Am I divorced?

[RCrihfield]

But what about the adultery Jesus spoke of? Are we to assume just as Jesus says we commit adultery today, it was also adultery in the days of Moses. So essentially, was adultery allowed then and now, and it does or does not hold the normal penalty when done in cases of remairrage? If so where does the bible back that up?

I'd love to agree it's ok to remarry without concern of hell, as I feel its a terrible penalty to have to live alone after a divorce, but the bible has to say thats a fact before can believe it.

Without sounding like asking what the word is means....a la Clinton...does the meaning of adultery imply the forsaking of the marriage? The Jews committed spiritual adultery (similar word) and that clearly implies forsaking God. Is that similar to physical adultery? Yes.

Consider Matt 5:32....if a man divorces his wife, save for fornication, he causes her to commit adultery. Commentaries assume Jesus means when she remarries, but that is not what the text says. If I divorce my wife because she is too fat then I cause her to commit adultery? I cause her to have sex with someone other than me? Not necessarily true. But I do force her to forsake the marriage. In that sense, everyone who is divorced is an adulterer...sex or no sex.

I hear you....how could God "permit" or "condone" a sin? It is hard to figure, yet there it is. If we view the Deut passage as a remedy for the sin (give her a paper and don't return to the marriage) it seems to fit in both passages. But if the remarriage (and the consequential sex) is sin, then you have God condoning sin in Deut.

That's problematic for me. It seems the woman at the well had been married and divorced 5 times. Now she was shacking up with someone not her husband. Go and sin no more. Fix it. And there in lies the controversy.

Wish I could be more difinitive.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Without sounding like asking what the word is means....a la Clinton...does the meaning of adultery imply the forsaking of the marriage? The Jews committed spiritual adultery (similar word) and that clearly implies forsaking God. Is that similar to physical adultery? Yes.

Consider Matt 5:32....if a man divorces his wife, save for fornication, he causes her to commit adultery. Commentaries assume Jesus means when she remarries, but that is not what the text says. If I divorce my wife because she is too fat then I cause her to commit adultery? I cause her to have sex with someone other than me? Not necessarily true. But I do force her to forsake the marriage. In that sense, everyone who is divorced is an adulterer...sex or no sex.

I hear you....how could God "permit" or "condone" a sin? It is hard to figure, yet there it is. If we view the Deut passage as a remedy for the sin (give her a paper and don't return to the marriage) it seems to fit in both passages. But if the remarriage (and the consequential sex) is sin, then you have God condoning sin in Deut.

That's problematic for me. It seems the woman at the well had been married and divorced 5 times. Now she was shacking up with someone not her husband. Go and sin no more. Fix it. And there in lies the controversy.

Wish I could be more difinitive.

No need to be more difinitive. I'm just glad someone else seems to realize it's an unsolved conundrum.

My heart tells me that God would not be so cruel as to expect one to live a life of loneliness because of a mistake that can happen to anyone. Meaning they can remarry and be fine. But I cannot prove that.

As it stands, we remarry, we commit adultery and if we live in a state of adultery as they most certianly will, the bible tells us we will go to hell. Right or wrong, that seems to be the consensus around here.

All I can hope for the remarried is that this type of adultery is no more a damnable sin now, than it was in he day of Moses.

 

[Tony B]

What about a person who is driven away from their spouse and forced to be the one to initiate the divorce because the marriage was unbearable? That person is not to blame, even if they're the one who took the "leaving" action. Are they then condemned to never find love or companionship again? That doesn't seem right to me.

Sometimes the person who is not at fault, is the one who "leaves".

God will treat every case on its merits NG.

In respect of adultery, there's no justification for that no matter what the circumstances. Adultery more often then not kills a marriage outright.

But as far as other reasons for separation are concerned, they don't necessarily translate automatically into a justifiable divorce.

There used to be a defacto clause "irreconcilable differences" often put as the justification for divorce. That claim was sufficient for the divorce to be approved by our judicial systems and even the church, but not necessarily by God.

 

[Tony B]

What is the point of "leaving" then, if you're still chained to the other person for the rest of your life? Never free to seek happiness, love, companionship, ever again? That doesn't seem just at all.

