The Flood - carried on from Eden Thread

[Stephen P]

No one knows for sure where it is located. Two similar theories presume that the Tree of Life might have been further concealed by changes in geography brought on by either

• Noah's Flood or
• Peleg's "division" [Genesis 10:25].

It is interesting to note that Adam & Eve were exiled to the east of Eden. If Noah grew up in the same neighborhood, his ark's landing on Mt. Ararat [modern Turkey] could give us a clue. (The Ark had neither power, nor a rudder, so it only drifted. )

YES!
Starting from there Ararat is on the Pangea continent (which is actually more reasonable considering global flood, closer to the "shore".)
Note: I acknowledge this is for those who believe the Flood was just for the Hebrews.
Noah - Wikipedia
I am going to persue the Global Flood for the moment, and see how far I go.

Noting that:
If we leave a bucket on an island in a pond at low tide, then come back the next day, it would not have risen and gone back to the same place, even if the waters rose completely vertically and subsided completely vertically, there is always imbalance due to levels of the land / sea floor underneath which will cause partial drainage to the side..

Noah should have been in the ocean .. I've always been peeved about that. God just gave the boat a push to keep it in one place, or did God, in just about everything He has done, use the natural World that He designed to do the work?
So if we are looking at the same Mt Ararat as the Bible, then it is a funny little blip on the Eastern side of modern Turkey.
According to Pangea, That blip was facing the ocean.
Heres the map with hashed ocean ... Mt Ararat-in Pangea03
Zoomed out Pangea ... Pangea - Flood03- Ararat

 

[DebbieJ]

I don't understand. Kindly elaborate.

 

[Stephen P]

So now to go backwards.
3. Ararat
2. Back to Flood wanderings??
1. Back to Presumably where Noah lived.

BUT FIRST - not anti Wiki but felt concerned by the commentary.
++++++++++
Genesis flood narrative - Wikipedia
The Flood story supposedly contradictory
"(40 days according to Genesis 7:17, 150 according to 7:24),"
GEN7v17 RMT: and the flood existed forty days upon the land, and the waters increased and lifted up the vessel, and she rose up from upon the land,
> describes the waters RISING.. In verse 17 God is filling the bath, and it took 40 days.
GEN7v24 RMT: and the waters overcame upon the land fifty and a hundred days,
> Describes God giving the pet Earth a bath for 150 days.
?? SO Is there an issue Wiki?

Again Just personal; but from Wiki:
"Other commentaries mention that seeing someone's nakedness could mean having sex with that person as quoted in Leviticus 18:7-8 and Leviticus 20:11. From this interpretation, it can be deduced that Ham was guilty of engaging in incest and raping Noah."
WHAT?!
(I normally use wiki because of the amount of people who would normally point out a mistake with a pointed bazooka, so I am surprised and dissapointed)
My thought..
The Bible interprets sex as knowing someone.
Ham Knew Noahs nakedness. Just like a husband knows his wife's nakedness.
It's not about sex its about privacy of body.
Ham Dishonoured his dads privacy.
At worst Ham was looking at Porn.

 

[Stephen P]

I don't understand. Kindly elaborate.

Hi Debbie
Sorry the original post I replied to and then moved to a new post, dissappeared, Ive now re-attached the comment my reply was to so hopefully it makes more sense..
Basically,
I pushed the discussion as Eden being Pangea, the full conglomeration of all the Continents,
and The Garden of Eden being what Humans believe is the Rift Valley - start of civilisation.
We then started to discuss what would have happened at the Flood time and since I also had some ideas on that, I moved the thread because the thread it was in was discussing Eden not Flood

 

[Sabertooth]

Note: I acknowledge this is for those who believe the Flood was just for the Hebrews.

There were no "Hebrews" [yet] during the Flood. The Hebrews were the descendants of Jacob [> Israel] who hadn't been born, yet.

 

[Stephen P]

There were no "Hebrews" [yet] during the Flood. The Hebrews were the descendants of Jacob [> Israel] who hadn't been born, yet.

Ai!
True..
The picture I linked is for the Hebrews, showing the World according to the Hebrews.
I wanted to address it because some internet comments have been that the Flood story was only for The Biblical peoples, not the whole world..
So I wanted to acknowledge that this may be true, but that I was presenting this example as Global, and so I'm happy if someone else posts a Flood - Bible only peoples version.

 

[Sabertooth]

I pushed the discussion as Eden being Pangea, the full conglomeration of all the Continents,
and The Garden of Eden being what Humans believe is the Rift Valley - start of civilisation.

Moved to Where is Eden?

 

[Stephen P]

Wow, moving the Thread this time was like standing on two canoes at the same time

 

[Sabertooth]

Moved to Where is Eden?

 

[Stephen P]

No Worries, but heres the map I posted in Where is Eden?
The Entire land surrounded by the purple lines (The rivers) was my proposed Land of Eden.
The rivers describes as going around, not through. There is only one river described inside Eden flowing to the head of the others.
"the one going around all the land of Kush"
Like I said in the post, Egypt thru Ethiopia, down to Mozambique.
That was my suggestion.
And BTW Happy for someone else to make a map and draw out what they think .. this is the whole idea.
I've put a card down on the table, time for someone else to put theirs down, and trump mine

 

[Stephen P]

I have a blog post about other interesting details gleaned about about Creation Week/Eden, etc.

