Should catholic priests have to remain celibate?

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Braunwyn

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Given the recent Ryan report, and this older article I found below, is celibacy playing role?

http://www.christianforums.com/t7369152/#post51766415

COMPERE: In a shocking admission, the Vatican has acknowledged that many of its priests are serial rapists and all too often their victims are nuns under the authority of the priests who perpetrate the violence.

The Vatican made the admission after a story broke in The National Catholic Reporter alleging abuse in 23 countries. One source told the story of a priest who presided over the funeral of a nun who died after undergoing an abortion at his insistence. It's also alleged that rather than risk catching AIDS from prostitutes, priests in Africa have sexually assaulted nuns, who are considered to be safe partners.

Rebecca Carmody reports.

REBECCA CARMODY: The allegations are as startling as they are damning for the Catholic Church. They include nuns being sexually abused in 23 countries in Africa, Asia, Europe and the United States. Australia is not among them.

In extreme cases there are also allegations of priests impregnating nuns and then forcing them to undergo abortions. Tom Roberts is the editor of The National Catholic Reporter, the US-based newspaper which broke the story. He says the report is based on five separate church studies.

TOM ROBERTS: The impression I get from the reports that we used to base the story on is that it was something more than isolated incidents, that it has become in some ways a practice in some places.

The exact - how widespread it is, we're not sure, and nor were those people who were, who didn't really quantify in a scientific way the dimensions of the problem.

REBECCA CARMODY: The author of one of the reports obtained by The National Catholic Reporter is Sister Mary O'Donohue, formerly the AIDS coordinator for the Catholic Fund for Overseas Development.

Her report compiled seven years ago links the sexual abuse of nuns to the prevalence of AIDS in Africa and concerns about contracting the disease.
The World Today Archive - Vatican admits to culture of sexual abuse
 

LightHorseman

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If it weren't for the celibacy aspect, I would seriously consider being a priest. I suspect the celibacy requirement possibly stops many people who wouldn't treat kids in this way from becoming priests.. and quite possibly warps some otherwise borderline people to the point that they do.
 
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Braunwyn

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If it weren't for the celibacy aspect, I would seriously consider being a priest. I suspect the celibacy requirement possibly stops many people who wouldn't treat kids in this way from becoming priests.. and quite possibly warps some otherwise borderline people to the point that they do.
Agreed. It's seems like an archaic practice that hasn't been working out very well. I remember reading something many moons ago about celibacy becoming a requirement due to church finances. According to what I read, throwing families into the mix threatened the church's wealth. Don't quote me on that though, because it was several years ago and I may be recalling incorrectly.
 
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sidhe

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Agreed. It's seems like an archaic practice that hasn't been working out very well. I remember reading something many moons ago about celibacy becoming a requirement due to church finances. According to what I read, throwing families into the mix threatened the church's wealth. Don't quote me on that though, because it was several years ago and I may be recalling incorrectly.

If I'm correct, it had to do with paying the priests - the Church had to pay more if there was a family to support.

Given that the RCC is the only church to require celibacy (and not even in all rites!), and that the EO hasn't totally broken down, I think it might be causing more problems than it solves at this point.
 
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LightHorseman

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Agreed. It's seems like an archaic practice that hasn't been working out very well. I remember reading something many moons ago about celibacy becoming a requirement due to church finances. According to what I read, throwing families into the mix threatened the church's wealth. Don't quote me on that though, because it was several years ago and I may be recalling incorrectly.
The exact history of the celibacy vow escapes me, too... though I do recall that for the first 900 years or more, it was far more considered as a guidline, if at all, rather than a hard and fast rule.
 
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Braunwyn

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If I'm correct, it had to do with paying the priests - the Church had to pay more if there was a family to support.

Given that the RCC is the only church to require celibacy (and not even in all rites!), and that the EO hasn't totally broken down, I think it might be causing more problems than it solves at this point.
Yea, and this is interesting....

