The false doctrine of the immortality of the soul (or State of the Dead).

[reddogs]

While speaking to His disciples about Lazarus, Jesus said:

Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go that I may awake him out of sleep. Then said his disciples, if he sleep he shall do well. Howbeit, Jesus spoke of his death; but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead. John 11:11-14

The disciples were confused and thought Christ meant natural sleep, but He meant the sleep of death.
On His arrival Jesus found that Lazarus had already been four days in the tomb. John 11:17

While conversing with Martha, He tried to comfort her by saying,
'Thy brother shall rise again.' Martha saith unto him, 'I know that He shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.' John 11:23,24

Martha knew that life would be restored to Lazarus only in the resurrection at the last day. Jesus demonstrated through the resurrection of Lazarus that He was the One who could resurrect the dead according to His claim:

I am the resurrection and the life. John 11:25

The Scriptures in both Old and New Testaments are very clear on this issue. Life to the dead will be restored in the resurrection on the last day. (1 Corinthians 15:51-55, Job 19:25-26; Job 14:10-15; Psalm 17:15; Daniel 12:13) There will be separate resurrections for the righteous and for the wicked. John 5:28-29 states:

Marvel not at this; for the hour is coming, in which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil unto the resurrection of damnation.
For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ shall rise first.1 Thessalonians 4:16 NKJV

But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Revelation 20:5 NKJV

That same voice that raised Lazarus from the grave will be heard on that last day of this world's history, calling forth those who have slept in the graves of the earth. Christ will recreate the righteous dead, or "dead in Christ", and breathe into them the breath of eternal life, and they shall enter Heaven.

Revelation 20:6:
Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection.

When Jesus called Lazarus from the tomb,
...he cried with a loud voice, 'Lazarus, come forth'. John 11:43

That voice raised dead Lazarus to life. "He that was dead came forth", and Jesus said:
Loose him, and let him go. John 11:44

Nothing at all is stated about what transpired during those four days in which Lazarus was dead. Christ made no statement, neither did Martha or even Lazarus himself. The fact, of course, is that there was nothing to report about what happened after he died, no bright lights or gentle clouds or about the realm of the dead, simply because he had experienced the sleep of death which is a state of absolute silence and oblivion.

One of the most deceptive doctrines of the Evil one is the doctrine of the immortality of the soul. This doctrine more than any other opens the door to spurious views regarding the afterlife, and it has permeated the religious world with its false promises and claims. Moreover, it offers promises of multiple choices that can be made in terms of one’s salvation and multiple chances in terms of qualifying for salvation. Spiritism, reincarnation and necromancy (the worship and consulting of the dead) are only possible in the light of this doctrine. The Word of God is very clear on this issue. None of these doctrines and practices were to be tolerated by the people of God because they were all rooted in a false perception of death.

Most religions in the world today teach that death is the transition of one state of consciousness to another state of consciousness. They propose that physical man is subject to death, but that the "soul" continues to live, and is indeed immortal. According to this doctrine, the soul is a separate entity, and resides in the body of the living. To make matters even more confusing, most Christian denominations believe that this dichotomy is to be found only in humans, and that animals do not have souls.
The text of Genesis 2:7 clearly states that God breathed into the formed man the "breath of life" and man became a living soul. He did not receive a living soul; he became one. The New King James Bible states that "man became a living being". Of the many references to soul and spirit in the Bible, never once is either the soul or the Spirit declared to be immortal, imperishable or eternal. Indeed only God has immortality (1 Timothy 1:17; 6:16).

The doctrine of the immortality of the soul is a doctrine of false hope which negates the message of death. Moreover, if man continues to live, albeit in an altered state, then there is no need for a Saviour, or indeed the atoning death of Christ. Christ died to restore life to those who had forfeited it through sin.Job correlates the usage of breath and the spirit, saying:

All the while my breath is in me, and the spirit of God is in my nostrils. Job 27:3

Moses reported that the breath of life was in Adam’s nostrils, whereas Job refers to both terms and says that the spirit of the Lord is “in my nostrils.” Hence, the Hebrew terms of "neshamah" and "rûach" are used here in a similar context - namely life itself! According to the Scriptures, all living creatures received life in the same way from God, and are subject to the same fate.

