Drinking a beer does not go against Bible

[Wunderlust]

This topic is a great example of how removed people are from reality because of modern inventions. Additionally, how people will make up weird bible stuff to fit their preconceived notions.

Grape juice was invited in the 19th century. Yes, grape juice was invented. It was created so that people could drink "wine" at communion without alcohol. During the 19th century, people discovered that if you heated food in an air tight container, it would prevent spoilage.

Prior to that, all grape juice was fermented. Yes, it was fermented unless you live in magic fairy land where food does not spoil. Apparently some people in this topic come from magical fairy land where grape juice existed in a world before modern food processing.

Jesus did not live in a time of freezers, or canning, or boiled air tight containers that prevented fermentation. Go buy some grapes and put them on your table. How long will it take before it rots? Not long.

Go buy some grapes, squeeze their juice into a jar. How long do you think it will last? Grapes are covered in yeast and within a few days your grape juice will look like it is boiling because it is quickly being fermented.

It amazes me that people think because they can go buy grape juice at the store, of course that's what people around the time of Christ could buy. No, they squeezed grapes and they started rotting in their containers. They only thing that stopped them from rotting was putting a lid on it, which kept out oxygen and created wine.

Jesus did not drink tap or bottled water. They drank water from rivers, lakes, wells, and others places that gave the people massive diarrhea. People discovered that if you mixed wine with water, you didn't poop blood the next day.

Most people during the time of Jesus were dirt poor. They ate nothing but bread every day. To prevent pooping out blood, they mixed wine with the untreated water they could find.

Jesus did not pick bread and water/wine randomly. That was actually all they survived on. The last supper, of bread and water/wine was what most people had every day back then. People didn't get drunk because there was no way they could afford it.

2000 years later gluttons ramble on about having a beer and how evil it is and totally ignore the massive health problems in their congregations from people over using food, because they are freaking obsessed about people having too much wine.

 

[Radrook]

The Bible doesn't condemn drinking of alcoholic beverages.
What it condemns is habitual drunkenness.


Ephesians 5:18 ESV
And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,

Proverbs 20:1 ESV
Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, and whoever is led astray by it is not wise.

Galatians 5:19-21 ESV
Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Proverbs 23:29-35 ESV
Who has woe? Who has sorrow? Who has strife? Who has complaining? Who has wounds without cause? Who has redness of eyes? Those who tarry long over wine; those who go to try mixed wine. Do not look at wine when it is red, when it sparkles in the cup and goes down smoothly. In the end it bites like a serpent and stings like an adder. Your eyes will see strange things, and your heart utter perverse things. ...

Luke 21:34 ESV
“But watch yourselves lest your hearts be weighed down with dissipation and drunkenness and cares of this life, and that day come upon you suddenly like a trap.

 

[roamer_1]

Jesus did not drink tap or bottled water. They drank water from rivers, lakes, wells, and others places that gave the people massive diarrhea. People discovered that if you mixed wine with water, you didn't poop blood the next day.

Ok, I was with you till right here: I drink water out of an artesian well, and I have been drinking out of creeks and rivers my whole life. My friend is a Cajun and drinks swamp water. You too have been influenced by modernity, but in the other direction.

Most people during the time of Jesus were dirt poor. They ate nothing but bread every day. To prevent pooping out blood, they mixed wine with the untreated water they could find.

Again, nonsense. These were an agrarian people - Unless there's drought, or some sort of blight, the one thing farming folks have is food. Traditional Hebrew diet is well known and included many fruits, vegetables, bird, goat and sheep meat. Even cattle and game. Utter nonsense.

And as to water, even the most infested water you can think of is easily remedied with boiling. Do you REALLY think they couldn't figure that out?

Jesus did not pick bread and water/wine randomly. That was actually all they survived on. The last supper, of bread and water/wine was what most people had every day back then. People didn't get drunk because there was no way they could afford it.

Again, ill informed. formal Hebrew meals began with a blessing of bread and wine, said to have come from the blessing of Melchizedek in the presence of Abraham.

Yeshua was teaching: The blessings they had been saying for centuries were about HIM. He is the VINE, and HE is the BREAD brought forth from the earth:

Blessed are you oh YHWH, Creator of the Universe, who brings forth bread from the earth

This is my body, broken for you...