Clergy themselves have suggested their seminary training offered little to prepare them for a lifetime of celibate sexuality. A report submitted to the Synod of Bishops in Rome in 1971, called The Role of the Church in the Causation, Treatment and Prevention of the Crisis in the Priesthood by Dr. Conrad Baars, a Roman Catholic psychiatrist, and based on a study of 1500 priests, suggested that some clergy had "psychosexual" problems. Though the report suggested that immediate corrective action was needed, making ten recommendations, and one of those most active in the Synod was Cardinal Wojtyła, who on October 16, 1978 was elected Pope John Paul II, no implementation of the report's detailed recommendations followed.
Catholic sex abuse cases - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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seashale76

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Orthodox priests can marry as long as they have done so before they are ordained to the priesthood or the deaconate (most do). An entirely celibate priesthood (as it is practiced in the CC) is a rather late innovation. As most parish priests usually have to live in the world it makes no sense to impose the monastic rule on them. The life of a heiromonk (priest monk) isn't the same as that of a married priest.
 
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KCKID

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If it weren't for the celibacy aspect, I would seriously consider being a priest. I suspect the celibacy requirement possibly stops many people who wouldn't treat kids in this way from becoming priests.. and quite possibly warps some otherwise borderline people to the point that they do.

I don't believe anyone goes into the priest-hood desiring to molest children. I believe that it's just something that occurs over a period of time. The flesh is weak and even those who have committed themselves to celibacy are still human, sexual beings. They were no doubt young men who entered the priest-hood with the most honorable of intentions. They went astray like most of us do at some time or another. I personally condemn no one. I can't afford to.

It actually sickens me when people become so incited by the media - who else? - that they froth at the mouth and want to string up someone they don't even know who never ever intended to hurt anyone else. A sense of anger or rage seems to lie just beneath the surface of probably most people. I remember Phil Donahue making the quote, "Everyone in America wants to execute someone." And it's true. If it isn't child-abusing priests it's someone else.

These things pertaining to the topic happen and they will continue to happen until the end of time. It's a given. The facts are that the entire world is corrupt and each of us contributes to this situation in one form or another.
 
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Braunwyn

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I don't believe anyone goes into the priest-hood desiring to molest children. I believe that it's just something that occurs over a period of time. The flesh is weak and even those who have committed themselves to celibacy are still human, sexual beings. They were no doubt young men who entered the priest-hood with the most honorable of intentions. They went astray like most of us do at some time or another. I personally condemn no one. I can't afford to.

It actually sickens me when people become so incited by the media - who else? - that they froth at the mouth and want to string up someone they don't even know who never ever intended to hurt anyone else. A sense of anger or rage seems to lie just beneath the surface of probably most people. I remember Phil Donahue making the quote, "Everyone in America wants to execute someone." And it's true. If it isn't child-abusing priests it's someone else.

These things pertaining to the topic happen and they will continue to happen until the end of time. It's a given. The facts are that the entire world is corrupt and each of us contributes to this situation in one form or another.
You can certainly take a 'do nothing' approach, stick your head in the sand, whatever suits your fancy. Others may be interested in taking preventative measures to thwart potential abuse. Addressing celibacy might be something worth doing in the CC and I can think of no greater voice than members demanding such change. Enough evidence is surfacing that sex is an issue. Regarding your straw man (lynch mobs), that aren't present in this thread, addressing that sad mentality doesn't add to the OP.
 
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KCKID

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You can certainly take a 'do nothing' approach, stick your head in the sand, whatever suits your fancy. Others may be interested in taking preventative measures to thwart potential abuse.

I'm not sticking my head in the sand. Taking preventative measures is one thing. Constantly digging up the past is another. This new revelation will blow over after a while for a little while. Then, a few weeks down the track it will emerge again with yet another report. The media will again drive the public into a frenzy and the entire thing will start all over again. We KNOW that children were abused by those who were in positions of authority. But we've known for years and years and years. So, what's new?

Addressing celibacy might be something worth doing in the CC and I can think of no greater voice than members demanding such change.

While I have no idea why such a thing as celibacy within the priest-hood exists in the first place I would think that changing such a strict tenet of the CC would be nigh impossible. It has also been argued that celibacy, per se, has little to do with child sexual abuse. I would beg to differ but the CC seems to feel otherwise.

Enough evidence is surfacing that sex is an issue. Regarding your straw man (lynch mobs), that aren't present in this thread, addressing that sad mentality doesn't add to the OP.

Yes, you are right ...this thread is concerned with celibacy. However, the thread was prompted by the recent news report over child abuse within the CC. And, the question of celibacy or not for priests is, of course, related to the constant allegations of child abuse BY celibate priests.
 