And out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field . . . wherein is the breath of life. Genesis 2:19; 7:15

Both man and beast ...have all one breath, so that a man hath no preeminence above the beast. Ecclesiastes 3:19

Since man and beast have one breath, they also die the same way.

For that which befalleth the sons of men, befalleth beasts; ... as the one dieth, so dieth the other. Ecclesiastes 3:19.

Both man and animals were created from dust. So, when they die they then return again to dust; just the reverse of creation.

...for dust thou art and unto dust shalt thou return. Genesis 3:19

The second thing which happens when a man dies, is that the spirit, or breath of life, returns to God;

...and the spirit shall return unto God, who gave it. Ecclesiastes 12:7

Man was never meant to die, but death came into the world as a consequence of sin.

For the wages of sin is death. Romans 6:23

As death is non-life, it merely means that God takes the life ("rûach" spirit, breath) that He granted on condition of obedience back and man ceases to live. It is the life that was given that returns to God, and not a transformed version of man in the form a spirit being. When God said that man would "surely die" (Genesis 2:17) if he transgressed God's requirements, He meant that man would cease to live, and would return to dust.

Far from being a conscious state, death is thus the ultimate state of non-being or unconsciousness, and is described as such in the Scriptures.

His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish. Psalms 146:4

For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not anything. Ecclesiastes 9:5

The dead are oblivious to what is happening on earth they know nothing.

Also their love, and their hatred and their envy is now perished. Ecclesiastes 9:6

For in death there is no remembrance of You; in the grave who will give you thanks? Psalm 6:5

So their feelings perish also.
The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into silence. Psalms 115: 17

This state of unconsciousness is equated with sleep. Job says,

So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more; they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep. Job 14:12

Man lies in the sleep of death until the resurrection at the end of time. Then, and only then, will he awake and be raised out of sleep.

 

[reddogs]

The State of the Dead as taught by the Bible and the Bible only from Palehorse essay:

"..First let me say, for the sake of ease and clarity, this essay is by no means exhaustive in nature. By that I mean I have not given every single example found in the Bible to support the following questions and arguments; I have included the ones I feel best explain each section. I could literally write a book if I wanted to show every example for this study but it is unnecessary for the plain teaching of the Bible on this topic is very clear. However, I will address the arguments I’ve heard that are in favor of the “immortal soul” and the teaching of going to heaven/hell immediately following death near the end of this paper. As such, this has become a fairly long essay. But it is vital that people understand the relationship between what happens to us at death and how that ties into our going to hell or heaven. I could have made this essay much shorter simply by doing a breakdown of 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 (which is included herein) but I wanted to make sure that there was not room for doubt or error by comparing many verses together to ensure we have a solid picture of what the scriptures actually teach on this topic. This is my personal study, as such, please forgive any spelling/grammatical errors I've made.

To answer the question of the state of the dead, we must first define what the Bible says a soul is:
How was man created?
Genesis 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
Man was not given a soul – he became a living soul. Don't miss that. “Soul” and “spirit” are not the same thing. It is the unity of body and breath-of-life that constitute the soul. You ARE a soul; you do not HAVE a soul. It is sad that an educated clergy gets this part wrong in most churches, and in doing so, the rest of what happens after we die gets distorted based off this first failing step.

For those that are mathematically minded, the idea can be expressed as such:
Physical body (dust) + breath of life (spirit - ruwach) = living soul (a wholism of the two - nephesh)

The Hebrew word for soul is"nephesh". Nephesh was translated into many different English words for the KJV Bible (for instance; creature, beast, man, fish, thing, person or persons, etc) but an important thing one should plainly see is that none of the translations refer to it as being something that survives the death of the body nor does it mean that in the original Hebrew. It was used to describe the "wholism" of life - not a "dualism" as was latter taught by the Greeks (Plato to be precise) and is unfortunately with us still today.
The Hebrew word for spirit is "ruwach". This word means breath or air and these terms are used interchangeably. The Hebrew word “ruwach” appears 377 times in the Bible; 117 times translated as wind/air, 33 times as breath, and 227 times as spirit. There is no indication that there is any memory, consciousness, ego, or character associated with it in ANY of the verses. Also, there is no implication that it is immortal. Check it out for yourself if you have any doubts.