Blessed are you oh YHWH, Creator of the universe, who brings forth fruit from the vine.

This is the covenant in my blood...

In conclusion, in general, I agree - Hebrews were in possession of beer, mead, wine, and even brandy (sort of) - In fact, for the Great Eighth Day, the culmination of Sukkot, and quite comparable to Thanksgiving on steroids, YHWH commanded the people to get out the firewater (best translated as brandy). He commanded them to party (All y'all REALLY don't know what you're missing).

But what you were saying here (that which I excepted) just isn't true.

The sin is in being a drunkard - that is not a single event, but rather, a state of being. An alcoholic, in modern parlance.

 

[Wunderlust]

In short, communion was wine/water and bread. Few were lucky enough to eat too much, or drink too much.

Ok, I was with you till right here: I drink water out of an artesian well, and I have been drinking out of creeks and rivers my whole life. My friend is a Cajun and drinks swamp water. You too have been influenced by modernity, but in the other direction.

Do you live in a walled city? Do you get your water from a well from a town of 20,000 people living in a quarter of a square mile? The rivers of the ancient world were heavily polluted with infectious agents.

Again, nonsense. These were an agrarian people - Unless there's drought, or some sort of blight, the one thing farming folks have is food. Traditional Hebrew diet is well known and included many fruits, vegetables, bird, goat and sheep meat. Even cattle and game. Utter nonsense.

No, starvation was a common pattern. Fruits and vegetables were actually a luxury. Fruits were only available during their limited season to a selected few. Vegetables were eaten by the poor living outside of cities and farms, or the rich who had the resources to raise them.

Wheat and barley produce bread, which is far more valuable than vegetables with their limited caloric content.

Again, ill informed. formal Hebrew meals began with a blessing of bread and wine, said to have come from the blessing of Melchizedek in the presence of Abraham.

But what you were saying here (that which I excepted) just isn't true.

The sin is in being a drunkard - that is not a single event, but rather, a state of being. An alcoholic, in modern parlance.

Sorry, I didn't realize you were doing the non-Jew pretending to be a Jewish Christian thing. Yes Yes yes.. your denomination's mixing of 19th Century protestantism with a handful of English Jewish converts makes you can expert on all things YHWH.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

In short, communion was wine/water and bread

Tell that to the Corinthians. They were drunk, and you don't get drunk on water with a little wine in it.

 

[Wunderlust]

Tell that to the Corinthians. They were drunk, and you don't get drunk on water with a little wine in it.

As I recall, some of the wealthy were having too much wine, while their congregants were not getting enough bread.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Alcohol cannot be removed by straining. At a guess, I would say that the "straining" Pliny refers to might actually refer to dilatation. It is possible to boil off some of the alcoholic content.

Whatever the method was, he believed he could reduce the intoxicating effects and considered it better.


...

 

[Linus]

Yes, drinking in moderation is ok and I drink a beer or two occasionally albeit when I truly contemplate about it, I think it might not be the right thing to do.

At least in Sweden, there are so many people struggling with alcoholism and drunkeness yet alcohol is so socially accepted. When you are on job conferences or celebrating something, alcohol is often involved. That might be tough for some people that are struggling with the drug.

If someone was addicted to e.g. mdma or cocaine, no one would deem it to be a good idea to use those particular drugs in company with an addict but when it comes to alcohol, it's perfectly fine.

Just because the government has said that alcohol is a drug that is ok to use and mdma or cocaine are not, it doesn't change the fact that if I drink alcohol it might cause problems for my neighbour.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

First of all, I never judge God.

I am not judging God. I am merely telling you who the true God is according to His Word.
Yet, others attempt to change who God is (that is not consistent with His Word and or God's morality or goodness).

Lets say a fellow brethren of yours is seen drunk walking down the streets. Chances are the whole congregation will know about it in no time. Can we say this person has lost any favors with the Lord. We dont know that. What we do know is that the congregation will probably believe that and most likely this person will have lost favors with them.

Yes, we do know it is true that if a believer dies as a drunkard, they will not inherit the Kingdom of God.

"Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God." (1 Corinthians 6:10).

But I agree with you, drinking is not really profitable. And its definitely better to abstain. I just dont like it if somebody makes a religion out of it and imposes that idea on others making it a stumbling block for people who otherwise might have joined.