For your peace and safety NG. God can more easily bring that into your life when you are away from the battlefront. Also, it gives Him more clear space to work on the spouse as well.

 

[NerdGirl]

God will treat every case on its merits NG.

That's why this is such a stressful and anxious and even tormentful issue for many Christians. "Is God angry with me? Did I do the right thing? Am I condemned or cursed if I move on and love someone else?" Even if you feel peaceful in your heart about it, the judgement and condemnation and lack of sympathy from fellow believers can cast so much doubt and hurt.

 

[NerdGirl]

Hi NerdGirl,

It seems some people take comfort in being legalistic and living under the Law even though we are now under grace. I think some people are more comfortable living w/ definite rules because the responsibility of freedom is uncomfortable for them. Other people seem to get juiced condemning people. I don't understand either, but there are probably a dozen other reasons as well. Either way, we don't live under the Law, we live under grace and freedom. The law is instructional, but Acts 15:18-19 laid out the few things that gentiles were required to live under. The New Testament elaborates on how to live as a Christian and there are principles that we live by, one of the big ones being that we are to be dead to sin and love, but the theme is clear, salvation is through Christ, not the Law.

For what's it worth, I went through my own divorce after my wife's infidelity and her refusal to reconcile. This is what brought me comfort:

Philippians 2:12-13 "Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure. (Italics mine)." G-d does the work. We're just clay to be molded by him.

My situation was different than what you've written you've gone through. You've had a hard row to hoe, but with prayer and supplication G-d will show you a way through. He did for me.

I was alone for 5 years. For 2 years I just mourned till I asked G-d how to get through. He showed me what I needed to do. That took 3 years. Every relationship I tried to start in that 5 year period couldn't even get off the ground no matter how hard I tried because I wasn't ready. I did what he showed, and I asked G-d for a companion. It wasn't long after that she came along and we've been together for 15 years now.

I hope this helps. I can't tell you what your journey will be, but I've always found G-d to be faithful. I've been the one who holds things back through my own unbelief.

Thank you SO much for this post. It's a great comfort to me <3

 

[NerdGirl]

For your peace and safety NG. God can more easily bring that into your life when you are away from the battlefront. Also, it gives Him more clear space to work on the spouse as well.

You're right on these points. But if the left-behind spouse remains unwilling to change, then there is little "peace" to be found in being attached to that person for 30, 40, 50 years, both legally and spiritually. It's just an ongoing torment and it means the wronged party has no path to ever love or be married again, or find companionship in their later years. Again, that doesn't seem just to me.

 

[Tony B]

That's why this is such a stressful and anxious and even tormentful issue for many Christians. "Is God angry with me? Did I do the right thing? Am I condemned or cursed if I move on and love someone else?" Even if you feel peaceful in your heart about it, the judgement and condemnation and lack of sympathy from fellow believers can cast so much doubt and hurt.

.... which is why I wouldn't necessarily take anyone's opinion on an open forum such as this as being correct, or at least correct for every situation. It is better for Christians to find a fellowship they can belong to, which is overseen by a God fearing and loving couple. Such a couple will make an effort to get to know every individual in the flock they are caring for, and thus be able to make informed judgements and give appropriate advice.

 

[NerdGirl]

.... which is why I wouldn't necessarily take anyone's opinion on an open forum such as this as being correct, or at least correct for every situation. It is better for Christians to find a fellowship they can belong to, which is overseen by a God fearing and loving couple. Such a couple will make an effort to get to know every individual in the flock they are caring for, and thus be able to make informed judgements and give appropriate advice.

That's true. It is easier said than done, though. But you're right.

 

[Tony B]

You're right on these points. But if the left-behind spouse remains unwilling to change, then there is little "peace" to be found in being attached to that person for 30, 40, 50 years, both legally and spiritually. It's just an ongoing torment and it means the wronged party has no path to ever love or be married again, or find companionship in their later years. Again, that doesn't seem just to me.

This would be the sense of hopelessness that anyone in such a situation would feel if they didn't know or have trust in a loving, caring, God. But we do, and we can commit our ways to Him and rest in the knowledge that He will work things out, and bring the best possible solution about...firstly for anyone that has been unjustly treated, and then for everyone else caught up in the situation, according to His purposes.