Can/does the soul die?
Ezekial 18:4 - Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Ezekiel 18:20 - The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
Revelation 16:3 - And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
Genesis 3:19 - In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
Ecclesiastes 3:19 & 20 - For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again.

These five verses show the same equation (if you will), in reverse:

Physical body (dust) – breath of life (spirit) = death (the ceasing of the two)


Let’s verify that the “breath of life” equates to the spirit:
Genesis 7:22 - All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.
Job 27:3 - All the while my breath is in me, and the spirit of God is in my nostrils;
Isaiah 2:22 - Cease ye from man, whose breath is in his nostrils: for wherein is he to be accounted of?
What is in the nostrils? Some immortal memory-retaining substance? No, figuratively and literally it is the breath.

As you can see, the breath of life and the spirit are one and the same and are used interchangeably. Does the spirit have thoughts or memory?
Ecclesiastes 9:5 - For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Job 12:2 - No doubt but ye are the people, and wisdom shall die with you.

So, the spirit (breath - ruwach) that returns to God at death is not mentioned as being immortal nor does it contain any memory or information of the individual or any conscience whatsoever. In fact, just the opposite has been seen; the dead don’t know anything nor can they gain any further reward towards heaven.

Who is/has immortality now?
1 Timothy 6:15 & 16 - Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords; Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.
1 Timothy 1:17 - Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.
Deuteronomy 33:27 - The eternal God is thy refuge, ...

ONLY God has immortality right now, 1 Timothy 6:15 & 16 makes that abundantly clear. The question is can humans achieve it, and if so, how?
Mark 10:17 - And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
Luke 10:25 - And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?
Luke 18:18 - And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?

Notice, the questions in the verses above talk about inheriting eternal life – that is a future tense event not a current one. They were asking what they had to do to inherit eternal life; which also says they didn't already have it. So, what did they, and we, have to do to inherit eternal life?

John 3:15 - That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
John 17:2 - As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
1 Timothy 6:19 - Laying up in store for themselves a good foundation against the time to come, that they may lay hold on eternal life.
John 10:28 - And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

Again we find that eternal life is a future event but it’s conditional; you must believe in Him.

Titus 3:7 - That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
Heirs receive an inheritance.
Hebrews 9:15 - And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
1 John 5:11 - And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

These verses clearly show that eternal life is NOT an automatic thing – it is something that is hoped for, something that must be given by God or inherited from God.

So, if eternal life (either in heaven or hell) is not granted at death, then when is it?
John 5:28-29 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
1.Cor.15:52 which says, "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."
1 Cor 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

Notice that all of these verses (and this is by no means all of the scriptural references) talk of a future event (His coming) in which the dead are raised. There is no mention of souls going to either heaven or hell immediately after death. That is a Hellenistic (pagan Greek teaching made popular by Plato) teaching that was introduced in the 400+ years between the writings of the Old and New Testaments. But the details of that are outside of the scope of this study.

So what does happen when we die?
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 - But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

If that verse doesn’t explain our position then nothing will. The Bible, not me, clearly likens death to “sleep” and calls it such many times. At the end of this study I’ll provide many more supporting scriptures for this fact. Also note; the dead in Christ ARE STILL HERE AND ALL THE RIGHTEOUS RISE AT THE SAME TIME. Christ descends from heaven and we rise to meet Him then; not before, not later, but at that moment. There is no second chance as is being taught by popular Christianity. That is a dangerous myth, a fable. But let me further prove that position...."

(end part 1)

 

[reddogs]

State of the Dead (part 2)


Let’s look at the story of Lazarus (not the Parable of Lazarus, which we’ll look at near end of this study):
John 11:11-14 - These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep. Then said his disciples, Lord, if he sleep, he shall do well. Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead. And then in verse 17 Jesus says of Lazarus: 17 Then when Jesus came, he found that he [Lazarus] had lain in the grave four days already.

We see that 1) Jesus equated death to sleep and used the terms interchangeably; and 2) in this story Lazarus has been dead for 4 days. Agreed? Now, let’s continue:
Verse 43-44: And when he thus had spoken, he cried with a loud voice, Lazarus, come forth. And he that was dead came forth, bound hand and foot with graveclothes: and his face was bound about with a napkin. Jesus saith unto them, Loose him, and let him go.