Are you saying that a Christian does not have to give up their drunkenness and they can still be saved?

Its even hypocritical of some sorts to judge one sin openly while disregarding other sins completely, like obvious gluttony.

No. That is not true. Jesus focused on particular sins before, too. Jesus said if we one looks upon a woman in lust, their whole body could be cast into hell fire (Matthew 5:28-30).


...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Is it wrong to eat Pringles? Jesus didn't.

But pringles will not get you drunk and cause you to kill others accidentally with your car.
Pringles will not cause you to destroy your body in the same way that alcohol does (Which is far more extreme).
Pringles will not cause you to join a Pringles Anonymous Program.
Pringles will not cause you to hit your wife, or to kick your dog across the room.
Pringles will not cause you to wake up in some strange place (whereby you do not know how you got there).
Pringles will not cause you to get drunk and violate the many verses in Scripture that tell you to be sober.
Jesus did not drink wine because wine is not for kings (Proverbs 31:4).
We are to be like Jesus in behavior.
We are to conform to His image.
For we are also priests and kings (Revelation 1:6).
Priests and kings who give all glory, honor, and power unto our ultimate King Jesus.

...

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Well, you are free to abstain from wine and meat. Thats what I believe is biblical. Its good, but its not mandatory. The bible says that people who are weak in faith eat only vegetables, does that ring a bell?

Again, I am an Abstentionist; And I am not a Prohibitionist.

Yes, wine can make people into mockers and I am not going around doing some promotional work for it.

The Scriptures say "wine is a mocker." It does not say, "wino's are mockers." While it is true that drunkards can be mockers, the actual drink itself is a mocker because it is a substance that can influence you. In context to "wine is a mocker": A person is not a mocker without the wine. The wine (the substance) is what mocks (metaphorically speaking). It is a substance that mocks or laughs at you as it destroys your body and brain cells and makes you do stupid things.

I just dont see the bible speaking out against it as some people/churches do.

21 WARNINGS
That Speak Against The Alcoholic Beverage Itself.
(That is not specifically or exclusively talking about drunkenness)

Passages For the Old Testament Saint:

(Before the Cross: The OT Saint did not have a liberty in Christ to drink intoxicating beverages)
(Just as they did not have a liberty in Christ to eat unclean animals)​

1) Deuteronomy 29:5-6
- God gave no grape juice to Israel nor did they have intoxicating drink in the wilderness.
(The reason for this action was taken so as to show how they knew God).

2) Deuteronomy 32:33
- Enemy's wine is like the poison of serpents vs. Israelite's pure blood of the grape (verse 14).

3) 1 Samuel 1:14-15
- Accused, Hannah said she drank no wine.

4) Proverbs 4:17
- Alcoholic drink is called the wine of violence.

5) Proverbs 20:1
- Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging.

6) Proverbs 23:31
- God instructs not to look at intoxicating drinks.

7) Proverbs 23:32
- Alcoholic drinks bite like a serpent, sting like an adder.

8) Proverbs 23:35
- Alcohol makes the drinker insensitive to pain so he does not perceive it as a warning.
(It also says Alcohol is habit forming).

9) Proverbs 31:4-5
- Kings, Princes, and others who rule and judge must not drink alcohol. Alcohol perverts good judgment.

10) Ecclesiastes 2:3
- The king tried everything, including intoxicating drink, to see if it satisfied. It did not.
(c.f. Ecclesiastes 12:8)

11) Ecclesiastes 10:17
- A land is blessed when its leaders do not drink.

12) Isaiah 5:22
- There is a woe unto them who mix strong drinks.

13) Jeremiah 35:2-14
- The Rechabites drank no grape juice or intoxicating wine and were blessed.

14) Daniel 1:5-17
- Daniel refused the king’s intoxicating wine and was blessed for it along with his abstaining friends.

15) Hosea 4:11
- Intoxicating wine seduces the heart.

Passages For the New Testament Saint:

(After the Cross: NT Saints (Not All) have a liberty in Christ to drink alcohol soberly & privately)
(Just as they have a liberty in Christ to eat unclean animals)
(Those whose conscience condemns them in drinking are not to drink)
(Those who are leaders in the church are not to drink alcohol)​

16) Romans 14:21
- Do not do anything (Including drinking intoxicating beverages) to make your brother to stumble.

