YEC and Fossil Fuels

[AV1611VET]

So if you want to see how your dribble compares to what "really" happened, read the Book of Enoch.

The Book of Enoch can take a hike:

1. It is listed as a pseudepigraph --- a book with a false author.
2. Very few people in history accepted it as canonical.
3. If it was written by Enoch himself, how did it survive the Flood?
4. Tertullian admits it was never accepted by the Jews or the Christians of his time.
5. It was actually written 300 - 100 BC --- a period of time known as the Silent Period --- where God did not inspire anyone to do any writing or speaking in His Name --- q.v. Amos 8:11-12
6. Malachi is clearly the last Old Testament book.
7. According to Genesis 5:22, Enoch lived 300 years after he begat Methuselah --- Methuselah then begat Lamech at the age of 187, leaving Enoch only 113 years left on earth. Lamech then begat Noah at the age of 182 --- 69 years after Enoch was taken up. This means that Enoch never met Noah --- yet --- the Book of Enoch in Enoch 107:2-3 has Enoch talking to Methuselah to go and tell Lamech that his son, Noah, is really his!

Let me repeat --- the Book of Enoch can take a hike.

 

[Split Rock]

The Book of Enoch can take a hike:

1. It is listed as a pseudepigraph --- a book with a false author.
2. Very few people in history accepted it as canonical.
3. If it was written by Enoch himself, how did it survive the Flood?
4. Tertullian admits it was never accepted by the Jews or the Christians of his time.
5. It was actually written 300 - 100 BC --- a period of time known as the Silent Period --- where God did not inspire anyone to do any writing or speaking in His Name --- q.v. Amos 8:11-12
6. Malachi is clearly the last Old Testament book.
7. According to Genesis 5:22, Enoch lived 300 years after he begat Methuselah --- Methuselah then begat Lamech at the age of 187, leaving Enoch only 113 years left on earth. Lamech then begat Noah at the age of 182 --- 69 years after Enoch was taken up. This means that Enoch never met Noah --- yet --- the Book of Enoch in Enoch 107:2-3 has Enoch talking to Methuselah to go and tell Lamech that his son, Noah, is really his!

Let me repeat --- the Book of Enoch can take a hike.

Perhaps you can explain why your infallible Bible directly quotes the Book of Enoch, if it is a fake?

 

[Gawron]

I don't understand why threads like this always have to start with a label and the premise that those deemed to fall under that label are abysmally stupid and look at me ain't I cool for pointing that out.

You can't simply ask a question?

 

[ranmaonehalf]

Oil and fossil fuels were created form the pressure of billions of souls being in a volcano.
Xenu helped create these fuels.

 

[AV1611VET]

Perhaps you can explain why your infallible Bible directly quotes the Book of Enoch, if it is a fake?

"My" infallible Bible does not quote the Book of Enoch --- (a comparison will show that) --- "my" infallible Bible quotes Enoch, himself.

But you can quote me on this: the Book of Enoch can take a hike.

 

[juvenissun]

I don't understand why threads like this always have to start with a label and the premise that those deemed to fall under that label are abysmally stupid and look at me ain't I cool for pointing that out.

You can't simply ask a question?

It is OK. It meant to be a challenge to YEC.

 

[juvenissun]

Oil and fossil fuels were created form the pressure of billions of souls being in a volcano.
Xenu helped create these fuels.

Who (What) is Xenu?

 

[AV1611VET]

It is OK. It meant to be a challenge to YEC.

Atheists and scientists have guts challenging YECs --- seeing as how they can't accept their answers.

That's like challenging a bear to come out and fight, then keeping their distance and yelling insults at the bear when it answers the challenge.

 

[Cabal]

Atheists and scientists have guts challenging YECs --- seeing as how they can't accept their answers.

That's like challenging a bear to come out and fight, then keeping their distance and yelling insults at the bear when it answers the challenge.

Yup, because not being instantly swayed by a (teddy) bear makes us wrong by default of course....

 

[AV1611VET]

Who (What) is Xenu?

Probably a video game.

You don't think these guys get their theology from a Bible, do you?

 

[Baggins]

All that come along with the burial. The process is called burial metamorphism. Oil, gas and coal are made in the first half of it.

Yeah, that is it. YEC theories are able to take care of it.

YEC "theories" do not allow time for the burial, generation, migration and charging of large oil reservoirs as you'd realise if you knew the first thing about the oil industry.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

I don't understand why threads like this always have to start with a label and the premise that those deemed to fall under that label are abysmally stupid and look at me ain't I cool for pointing that out.

You can't simply ask a question?

Like this:

What do YECers think fossil fuels like coal and oil are and how they formed? do you think it's ancient lifeforms, just not as ancient? how did the pressure and heat process them into fossil fuels in such a short time?

I don't understand why threads like this always have to start with a label [...]

The label is there, "YECers". OK

I don't understand why threads like this always have to start with [...] the premise that those deemed to fall under that label are abysmally stupid [...]

I don't see anything like that.

[..] look at me ain't I cool for pointing that out. [...]

Not there in the OP.

You can't simply ask a question?

What is wrong with the questions in the OP?

What do YECers think fossil fuels like coal and oil are and how they formed?

do you think it's ancient lifeforms, just not as ancient?

how did the pressure and heat process them into fossil fuels in such a short time?​

Simple and straightforward enough, no?


But how about this:

I don't understand why threads like this always have to start with a label and the premise that those deemed to fall under that label are abysmally stupid and look at me ain't I cool for pointing that out.

You can't simply ask a question?​

How about you heeded your own advice. Admittedly you did not start a thread, but still.