Now, Lazarus had been dead for 4 days – if he had in fact gone to heaven (or hell) in any conscious form why is nothing told by Lazarus of this? Lazarus does not come back to life with any stories of where he was, what he saw, or anything. He doesn’t talk about walking on streets of gold nor burning with fire. After being resurrected he does speak – and all he says is a simple acknowledgement of who was standing there with Jesus.
Why doesn’t Lazarus have any such stories of an afterlife? The Bible tells us why:
Ecclesiastes 9:5 - For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Job 12:2 - No doubt but ye are the people, and wisdom shall die with you.

So, when do we get our reward?
Matthew 16:27 - For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
Matthew 5:12 - Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.
Matthew 6:1 - Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.
Luke 6:23 - Rejoice ye in that day, and leap for joy: for, behold, your reward is great in heaven: for in the like manner did their fathers unto the prophets.
Revelation 22:12 - And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

Notice that the “reward” comes when Jesus comes back – not before and not after. Nor does it make a lick of sense that if people were already in heaven that Jesus would send them back to earth to re-resurrect them. That would serve no purpose at all and the Bible simply does not teach that. That is a fairytale and I challenge anyone to produce any scripture in favor of that teaching.

Let’s look at Christ’s example on the cross and I’ll include the thief in this point since many cite this as a reason to believe that we go immediately to heaven or hell following death:
Luke 23:42, 43 - And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom. And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.
Luke 23:46 - And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.
So, as we learned earlier the word “spirit” (ruach) simply means His breath. But now we’ll verify many of the things established in this paper:
1) Did Jesus ascend to heaven that day? No.
Remember, Jesus died on a Friday (day of preparation – Luke 23:54), laid dead in the sepulchre all of Saturday (Sabbath – again Luke 23:54), rose on Sunday, and
John 20:1 - The first day of the week (Sunday still) cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.
(Luke 24:21 further verifies it was three days)
John 20:17 - Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
Jesus was dead and rose on the third day and still had not yet ascended to heaven.
2) Did the thief die that day? No.
In fact, the Jews didn’t want anyone hanging on the cross during their Sabbath day so the Romans broke the legs of the thief and the other (neither of which had died yet) so that when they took the crosses down they wouldn’t run away (John 19:31-33).
3) Did the thief even ask to be taken to heaven that day? No. The thief knew his theology – what did he ask?
Luke 23:42, 43 - And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom...

The thief did not ask to be taken to heaven when he died but when Christ would return. This is very important to understand, don't miss it.

Never has the misplacement of a comma ever caused so much trouble. Remember, neither Greek nor Hebrew contains any form of punctuation nor capitalization – the translators put those in when they translated to English.
Is it possible they were swayed by a preconceived notion? Maybe so.
Are they “inspired” as the writers of the Bible were? No, certainly not.
Were they just being consistent? YES! Check it out; any time in the Bible where Jesus says “verily I say unto thee” there is always a comma immediately following the phrase. The translators were merely being consistent in their translation and I can't fault them for that - but this time it was at the expense of the true meaning of what Jesus actually said.
Am I wrong? Well let’s test that. Let's see if there are examples of misplaced commas in other places in the Bible just to see if this is possible:
Acts 19:12 - So that from his body were brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them.
Now ask yourself, were the handkerchiefs sick? Did they have evil spirits in them? No. According to the way this sentence is written then they were, right? Doesn't it stand to reason that the comma is misplaced? I would think so.
Let’s see another example:

Genesis 16:1 - Now Sarai Abram's wife bare him no children: and she had an handmaid, an Egyptian, whose name was Hagar.
Was Sarai Abram his name? No. The commas are missing between the names – it should read “Now Sarai, Abrams’s wife, bare him…” There are many others – the point is that punctuation mistakes DID happen and the example of the thief on the cross is merely another one that can easily be corrected if people would correlate the meaning to the plain teachings found in the rest of the Bible. The Bible does not contradict itself but sometimes one must look a bit deeper than the surface to see that. There are other punctuation mistakes; check out 2 Peter 3:12 (it’s a statement, not a question) & Hebrews 4:8 (it’s a question, not a statement).