17) 1 Timothy 3:2-3
- Bishops (elders) are to be temperate, sober, and not near any wine.

18) 1 Timothy 3:8
- Deacons are to be worthy of respect and not drinkers.

19) 1 Timothy 3:11
- Deacons’ wives are to be temperate and sober.

20) Titus 1:7-8
- A bishop is not to be given to wine.

21) Titus 2:2-3
- The older men and older women of the church are to be temperate and not addicted to wine.


Source:
75 Bible References on Drinking Alcohol

Salomon said he subjected himself to wine and wisdom still ruled his mind.

Please show me what Scripture you are referring to (that makes you believe this).

Thank you.
And may God bless you.


...

 

[RDKirk]

This topic is a great example of how removed people are from reality because of modern inventions. Additionally, how people will make up weird bible stuff to fit their preconceived notions.

Grape juice was invited in the 19th century. Yes, grape juice was invented. It was created so that people could drink "wine" at communion without alcohol. During the 19th century, people discovered that if you heated food in an air tight container, it would prevent spoilage.

Well, no, grape juice wasn't invented. A process for keeping it consumable longer was invented. They had grape juice in ancient times, they just didn't have it for more than a few days after the grapes were pressed.

For sure, from the grape harvest in the fall season by the time of the Passover in the spring, the only thing they had was fermented wine.

 

[CaptainToad]

Again, I am an Abstentionist; And I am not a Prohibitionist.



The Scriptures say "wine is a mocker." It does not say, "wino's are mockers." While it is true that drunkards can be mockers, the actual drink itself is a mocker because it is a substance that can influence you. In context to "wine is a mocker": A person is not a mocker without the wine. The wine (the substance) is what mocks (metaphorically speaking). It is a substance that mocks or laughs at you as it destroys your body and brain cells and makes you do stupid things.

21 WARNINGS
That Speak Against7 The Alcoholic Beverage Itself.
(That is not specifically or exclusively talking about drunkenness)

Passages For the Old Testament Saint:

(Before the Cross: The OT Saint did not have a liberty in Christ to drink intoxicating beverages)
(Just as they did not have a liberty in Christ to eat unclean animals)​

1) Deuteronomy 29:5-6
- God gave no grape juice to Israel nor did they have intoxicating drink in the wilderness.
(The reason for this action was taken so as to show how they knew God).

2) Deuteronomy 32:33
- Enemy's wine is like the poison of serpents vs. Israelite's pure blood of the grape (verse 14).

3) 1 Samuel 1:14-15
- Accused, Hannah said she drank no wine.

4) Proverbs 4:17
- Alcoholic drink is called the wine of violence.

5) Proverbs 20:1
- Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging.

6) Proverbs 23:31
- God instructs not to look at intoxicating drinks.

7) Proverbs 23:32
- Alcoholic drinks bite like a serpent, sting like an adder.

8) Proverbs 23:35
- Alcohol makes the drinker insensitive to pain so he does not perceive it as a warning.
(It also says Alcohol is habit forming).

9) Proverbs 31:4-5
- Kings, Princes, and others who rule and judge must not drink alcohol. Alcohol perverts good judgment.

10) Ecclesiastes 2:3
- The king tried everything, including intoxicating drink, to see if it satisfied. It did not.
(c.f. Ecclesiastes 12:8)

11) Ecclesiastes 10:17
- A land is blessed when its leaders do not drink.

12) Isaiah 5:22
- There is a woe unto them who mix strong drinks.

13) Jeremiah 35:2-14
- The Rechabites drank no grape juice or intoxicating wine and were blessed.

14) Daniel 1:5-17
- Daniel refused the king’s intoxicating wine and was blessed for it along with his abstaining friends.

15) Hosea 4:11
- Intoxicating wine seduces the heart.

Passages For the New Testament Saint:

(After the Cross: NT Saints (Not All) have a liberty in Christ to drink alcohol soberly & privately)
(Just as they have a liberty in Christ to eat unclean animals)
(Those whose conscience condemns them in drinking are not to drink)
(Those who are leaders in the church are not to drink alcohol)​

16) Romans 14:21
- Do not do anything (Including drinking intoxicating beverages) to make your brother to stumble.

