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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
God is sovereign over human behaviour and decisions
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GenetoJean
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I didn't ask if Jesus was God the Father. I didn't ask if He was divine. I didn't ask if He was the Son of God. I asked if Jesus is God? Yes or No? That's the question you keep dodging. Even member extraordinary, who posts alot of stuff I disagree with, even he posted in large blue letters: Jesus is God! What is your answer? Yes or No?
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GenetoJean
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How do you know which parts of the Bible to trust, and which not?
But now you're in a catch-22 situation, because if you don't have an objective source of truth, you are left to rely on your own preconceived ideas (you're just a man, too)
Don't you trust God's guidance and ability to preserve what he intends to communicate to mankind?
There is irrefutable proof that the translations passed down throughout time are near perfectly accurate. Any discrepancies are minor things like misspellings. Nothing that would change an essential doctrine or understanding of God. Not to mention the discovery of the dead sea scrolls which confirmed the validity and accuracy of the Old Testament.
Check out this picture:
http://visualunit.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/nt_reliability1.jpg
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GenetoJean
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I choose based on what makes sense. I know that isn't good enough for most but it is with me.
I know God can do anything but I don't think He 100% inspired the Bible as we know it for whatever reason.
Men can't even decide on how to baptize, obviously the Bible isn't clear.
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GenetoJean said:
You say "you choose based on what makes sense". Yeah, what makes sense to you. Therefore, you are left in a catch-22 situation, because now you're relying on your own preconceived ideas, which is the thing you wanted to avoid to begin with.
Do you have any actual scholarly reasons for your belief here? Have you actually done research and study on the Bible's reliability?
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GenetoJean
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I don't feel conflicted about my basic beliefs.
I will admit, I have not. I honestly plan to but don't have time or money right now.
I don't think I try to convince others of my beliefs. If asked I state and explain them but I don't want anyone going against what they feel God wants them to do.
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No worries, I was just trying to induce some critical thinking
You say you don't trust the Bible because of man's preconceived ideas, but you trust yourself and your own preconceived ideas, even though you're just a man, too.
So in the end, you do trust man's preconceived ideas.
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Ask Seek Knock
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I was curious as to whether those who believe the Holy Spirit guides, instructs, speaks to, and gives truths, do they consider the words the Spirit gives the very word of God?
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GenetoJean
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No worries, I was just trying to induce some critical thinking
You say you don't trust the Bible because of man's preconceived ideas, but you trust yourself and your own preconceived ideas, even though you're just a man, too.
So in the end, you do trust man's preconceived ideas.
That is correct, I have to choose some beliefs to believe in. I think I am pretty self honest. There are some things I might have fooled myself into believing (and I am honest enough to say that) but I try to always speak and admit the truth especially when it hits me over the head.
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No worries, I was just trying to induce some critical thinking
You say you don't trust the Bible because of man's preconceived ideas, but you trust yourself and your own preconceived ideas, even though you're just a man, too.
So in the end, you do trust man's preconceived ideas.
There is a difference between trusting my own ideas and trusting some other man or group of men.
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I am not sure we can always be correct in deciding the Spirit of God is guiding us. It seems to me we can think that is happening when it is not. This can be seen in people claiming they are guided by the Spirit of God when they do unloving things. We can be fairly certain the Spirit of God who is love is not going to guide us into doing unloving things to other people.
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Yes there is a difference. I have some control over my ideas. I have nothing to do with the ideas of others.
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One fallen, finite, sinful man having control over his ideas- and trusting them - is not better than if that same man trusts the fallen, sinful ideas of another man.
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