Let’s get two more examples that further show people do not go to heaven or hell upon death:
2 Peter 2:9 - The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to RESERVE the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished.
Acts 2:29-34 - Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne; He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell (grave), neither his flesh did see corruption. This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses. Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear. For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he saith himself, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand,
What Paul is saying here is simple and yet vital; David is still dead and buried and has not ascended to heaven even though David was promised to do so by God Himself. If David is not in heaven even years after his death (and with the promise from God) then what makes people think they will go to heaven immediately after death? The Bible simply does not teach that.

Job understood well what happens after death and how/when the resurrection takes place; let’s see what he says:
Job 14:10-14 - But man dieth, and wasteth away: yea, man giveth up the ghost, and where is he? (yes, that is the very question at hand - where is he?) As the waters fail from the sea, and the flood decayeth and drieth up: So man lieth down, and riseth not: 1) till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep. O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave, that thou wouldest keep me secret, 2) until thy wrath be past, that thou wouldest appoint me a set time, and remember me! If a man die, shall he live again? all the days of my appointed time will I wait, till 3) my change come.

I numbered those parts for a reason. When we break down the references of what he says here we find the following:
1. 2 Peter 3:10 - But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2. Revelation 15:1-2 - And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvelous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God. And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.
3. 1 Corinthians 15:51-54 - Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
Here is another example of the sequence of events that occur; we experience death, get buried and stay there until Jesus returns, then we are raised up and given glorified bodies (if we are righteous), then we meet Christ in the air. It is very simple.

Lastly, let’s look at what Jesus Himself had to say about this:
John 14:1-3 - Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
Was Christ lying? Has Christ come again yet and received us? No. If He had come then the world would have been utterly destroyed (see 2 Peter 3:10)

(end part 2)

 

[reddogs]

State of the Dead (part 3)


Here is how it all comes together:
John 5:28-29 - Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
2 Timothy 4:6-8 - For I am now ready to be offered, and the time of my departure is at hand. I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith: Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.

Here is the best verse to explain it:
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 - But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

Basically, in today’s terms, here is what happens:
1. When we die we are truly dead; we know not anything, we do not praise God nor can we get any further reward; the body returns to the earth and the spirit/breath to God. Death is likened to sleep in the Bible over 23 times (*see last section of this paper). Some call it “sleeping in Christ” and some call it “soul sleep” – it doesn’t matter what you call it for it is what it is. “Sleeping in Christ” is just a poetic way of talking about the righteous that are dead – they are sleeping in Christ. And there is no mention anywhere in the scriptures that says the spirit is conscious, has memory, or is anything more than what it says it is - breath.
2. We get buried (usually – but it doesn’t matter to God how we are put to rest) and we stay there until Christ comes.
3. Now a split occurs when Christ returns; the righteous dead and living are called up in glorified bodies to meet Christ in the air to get our reward (eternal life) and the wicked dead stay in the graves and the wicked alive are slain at Christ's return (remember, there are TWO resurrections just as John 5:28-29, Dan12:2 and 1 Thess 4:16 states).
4. The alive wicked are slain by the Word of God and Satan is bound for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:2 & 3). After 1,000 years (known to some as the Millennium – see Rev 20:2-7) the righteous (saints) return to earth with Jesus and the wicked are resurrected in order to receive their judgment.
5. THAT is when the lake of fire is created and the wicked, along with Satan and with their sin, are destroyed for eternity (*see Rev 19:20 & Rev 20:10-15)
6. Then, and only then, is the new earth created for us for all eternity just as God’s plan originally meant for it to be (*see Isaiah 65:17, Isaiah 66:22, 2 Peter 3:13, and Revelation 21:1).

I'm not being hardheaded nor self-righteous; this is the clear truth of the Bible, God’s word to us and I have shown that it is repeated numerous times throughout the Bible. This is not the teaching of some denomination but only that of the Bible and the Bible alone. It bothers me that there are so many crazy theories out there in the Christian world about this topic; for if they just read the Bible themselves then there wouldn't be all this confusion and error. People would know that there isn't a secret rapture nor a seven-year triblulation afterwhich people get a second chance (the concept of which totally negates living by faith by the way). I'll be blunt, you are either "right" with God when you die or else you are lost, period. I hate to sound hard-nosed but that is just the way it is. Doubt that? Read the next section carefully. I'll address purgatory first.