17) 1 Timothy 3:2-3
- Bishops (elders) are to be temperate, sober, and not near any wine.

18) 1 Timothy 3:8
- Deacons are to be worthy of respect and not drinkers.

19) 1 Timothy 3:11
- Deacons’ wives are to be temperate and sober.

20) Titus 1:7-8
- A bishop is not to be given to wine.

21) Titus 2:2-3
- The older men and older women of the church are to be temperate and not addicted to wine.


Source:
75 Bible References on Drinking Alcohol



Please show me what Scripture you are referring to (that makes you believe this).

Thank you.
And may God bless you.


...

So much stuff to comment on and I am pretty bad at quoting and worse remembering bible passages by heart, there is simply too many of them.

Salomon-ecclesiastes 2
In regard to Daniel he abstained from meat and wine durings his fasting, logically he would eat meat and drink wine after that otherwise it would be pointless to mention it.

The israelites did have vineyards, what happened or not happened in the wilderness stayed in the wilderness and was therefore temporary.

Wheb samsons mother was pregnant she was given a warning not to drink wine during pregnancy, logucally wine must have been around and people must have been prone to consume it. Otherwise, if the israelites did not consume wine why his special warning?

Deuterinomy 14 says to buy wine and strong drink if one was so inclined - it was a special fest occasion, though.

In the nt paul speaks about the wrong way of having supper, meaning some people brought their own supper with them, the result was some people were hungry and others got drunk. A logical consequence of people not sharing with each other. So, if people got drunk during supper, because they did not share the wine, it was apparently ok to bring wine along and not mere grape juice as some would imply. Why didnt Paul comment on alcoholic wine during supper? I guess it was probably not ok to get drunk and it was meant to be shared but if alcohol was so bad why didnt he make it clear?

Another thing, God laid out so many rules in the OT, sometimes very detailed and unmistaken, yet He never mentions something like prohibition. If He did, we probably wouldnt be havibg this conversion right now. Of course winr can be dangerous. In the OT if a child was refusing to work and drinking to much wine, the parents were to drag him out of town and kill him, as an example for other people. A rather drastic measure that shows how dangerous wine can be. However, God never mentioned prohibition. He does not say kill the persob who sold him the wine, rather kill the consumer who just drinks and never works.

Kung David was giving thanks and praises in one of his psalms for the wine that cherishes mens hearts. Wonder if that was grape jice☺

 

[Major1]

There is nothing in the Bible that says you can't drink in moderation. Being raised Adventist I was taught different. Now that I am ex SDA, I have done a lot of research on the matter and the bible does not prohibit drinking in moderation. For those of you interested in alcohol but afraid you will burn in a lake of fire for drinking, never fear because now its ok.

I know what you are saying. There is no "Thou shalt not drink" neither is there any "Thou shalt not smoke tobacco".

However, God did give us all a brain to think and reason with and we all know that these vices can be harmfull to your health. No one ever drinks one beer. Then when he runs out, he will always get into his car and drive to the store for more and there is the problem. Driving a car under the influence of alcohol has and will lead to death of the drinker or the children in another car.

There is also the Scriptures that tell us "Our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit".

 

[Dave-W]

I'm saying he did not drink earthly wine with alcohol in it made by men.

So what did HE drink at the last supper?

 

[Major1]

Ok, I was with you till right here: I drink water out of an artesian well, and I have been drinking out of creeks and rivers my whole life. My friend is a Cajun and drinks swamp water. You too have been influenced by modernity, but in the other direction.



Again, nonsense. These were an agrarian people - Unless there's drought, or some sort of blight, the one thing farming folks have is food. Traditional Hebrew diet is well known and included many fruits, vegetables, bird, goat and sheep meat. Even cattle and game. Utter nonsense.

And as to water, even the most infested water you can think of is easily remedied with boiling. Do you REALLY think they couldn't figure that out?



Again, ill informed. formal Hebrew meals began with a blessing of bread and wine, said to have come from the blessing of Melchizedek in the presence of Abraham.