Flash Points: Are There Two Conflicting ''Creation Stories'' in Genesis...?

CH2: Yes the parallel is there.. sort of like a summary, or also like teaching a child
"So the Little man was not happy was he?"
The Torah | BibleProject™
GEN1-12 is what God did and the Whole world.
GEN 13 Abraham's family
According to the Bible, Leviathan was specifically named as being created (Why?) - Crocodile(probably).
Note: interesting what you said about this "and no shrub of the field had yet appeared on the earth and no plant of the field had yet sprung up,"

GEN2:5 RMT: and all the shrubs of the field before existing in the land, and all the herbs of the field before springing up, given that YHWH the Elohiym did not make it precipitate upon the land and it was without a human to serve the ground,
Not a prob; According to science, Sea cells grew first then mosses etc in humid areas.
I Think of the classic graphic, a shallow river, Reeds and other plants - that split by root, not by seed, inhabit the sides of the river, but it is too dry for the interior lands. THAT video I keep quoting shows it all, including the first movements out of the water by Tictalic. a Crocodile..
----------0375 Million Years ago
39:00 First land plants = more oxygen
40:00 tiktalic fish that crawls out of the water to eat the plants

----------0360 Million Years ago
41:00 tictalic becomes tetrapods - crocodile one of the first land dwellers
41:25 All 4 legged vertebrates come from this. Dinasaurs, Birds, Mammals, Man.
41:53 Mosses ferns and first seed - totally enclosed system - instead of single celled water requiring spores.
42:57 Spread of plants further away from water sources and more Oxygen pumped out.
etc.

 

[Stephen P]

By the way these posts should be Eden Thread, not Flood
Sabertooth can you copy the posts across to the Eden thread please?
Thanks !

 

[Sabertooth]

Moved to Where is Eden?

 

[Stephen P]

So, Where was Noah?
## ONLY going off my theory at the moment.
Hmm.
GEN3v24 RMT: and he cast out the human, and the keruvs and the blazing one dwelt from the east to the garden of Eden, the sword overturning herself to safeguard the road of the tree of life,
No sign of East in the translation, however. The wording of this is keruvs and the blazing one came from the east to protect the Tree of Life.
The actual words, are more static and make more sense..
cast out at human dwell east at garden at keruv at blazing sword overturn safeguard road tree living.

That's better.. cast out at human dwell east
Go East, Adam!
at garden at keruv at blazing sword
at seems to mean almost like programming when I declare string_variable, int_number, int_anothernumber,
or childs verse: Look Flower, Look keruv!, Look Sword!
overturn safeguard road tree living.
This is what the three did.
The road was turned over ie like my example of burying the path under something, and protecting it with fire, e.g. the Aussie 6000 year old coal fire.

 

[Stephen P]

RMT: and Qayin went out from before the face of YHWH, and he settled in the land of Nod, eastward of Eden.
But thats the same a Adam.. Adam was cast out of Eden not East of Adam.
So am I right in that Qayin could have stood still and the Verse would STILL be correct as
I usually think of theis:

Eden.|---| Adam.|---| Qayin

But it could be:
Eden.|---| Adam
........|---| Qayin

 

[Sabertooth]

@Stephen P , FYI, Babel was about 650 miles south of Mt. Ararat.

 

[Stephen P]

@Stephen P , FYI, Babel was about 650 miles south of Mt. Ararat.

Thank you!
This is getting into the Flood, but at least this bit has not it's not fallen apart yet.
Going East towards Saudi IS a problem it was Tethys sea, and was (possibly) under water.
It rose due to the African continent having an submarine section of plate - just like New Zealand has today, in the video below, the plate looks like it went under the Mediterranean plate, and pushed it up out of the water..

1. The Fall and corruption of Nature (spitting on the ground) happened in between the Apple and the Eastern expel.
2. There are several different versions of the Supercontinents, not just Rhodinia, Pangea, and Gondwana. The map with the countries overlaid, I of course got off the internet and it does match most of the Pangea graphics I saw.

at 2:02 50 mil years Eocene Era.

 

[Stephen P]

Thank you!
This is getting into the Flood, but at least this bit has not it's not fallen apart yet.
Going East towards Saudi IS a problem it was Tethys sea, and was (possibly) under water.
It rose due to the African continent having an submarine section of plate - just like New Zealand has today, in the video below, the plate looks like it went under the Mediterranean plate, and pushed it up out of the water..

1. The Fall and corruption of Nature (spitting on the ground) happened in between the Apple and the Eastern expel.
2. There are several different versions of the Supercontinents, not just Rhodinia, Pangea, and Gondwana. The map with the countries overlaid, I of course got off the internet and it does match most of the Pangea graphics I saw.

at 2:02 50 mil years Eocene Era.

History of the World: Every Year
h ttps://w w w.youtube.com/watch?v=ymI5Uv5cGU4
version 2

Note that it starts with Egypt - but ONLY as a river bank nation.

"Human Population Through Time"
h ttps://w w w.youtube.com/watch?v=PUwmA3Q0_OE
BTW Interesting view on how much medicine has increased population; especially penicillin - or we'd be dying of a rose bush thorn.