrest.

Tony Timpa Criminal charges against three officers were dropped in March 2019 and they returned to active duty.[25]

, Stephon Clark, On March 2, 2019, the Sacramento County district attorney announced that the Sacramento police officers who killed Clark would not be charged

Botham Jean, Over a year later, on October 1, 2019, Guyger was found guilty of murder.[6

Alton Sterling, The Department of Justice investigated but in May 2017 decided that it would not file criminal charges against the police officers.

Freddie Gray officers found not guilty

, Tamir Rice, pointed (toy) gun at police

Mario Arenales Gonzalez resisted arrest

, Stephen Dolceamore. White man who resisted arrest

And this is why people are protesting. These are all legitimate cases, but they get dismissed by folks. People will protest until justice is done. If you excuse murder by the police, it will cause the breakdown of society.

 

[disciple Clint]

And this is why people are protesting. These are all legitimate cases, but they get dismissed by folks. People will protest until justice is done. If you excuse murder by the police, it will cause the breakdown of society.

Go read those cases then form an intelligent decision.

 

[TLK Valentine]

So you have to change the circumstances to be able to even come close to justifying your position. Dont judge me you have not come even close to earning the right.

I don't need your permission to form an opinion... or to call out a double standard when I see one.

 

[Vylo]

Go read those cases then form an intelligent decision.

I have. They were murdered, and people shouldn't stop protesting until justice is rendered.

After the Chauvin verdict, one man said it best "the system doesn't work, we do". If it hadn't been for the attention the Floyd case got, Chauvin would have gotten away with executing a man in the street. He likely would have never been prosecuted. How many Chauvin's go free every day they shouldn't?

 

[disciple Clint]

I have. They were murdered, and people shouldn't stop protesting until justice is rendered.

After the Chauvin verdict, one man said it best "the system doesn't work, we do". If it hadn't been for the attention the Floyd case got, Chauvin would have gotten away with executing a man in the street. He likely would have never been prosecuted. How many Chauvin's go free every day they shouldn't?

Now we know they were not murdered, I just posted the list for you and listed which cases were not excessive use of force and the 4 out of the list of 16 that were excessive use of force. The facts speak for themselves why would you want to believe a lie?

 

[Vylo]

Now we know they were not murdered, I just posted the list for you and listed which cases were not excessive use of force and the 4 out of the list of 16 that were excessive use of force. The facts speak for themselves why would you want to believe a lie?

Just because you get away with murder and excessive force doesn't mean you didn't commit them.

 

[disciple Clint]

Just because you get away with murder and excessive force doesn't mean you didn't commit them.

OK but we are talking about cases that have been investigated determinations have been made based on the facts of each case. I agree there are some bad apples out there that have not yet been discovered but they will be. It is just not right to claim that people who have been investigated and found to be innocent are guilty. We have to be fair to everyone or we are being just as wrong as the people that abuse their authority. Agreed?

 

[Vylo]

OK but we are talking about cases that have been investigated determinations have been made based on the facts of each case. I agree there are some bad apples out there that have not yet been discovered but they will be. It is just not right to claim that people who have been investigated and found to be innocent are guilty. We have to be fair to everyone or we are being just as wrong as the people that abuse their authority. Agreed?

That's the thing, we aren't being fair. We are letting cops get away with murder. That is the whole reason for these protests. That's why people are angry and scared at police. They can murder people, on camera, and not only not get jail time, but in some cases get paid time off and money for "emotional distress, while all their victims get are dirt naps.

It isn't just a few bad apples, it is a LOT of them. My own police force had nearly half of it purged because they were selling drugs and framing people for crimes they didn't commit. It took over a decade before this happened. One of my coworkers worked for a police force so corrupt that not long after he bailed out (due to said corruption), the entire police force had to be disbanded. The police force that killed Floyd attend training that teaches them to kill people, they literally call it "killology".

Our police and justice system are horribly broken, and if don't repair them it will likely be catastrophic to our nation.

 

[Belk]

Well let me make it simple, according to your own account you have 3 armed officers confronted by one unarmed woman, and one of them needs to use deadly force??? She presented about as much threat to three officers as a kitty cat in a cage with thee wolves.

It is amazing how the rest of the violent mob attempting to break down the doors just magically disappeared in your account. Where did they go or is facing a violent mobs no longer a factor?

It was a bad shoot I can see that from all the evidence (most of which has been withheld).

So most of the evidence was withheld but you have enough information to hold an informed opinion on the shooting?

As for your 12 year old who modified to toy gun to make it look identical to a real gun and then made moves that any reasonable person would consider to be an indication of the intent to use that gun against the officer, you have no case but then that has already been proven in the legal system.

As I said. Shooting a twelve year old is justified but a woman breaking into a secured government building is a martyr.

QED

 

[essentialsaltes]

Well did the officer run out and shoot them?

No, they stayed where it was safe, behind a barricade that had become a defensive fortification separating them from the mob.

AT what point do people who object to police violence become people who endorse the police killing of an unarmed person.

It's not that hard. Is the perp coming at you, disobeying your instructions to stop? Or is the perp running away from you, disobeying your instructions to stop?

 

[essentialsaltes]

It is just not right to claim that people who have been investigated and found to be innocent are guilty.

Then why are you so bent out of shape over the Capitol Police officer whom prosecutors have declined to charge? [important nitpick, people are not found to be innocent -- they are not guilty.]

“Specifically, the investigation revealed no evidence to establish that, at the time the officer fired a single shot at Ms. Babbitt, the officer did not reasonably believe that it was necessary to do so in self-defense or in defense of the Members of Congress and others evacuating the House Chamber,” prosecutors said.

 

[DaisyDay]

Then why are you so bent out of shape over the Capitol Police officer whom prosecutors have declined to charge? [important nitpick, people are not found to be innocent -- they are not guilty.]

Additional nitpick: it is not that they are not guilty, but found to be not guilty, the difference being between actual and legal.

 

[Deviant Writer]

As I said. Shooting a twelve year old is justified but a woman breaking into a secured government building is a martyr. QED

Wrong acronym. I think you meant "MAGA."

 

[TLK Valentine]

Well did the officer run out and shoot them?

Did you want him to? Because an officer only carries so many rounds in his service revolver.

AT what point do people who object to police violence become people who endorse the police killing of an unarmed person.

How do you know the criminal was unarmed?

 

[Pommer]

Wrong acronym. I think you meant "MAGA."

The Aristocrats!

 

[ToddNotTodd]

Not at all, double standards are dishonest.

That doesn’t equate to whataboutism not being dishonest. But don’t worry, we all see it...

 

[disciple Clint]

It is amazing how the rest of the violent mob attempting to break down the doors just magically disappeared in your account. Where did they go or is facing a violent mobs no longer a factor?



So most of the evidence was withheld but you have enough information to hold an informed opinion on the shooting?



As I said. Shooting a twelve year old is justified but a woman breaking into a secured government building is a martyr.

QED

Why is it so difficult to separate the actions of the woman from the actions of the rest of the demonstrators. Your argument could be used to shoot anyone at random at a demonstration where some people have become violent and endanger lives. Is is ok to just pick out someone and kill them because they are representative of the acts of others? I would suggest that people are letting their hate for some groups of people influence their common sense.