Yeshua was teaching: The blessings they had been saying for centuries were about HIM. He is the VINE, and HE is the BREAD brought forth from the earth:

Blessed are you oh YHWH, Creator of the Universe, who brings forth bread from the earth

This is my body, broken for you...

Blessed are you oh YHWH, Creator of the universe, who brings forth fruit from the vine.

This is the covenant in my blood...

In conclusion, in general, I agree - Hebrews were in possession of beer, mead, wine, and even brandy (sort of) - In fact, for the Great Eighth Day, the culmination of Sukkot, and quite comparable to Thanksgiving on steroids, YHWH commanded the people to get out the firewater (best translated as brandy). He commanded them to party (All y'all REALLY don't know what you're missing).

But what you were saying here (that which I excepted) just isn't true.

The sin is in being a drunkard - that is not a single event, but rather, a state of being. An alcoholic, in modern parlance.

In the military they teach you that There is a reason why a latrine is dug "down stream". IF you are drinking water from streams and rivers and such, you better live close enough to a doctor because you are going to need one sooner or later.

 

[RDKirk]

Ok, I was with you till right here: I drink water out of an artesian well, and I have been drinking out of creeks and rivers my whole life. My friend is a Cajun and drinks swamp water. You too have been influenced by modernity, but in the other direction.

When I was stationed in the Philippines and living "in the 'ville" we were warned up front not to drink the tapwater. It didn't take much warning: If you poured a glass of tapwater and let it sit for a few minutes, it separated itself out to a cottony foam at the bottom, some clearish water in the middle, and a scum on top. If you scraped off the scum, it reformed in another few minutes.

That was the untreated water pulled directly from the local town stream--into which the city sewage also ran. But not long after I got there, I was invited to a meal by a local contact. He served me water and noted that I didn't touch it. Then he said, "You can drink this water. It comes from the well I just had drilled behind my house!" I suspect he'd invited me to dinner for the specific purpose of showing off his new well.

So if you tell me you drink water out of an artesian well, I'm going to say, "Well! No wonder!" And to the same extent, that swamp water isn't city sewage run-off.

Streams in and around middle eastern cities were very likely to contain the downstream run-off of upstream usage by humans and animals. Where the Romans had built aquaducts, there was less of a problem (although the aquaduct system didn't seem beneficial in the Jewish quarter of Rome).

Again, nonsense. These were an agrarian people - Unless there's drought, or some sort of blight, the one thing farming folks have is food. Traditional Hebrew diet is well known and included many fruits, vegetables, bird, goat and sheep meat. Even cattle and game. Utter nonsense.

Not everyone farmed. The estimated population of Jerusalem during the early 1st century was 600,000 to 1,000,000 people (although I suspect 1,000,000 is optimistic). Those were mostly purely city dwellers and didn't have farm products unless they bought them, and bread was the cheapest thing to buy. This was particularly true of the poor, who were poor because they had no land.

And as to water, even the most infested water you can think of is easily remedied with boiling. Do you REALLY think they couldn't figure that out?

Yep. They did know that keeping food hot tended to keep it from becoming inedible and they also understood that cutting water with wine made water potable, but understanding the benefit of boiling per se required an understanding of microorganisms.

 

[CaptainToad]

I know what you are saying. There is no "Thou shalt not drink" neither is there any "Thou shalt not smoke tobacco".

However, God did give us all a brain to think and reason with and we all know that these vices can be harmfull to your health. No one ever drinks one beer. Then when he runs out, he will always get into his car and drive to the store for more and there is the problem. Driving a car under the influence of alcohol has and will lead to death of the drinker or the children in another car.

There is also the Scriptures that tell us "Our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit".

Always? I dont!

There is fine in my country. Its about 2000$.
3 years without driving license.
Threshhold is 0.2

Well, certainly doesnt pay

 

[Bible Highlighter]

So much stuff to comment on and I am pretty bad at quoting and worse remembering bible passages by heart, there is simply too many of them.

The more you are in God's Word and requote the same Scripture to others, the more it will become easier for you to quote Scripture by heart. Repetition is the mother of all learning (As I am sure you are aware of). I have many verses engraved on my heart that I just love to quote. It is my prayer and hope you will one day be able to do the same, my friend.

Salomon

You mean, Solomon, right?

-ecclesiastes 2

And what is the conclusion of this matter in Ecclesiastes 2?