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Penumbra

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It's unnatural for most people to go their entire lives without relations...

They take a vow to remain celibate, and think that praying and God will allow them to overcome it, but many of them have to release their desires somehow. I think people do things they wouldn't do normally if under a lot of repression, like how people who otherwise might not be homosexual have relations with other men when they are in prison.

I just think that priests could do their job equally as well without the requirement to remain celibate, and perhaps better...
 
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Braunwyn

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I'm not sticking my head in the sand. Taking preventative measures is one thing. Constantly digging up the past is another. This new revelation will blow over after a while for a little while. Then, a few weeks down the track it will emerge again with yet another report. The media will again drive the public into a frenzy and the entire thing will start all over again. We KNOW that children were abused by those who were in positions of authority. But we've known for years and years and years. So, what's new?
It shouldn't blow over. Something needs to be done or nothing will change. It's not as if we have information that abuse has come to a halt. Based on the article I posted, it hasn't. Due to similar reports coming to light, over here in the states, laws have been enacted that require the Church to report illegal activities. This wasn't required in the past, now it is. That's change for the good. If we just ignored it, nothing would have been done. And we need to keep plugging along.

While I have no idea why such a thing as celibacy within the priest-hood exists in the first place I would think that changing such a strict tenet of the CC would be nigh impossible. It has also been argued that celibacy, per se, has little to do with child sexual abuse. I would beg to differ but the CC seems to feel otherwise.
Well, the raping or having sex with nuns allegations certainly speaks to a celebacy issue. I cannot fathom how members of the CC would not rally for change. So much is done IRT other issues, why not this? Really, the church is the people, not only the clergy. It's not the middle ages any more where power structures are so weighted. Or, at least they shouldn't be.

Yes, you are right ...this thread is concerned with celibacy. However, the thread was prompted by the recent news report over child abuse within the CC. And, the question of celibacy or not for priests is, of course, related to the constant allegations of child abuse BY celibate priests.
Yes, it is certainly related, but I started it due the article I found quoted in the OP. This stuff needs to be addressed, and being from Boston, where much of the sexual abuse scandels in the US came to light, it was with us for years. The Ryan report is going to bring those bad feelings back for Bostonians, I'm sure. And as I mentioned previously, some protective measures have resulted, it's not really addressing the heart of the issue. That's not to say celibacy is at the heart, but it's worth looking at imo. On this issue (why it's happening), we can't call our reps and congressmen to voice our concerns. It's something that can only be contended with by church members.
 
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Braunwyn

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It's unnatural for most people to go their entire lives without relations...

They take a vow to remain celibate, and think that praying and God will allow them to overcome it, but many of them have to release their desires somehow. I think people do things they wouldn't do normally if under a lot of repression, like how people who otherwise might not be homosexual have relations with other men when they are in prison.
That's a good point.
 
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Axioma

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COMPERE: In a shocking admission, the Vatican has acknowledged that many of its priests are serial rapists and all too often their victims are nuns under the authority of the priests who perpetrate the violence.

Oh, honestly. Is there anyone here who was actually shocked by this? Anyone at all?
 
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Braunwyn

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COMPERE: In a shocking admission, the Vatican has acknowledged that many of its priests are serial rapists and all too often their victims are nuns under the authority of the priests who perpetrate the violence.

Oh, honestly. Is there anyone here who was actually shocked by this? Anyone at all?
Eh, call me naive. I was raised Catholic and my mom lived in a convent through out her teens. We were raised with respect for the church, blah blah, blahhh.
 
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LightHorseman

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This is just insane to me... How can one's celibacy lead to one's sexual attraction to and one's abuse of children?


Let me ponder this a bit more. I'll definitely come back to this one..
Desperation and represion drive people to do things they wouldn't normlly consider
 
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KCKID

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It's unnatural for most people to go their entire lives without relations...

They take a vow to remain celibate, and think that praying and God will allow them to overcome it, but many of them have to release their desires somehow.

I think you've pretty well nailed it. It's just a pity that we then call these folks 'monsters'.
 
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KCKID

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Desperation and represion drive people to do things they wouldn't normlly consider

Precisely. I know it's not an excuse but it IS a pretty solid reason.

Human beings ...why did God ever make them in the first place?
 
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