Also, we ought to consider Abigail, and Nabal's outcome. That didn't happen just by chance. I'm not advocating that would happen in every similar case, but it might be good to help us feel less pressured by our own circumstances.

 

[Tony B]

That's true. It is easier said than done, though. But you're right.

Yes, it is easier said than done to find a fellowship and oversight you can trust in. I haven't found one, and I find it very grieving, and angering, that this is the case! But that is the case for me, and suits His purpose, but that doesn't mean that there isn't a fellowship nearby that fits for yourself and others' similar needs.

 

[NerdGirl]

This would be the sense of hopelessness that anyone in such a situation would feel if they didn't know or have trust in a loving, caring, God. But we do, and we can commit our ways to Him and rest in the knowledge that He will work things out, and bring the best possible solution about...firstly for anyone that has been unjustly treated, and then for everyone else caught up in the situation, according to His purposes.

Also, we ought to consider Abigail, and Nabal's outcome. That didn't happen just by chance. I'm not advocating that would happen in every similar case, but it might be good to help us feel less pressured by our own circumstances.

Thank you for the reassurance. I am terrible at getting stuck inside my own head.

 

[Ashley Amos]

So I was married. She cheated on me. I wanted to make it work but she didn't. After much turmoil I signed the papers but I didn't divorce her in my heart. I was not going to fight with her any longer. We have a son together. We do have a nice relationship with each other. Heres the thing. She remarried and that marriage is potentially failing. My question is...could it be that because I only divorced her on paper and not in my heart that she is in fact living in sin with the new guy? Is she still my wife in God's eyes?? Please help.

 

[aiki]

So I was married. She cheated on me. I wanted to make it work but she didn't. After much turmoil I signed the papers but I didn't divorce her in my heart. I was not going to fight with her any longer. We have a son together. We do have a nice relationship with each other. Heres the thing. She remarried and that marriage is potentially failing. My question is...could it be that because I only divorced her on paper and not in my heart that she is in fact living in sin with the new guy? Is she still my wife in God's eyes?? Please help.

A piece of paper and the state of your heart does not break the covenant you made to your wife before God to be her husband solely and permanently (you did make this covenant, I presume?). Your wife has been an adulteress the entire time she has been apart from you and married to another. You would be an adulterer also if you had done as she did and remarried. Scripture allows for divorce under the circumstance of adultery, but for no other reason, and indicates that to remarry after divorce is adultery. (Matthew 5:32; Matthew 19:9)

God hates divorce. To renege on one's marriage vows and divorce one's spouse is to be guilty of treachery, the Bible says:

Malachi 2:14-16
14 ....the LORD has been a witness between you and the wife of your youth, against whom you have dealt treacherously, though she is your companion and your wife by covenant.
15 "But not one has done so who has a remnant of the Spirit. And what did that one do while he was seeking a godly offspring? Take heed then to your spirit, and let no one deal treacherously against the wife of your youth.
16 "For I hate divorce," says the LORD, the God of Israel, "and him who covers his garment with wrong," says the LORD of hosts. "So take heed to your spirit, that you do not deal treacherously."

 

[NerdGirl]

Sigh.

 

[John Helpher]

Sigh.

Why?

 

[NerdGirl]

Why?

What I perceive as legalism, ignorance, and hardness of heart on this topic.

 

[Ashley Amos]

View attachment 292359

No she committed adultery and was divorced and then married another man. In the eyes of God she is an adulteress and you could not remarry her again. If she divorced you and did not remarry Then she could’ve been reconciled back to youWhich is what a divorced woman is expected to do is to reconcile back to her husband and remain unmarried while separated.

 

[aiki]

What I perceive as legalism, ignorance, and hardness of heart on this topic.

I am not at all concerned with your perceptions. What matters far, far more to me is the will of God expressed to me in His word.

 

[NerdGirl]

I am not at all concerned with your perceptions. What matters far, far more to me is the will of God expressed to me in His word.

I never said that you should be concerned with my perceptions.