 

[Hespera]

Originally Posted by AV1611VET

Atheists and scientists have guts challenging YECs --- seeing as how they can't accept their answers.

That's like challenging a bear to come out and fight, then keeping their distance and yelling insults at the bear when it answers the challenge.
​

Yup, because not being instantly swayed by a (teddy) bear makes us wrong by default of course....

Weird take on things! Yeccers dont HAVE any answers.

It was interesting for a while to see what sort of fantastic contortions are necessary to try to keep a thread of logic going to consistently deny reality.

I had hoped at first that in joining this forum I would find one or more individuals who could actually come up with serious minded data backed challenges to any aspect evolution / geology as they are now viewed in education and industry.

Instead we get "hydroplate theory", "genesis pwns evolution" or "godidit"
"Satan controls the minds of scientists". "Conspiracy". "Higher insight" And these usually come from people whose education level wouldn't let them complete a 5th grade English composition.

I still have not seen one single piece of hard data. Or even an idea that made sense.

I would not have any trouble accepting a real answer to a question, but gibberish doesn't cut it. Neither does a lot of bold font.

The comparison to provoking a bear was stunningly inept. It might be some primate, but definitely not a bear.

 

[Hespera]

Like this:





The label is there, "YECers". OK



I don't see anything like that.



Not there in the OP.



What is wrong with the questions in the OP?

What do YECers think fossil fuels like coal and oil are and how they formed?

do you think it's ancient lifeforms, just not as ancient?

how did the pressure and heat process them into fossil fuels in such a short time?​

Simple and straightforward enough, no?


But how about this:

I don't understand why threads like this always have to start with a label and the premise that those deemed to fall under that label are abysmally stupid and look at me ain't I cool for pointing that out.

You can't simply ask a question?​

How about you heeded your own advice. Admittedly you did not start a thread, but still.

If YECers is an objectionable term then it should not be used.

We will need an alternative though. Suggestions?

We also need a treaty that would involve no more use of
"atheistic evolutionists".

 

[Cabal]

The comparison to provoking a bear was stunningly inept. It might be some primate, but definitely not a bear.

I don't know, both creationists and bears make threatening noises a lot and yet know stunningly little about biology, so perhaps not....

 

[Lord Emsworth]

If YECers is an objectionable term then it should not be used.

We will need an alternative though. Suggestions?

We also need a treaty that would involve no more use of
"atheistic evolutionists".

I don't think different labels are needed so much. YECs instead of YECers maybe, but even using YECer is fine - the smallest possible infraction against politeness at best. Pfft.

I am also fine with "atheistic evolutionists" if the question demands that the questioned be both an atheist (or aganostic) and an 'evolutionist.'

What is needed are good questions. Questions that that are not built around stawmen or questionable stereotypes or are not so much the rhetorical side. And here the OP is nowhere lacking, in principle at least.

In practice though ... we probably all know (yeah, yeah, I know, sue me) that there aren't ever any real good explanations for anything that go significantly beyond Goddidit or Cataclysmicfloodwatersdidit from creationists ... and so asking for explanations is pointless. (Does anybody, excepting the creationists, actually expect anything from creationism? Me, I don't.)

 

[Split Rock]

Atheists and scientists have guts challenging YECs --- seeing as how they can't accept their answers.

That's like challenging a bear to come out and fight, then keeping their distance and yelling insults at the bear when it answers the challenge.

Funny... I see it as the other way around.. considering all creationists have to offer is rhetoric and insults (like "Darwin was a racist" and "Satan created the theory of evolution"). Do you really see any tools in the creationist toolbox that resemble teeth or claws? I sure don't.

 

[Hespera]

I don't think different labels are needed so much. YECs instead of YECers maybe, but even using YECer is fine - the smallest possible infraction against politeness at best. Pfft.

I am also fine with "atheistic evolutionists" if the question demands that the questioned be both an atheist (or aganostic) and an 'evolutionist.'

What is needed are good questions. Questions that that are not built around stawmen or questionable stereotypes or are not so much the rhetorical side. And here the OP is nowhere lacking, in principle at least.

In practice though ... we probably all know (yeah, yeah, I know, sue me) that there aren't ever any real good explanations for anything that go significantly beyond Goddidit or Cataclysmicfloodwatersdidit from creationists ... and so asking for explanations is pointless. (Does anybody, excepting the creationists, actually expect anything from creationism? Me, I don't.)

I guess you are right about the yec / evolutionist labelling.
No agreement would ever be reached anyway.

Its just you know, I am accustomed to an atmosphere in which you just cant say things unless you are prepared to be challenged with serious minded in-depth questions by people who are seriously smart and likely to know far more than you do. There is no get-out-of-jail-free card available, you have to put up or shut up.

I'm ok with abstractions, and maybe even a touch of mysticism here and there. (I had a really weird encounter with a cobra one time). I just cant handle nonsense though. No water canopies for me.

I didnt really expect anything from the creationist side, I didnt know what to expect. This is kind of a new topic for me, I didnt much know that there were people who take these ideas seriously. So, I started looking at what people have to say. I THOUGHT maybe... didnt expect...that maybe someone had at least one or two data points somewhere.

Like, I have seen it claimed that there are things like whale fossils that are buried vertically through may (supposed) thousands or millions of hears of strata. Ok.....lets see it. But then it goes poof when you try to get the facts, there is nothing there. Same thing happens with every piece of data that is put forward, there is nothing there. Leaves us with goddidit, and there is nothing there to discuss.

 

[AV1611VET]

Do you really see any tools in the creationist toolbox that resemble teeth or claws? I sure don't.

Keep looking.
​

​

 

[ranmaonehalf]

XENU

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenu