Blasphemy... the Christian I-Win button?

[Freodin]

You've agreed to the SoP to be able to post here. If you didn't like the SoP, you could have simply posted elsewhere. Now you are not being a person of your word.

I explicitly stated within my admission post that I agreed to the given rules with certain limits - limits that I would explain in a further post. I was admitted based on that post. I stand to my word exactly as it was given.

I do not object the blasphemy rule per se. I agree with AV that a forum as big and varied as this one needs some kind of moderation, even censorship.
But clearly some of these rules prefer one side over the other, even contrary to their stated intent. They are too vague to give any guideline for "informed debate". Blasphemy - on this forum and in the real world - is one of these rules.

When you get accused of anything serious, you think it only fair to have the means to defend yourself. Even more, we consider it highly injust to be condemned for something without these means.

Why would Christianity especially go against such a concept?

 

[jimmyjimmy]

I explicitly stated within my admission post that I agreed to the given rules with certain limits - limits that I would explain in a further post. I was admitted based on that post. I stand to my word exactly as it was given.

I do not object the blasphemy rule per se. I agree with AV that a forum as big and varied as this one needs some kind of moderation, even censorship.
But clearly some of these rules prefer one side over the other, even contrary to their stated intent. They are too vague to give any guideline for "informed debate". Blasphemy - on this forum and in the real world - is one of these rules.

When you get accused of anything serious, you think it only fair to have the means to defend yourself. Even more, we consider it highly injust to be condemned for something without these means.

Why would Christianity especially go against such a concept?

This is a private Christian website. This is not a court of law. None of us have rights here. We are allowed to post here if we would like to.

Interact or don't, but this thread is already getting annoying to the point that I need to go and read my sig.

 

[Freodin]

This is a private Christian website. This is not a court of law. None of us have rights here. We are allowed to post here if we would like to.

Interact or don't, but this thread is already getting annoying to the point that I need to go and read my sig.

Yes, this is a private website. No one of us has rights here. I already said so much, repeatedly.

But as you said: it is a christian website. Is Christianity meant to be a system where those who have power rule over a mass without rights?

 

[Freodin]

It's been removed.

Did you remove it? If so, then thanks, I guess.

But if a mod removed it: well, even if the people here don't get it, this is exactly what I am talking about.

I don't want it removed! Even if I was insulted by such a post - and I am not, I know AV long enough not to be bothered by him - it is only my opinion. And my opinion shouldn't be enough to shut someone else up!

And this is only the general "be nice" rule. With blasphemy, there isn't even a need for an insult.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Yes, this is a private website. No one of us has rights here. I already said so much, repeatedly.

But as you said: it is a christian website. Is Christianity meant to be a system where those who have power rule over a mass without rights?

Ignored.

 

[AV1611VET]

Did you remove it?

Yes.

If so, then thanks, I guess.

You're welcome, I guess.

 

[anonymous person]

But as you said: it is a christian website. Is Christianity meant to be a system where those who have power rule over a mass without rights?

Seems you have in your mind a conceptualization of how this forum should be run if it was run in a Christian fashion. Seems you think it is not run this way.

How should this forum be run according to your conceptualization and why is your conceptualization "Christian"?

 

[AV1611VET]

Seems you have in your mind a conceptualization of how this forum should be run if it was run in a Christian fashion. Seems you think it is not run this way.

How should this forum be run according to your conceptualization and why is your conceptualization "Christian"?

Mabe he wants to make posts like this, without having to explain himself?

 

[Freodin]

Seems you have in your mind a conceptualization of how this forum should be run if it was run in a Christian fashion. Seems you think it is not run this way.

How should this forum be run according to your conceptualization and why is your conceptualization "Christian"?

Good question. Difficult question, one that I do not have a perfect answer for. Let's just say: there are different ways to deal with "rudeness", and there could be some more desirable results from implementing such different ways.

Why is it "Christian"? Well, you could find several examples from the Bible, for both sides, of how to deal with insults against a person or a dearly held idea.
But there is one specific example of a figure from the Bible, who was tried to be silenced by the authorities on the accusation of blasphemy. Considering this very "christian" example, I'd say Christianity should be very reluctant to claim such a weapon for itself.

 

[Freodin]

Mabe he wants to make posts like this, without having to explain himself?

To give the perfect fitting response to that: "That's a strawman that [I did] not claim."

You might have noticed that I repeatedly asked in this thread here for a means to defend yourself against accusations... that means, being able to explain yourself.

And you might also have noticed that I did explain myself in the thread you linked to, just a few posts below.

 

[anonymous person]

Good question. Difficult question, one that I do not have a perfect answer for. Let's just say: there are different ways to deal with "rudeness", and there could be some more desirable results from implementing such different ways.

Why is it "Christian"? Well, you could find several examples from the Bible, for both sides, of how to deal with insults against a person or a dearly held idea.
But there is one specific example of a figure from the Bible, who was tried to be silenced by the authorities on the accusation of blasphemy. Considering this very "christian" example, I'd say Christianity should be very reluctant to claim such a weapon for itself.

Ahhh....

Jesus was mistreated by the religious elite and you feel like you are being mistreated by the religious elite here is that about it?

Tell me, what are you prohibited from saying that you think you should not be prohibited from saying?

 

[Freodin]

Ahhh....

Jesus was mistreated by the religious elite and you feel like you are being mistreated by the religious elite here is that about it?

No, that is not what it is about. But I don't think you can or even want to understand it.

Tell me, what are you prohibited from saying that you think you should not be prohibited from saying?

Nitpicking, are you? Just reread the thread and consider the concept of blasphemy.

 

[AV1611VET]

And you might also have noticed that I did explain myself in the thread you linked to, just a few posts below.

Okay ... so you explained it.

What do you want?

A medal?

Please go back and read what I asked.

I asked, maybe you want to make posts like that without having to explain it.

 

[Freodin]

Please go back and read what I asked.

Ok. So what did you ask?

I asked, maybe you want to make posts like that without having to explain it.

Short answer: no.

Long answer: maybe you want to round up atheists, shoot them with blessed bullets, burn their remains, thrown their ashes into the wind and then do a little victory dance?

No, you don't want to do that? You have never even given a hint that you might want to do that? There is no reason for me to assume that you would want to do that? Your previous actions and statements already indicate that you don't want to do that?

Hey, I am just asking questions! I am not implying anything, no Sir! Asking questions is perfectly fine, isn't it?


So why were you asking me your question?

 

[juvenissun]

When we signed up for this sub-forum, we agreed to a set of rules, one of them being the rule about blasphemy.

You challenge Christianity in this forum means that you think there is something wrong with the doctrine. However, what you do not want to do in this challenge is to insult the Christian God.

"The story of Jesus is a fairy tale." This is an insult.
"The story of Jesus is a fairy tale, because .... (there is no evidence) ...". This is an argument.

Make you feel better?
The responsibility of explaining any argument against the Christian God and the Christianity is on YOU!

 

[AV1611VET]

So why were you asking me your question?

What question?

 

[Freodin]

What question?

(I have a bad feeling about that)

"Mabe he wants to make posts like this, without having to explain himself?"

 

[Freodin]

You challenge Christianity in this forum means that you think there is something wrong with the doctrine. However, what you do not want to do in this challenge is to insult the Christian God.

Nicely phrased.

"The story of Jesus is a fairy tale." This is an insult.
"The story of Jesus is a fairy tale, because .... (there is no evidence) ...". This is an argument.

And that is the problem. Is the first an insult... or is it just a claim? Is the second an argument, or is it an nicely wrapped insult?

That completely depends on the one making the judgement.

Make you feel better?
The responsibility of explaining any argument against the Christian God and the Christianity is on YOU!

Hm. I thought that maybe I had been to vague in my first post, but no, it is right there, finishing off the post.

"Does Christianity need such a rule? Do Christians need to be protected from anything that someone might construct as an insult?"

So however you want to play it down, and make this up to be a personal feely-thingy... it is not. It is a serious question about a part of Christian practice. A question that no one has even attempted to answer yet.

 

[anonymous person]

No, that is not what it is about. But I don't think you can or even want to understand it.


Nitpicking, are you? Just reread the thread and consider the concept of blasphemy.

You agree that people should respect each other here but you disrespect me by claiming I am nitpicking and don't even want to understand what you are saying.

I gathered that you likened yourself to Jesus who was silenced for blasphemy after reading your post and in order not to be presumptuous I asked you if this was indeed the case only to have you respond to me the way you did. And yet it is you who complain about how you are being treated.

Why do you do that?

 

[AV1611VET]

So why were you asking me your question?

What question?

"Mabe he wants to make posts like this, without having to explain himself?"

So why were you asking me your question?

I wasn't.