"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man."
(Ecclesiastes 12:13).

In regard to Daniel he abstained from meat and wine durings his fasting, logically he would eat meat and drink wine after that otherwise it would be pointless to mention it.

Please show the exact verses that makes you believe this way.

The israelites did have vineyards, what happened or not happened in the wilderness stayed in the wilderness and was therefore temporary.

The Israelites (the parents and not the children, Moses, Joshua, and Caleb) had died in the wilderness (the dessert). Those who died in the wilderness did not have their hearts right with God. That is why they perished in the wilderness and they could not enter the promised land.
Which Israelites? The ones in the wilderness? Or the Israelites in the Promised land?

Wheb samsons mother was pregnant she was given a warning not to drink wine during pregnancy, logucally wine must have been around and people must have been prone to consume it. Otherwise, if the israelites did not consume wine why his special warning?

If you were to look up the word wine in the dictionary, you would find that it says this,

3. the juice, fermented or unfermented, of various other fruits or plants,

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/wine

Deuterinomy 14 says to buy wine and strong drink if one was so inclined - it was a special fest occasion, though.

No. If you were to read the context, the goods were for a part of the ceremony in their offerings to God.

And thou shalt eat before the LORD thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the LORD thy God always. (Deuteronomy 14:23).

Believers who are in support of drinking usually do not address God's Word that talks directly against alcohol (Deuteronomy 32:33, 1 Samuel 1:14-15, Proverbs 4:17, Proverbs 20:1, Proverbs 23:31-32, Proverbs 31:4-5, 1 Timothy 3:2-3) while glorifying Deuteronomy 14:26 which is an isolated obscure verse that mentions wine and strong drink in passing. This verse has become esteemed of those seeking to justify that all believers can drink or consider alcohol as God's gift to man.

Besides, it says in Deuteronomy 29:6 that the Israelites did not drink wine. This is how they KNEW the Lord. If they did drink wine, then it would undermine this verse.

In the nt paul speaks about the wrong way of having supper, meaning some people brought their own supper with them, the result was some people were hungry and others got drunk. A logical consequence of people not sharing with each other. So, if people got drunk during supper, because they did not share the wine, it was apparently ok to bring wine along and not mere grape juice as some would imply. Why didnt Paul comment on alcoholic wine during supper? I guess it was probably not ok to get drunk and it was meant to be shared but if alcohol was so bad why didnt he make it clear?

If they were drunk, then Paul would have ordered a cease and desist order. The word "drunken" in 1 Corinthians 11:21 is merely in reference to one having being satiated by a beverage that was not high in alcoholic content. It is not talking about drinking or drunkenness. Or do you think Luke 17:8 is talking about drinking or in being drunk, too?

Another thing, God laid out so many rules in the OT, sometimes very detailed and unmistaken, yet He never mentions something like prohibition. If He did, we probably wouldnt be havibg this conversion right now. Of course winr can be dangerous. In the OT if a child was refusing to work and drinking to much wine, the parents were to drag him out of town and kill him, as an example for other people. A rather drastic measure that shows how dangerous wine can be. However, God never mentioned prohibition. He does not say kill the persob who sold him the wine, rather kill the consumer who just drinks and never works.

Prohibitionism (i.e. the forbidding of strong alcoholic beverages) was the view of the saint under the Old Testament.
Abstentionism is the view of the saint who is under the New Testament.
I have provided verses for you to look at in my previous post.
It is up to you if you want to believe them or not.

Kung David

You mean, King David, right?

Kung David was giving thanks and praises in one of his psalms for the wine that cherishes mens hearts. Wonder if that was grape jice

Again, there are two different kinds of wines (yayin) in the Bible.
This is the yayin (wine) that is not overly intoxicating. It is a wine that makes men's hearts glad because it is very low in alcohol content (but it is not enough to get one to be drunk off it like the wine of today).
However, the yayin (wine) in Proverbs 23:31 says we are not to look upon it even. Meaning it is bad.


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[Bible Highlighter]

So what did HE drink at the last supper?

It was unfermented wine (i.e. wine that had not undergone the fermentation process whereby it is highly alcoholic). For wine is referred to as either unfermented or fermented.

See definition 3 here at Dictionary.com

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/wine


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