I'll address the arguments people use in favor of the immortal soul or that the soul goes immediately to heaven/hell after death.
By now you should note that anything even resembling purgatory simply does not exist in the Bible. It does not fit chronolgically either. Catholics rely largely on "the pit" found in Revelation for this teaching but I think in doing so they overlook something; the fact that the Beast is there in chains for 1,000 years. Let's look at some of the key verses in Revelation 9 that talks about the pit - it is best if you read the entire chapter for yourselves though:
Revelation 9:1 - And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.
Revelation 9:2 - And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.
Revelation 9:11 - And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.
Revelation 11:7 - And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
Revelation 20:1 - And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.
Revelation 20:3 - And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.
A couple of things to note:
Abaddon (seen in Rev 9:11 above) is a Hebrew word meaning "the Destroyer" denoting the angel-prince of hell; also known as Satan; check your Concordance. Lucifer was/is an angel. This word is only used once in the scriptures. The above verses are talking about the ushering in, the time of, and the ending of the Millenium (see Rev 20:3). This isn't very hard to figure out - the bottomless pit is the earth (Rev 9:2 clues into that) at a time when Satan is the only one left alive on it. The judgement has not come yet (nor the lake of fire which is Hell as we know it) for that doesn't happen until Rev 19:20. Notice there is no mention of a place where people are tortured until they are "good enough" to then go on to heaven. Even the following terms (in their original Hebrew) never denoted the like:
Gehenna: was the place where children were sacrificed to the god Moloch and was originally in the "valley of the son of Hinnom," to the south of Jerusalem. When Jesus walked by it and saw the corpses in there He would tell his disciples "that is what the pit will be like" (paraphrase). Gehenna is only a figurative word for hell - not an actual. It generically means a place for the lost or unsaved, i.e. the damned. But here is the kicker - notice when it occurs - BEFORE the lake of fire during the 1,000 years that Satan is chained.
Sheol: simply means the grave, the place of burial. This word was translated "hell" but does not really mean "a place of everlasting fire" at all.

Conclusion: The notion of purgatory is totally alien to Biblical teaching. Purgatory is a uniquely Catholic teaching that has no Biblical support that I can find nor that makes sense when compared to the plain teaching of the scriptures.

People often quote “to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord”. This is probably the #1 misquoted verse in the Bible. Here is how the verse actually reads:
2 Corinthians 5:8 - We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
See the difference? Paul was not saying that being absent from the body equals being present with the Lord; he was saying (like any of us would agree) that he’d RATHER be absent from the body in order to be present with the Lord. That is all he was saying in this verse. Those who misquote or only give a partial verse are dangerous whether they be a preacher or anyone else for they are spreading a teaching of error that does not fit with the clear teaching of the scriptures.

Think on this verse for it makes it very clear:
Isaiah 26:19 - Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead.
It says “dead body” not spirit. The dead will be raised in a fleshy body. ALL the examples found in the scriptures support full fleshy body ressurection only.
(end part 3)

 

[reddogs]

State of the Dead (part 4)


The parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man

(The story of Lazarus and the Rich Man can be found in Luke 16:19-31, please read it now so that the rest of this makes sense.)

First off, we have to determine IF this is a parable; let’s examine it:

When Jesus told the parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man were there many people gathered?
Luke 15:1 - Then drew near unto him all the publicans and sinners for to hear him.
Ok, yes, there was a group/multitude present. Point #1.
Matthew 13:34 - All these things spake Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spake he not unto them:
Jesus spoke ONLY in parables to the multitudes. Point #2 and slam dunk just based off this, but let's go further:

Lazarus and the Rich man was the last parable out of 5 he told that day. Starting in Luke 16:1 Jesus tells the following parables: The parable of the Lost Sheep, the parable of the Lost Coin, the parable of the Lost Son, the parable of the Shrewd Manager, and the parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man. By the way, even the NIV translation defines this story as being a parable – thus not to be taken literally.

The parable of the Shrewd Manager begins EXACTLY like the parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man; “There was a certain rich man…..” How is that for putting together like topics?

Many people say that when we die our physical body returns to dust (which is true) but they also say that our “soul” goes to heaven without our body (oops - wrong). They go on to say that at the resurrection, our souls are reunited with our physical bodies and they become glorified. With that in mind let's look at the facts: the rich man in the parable was buried (Luke 16:22), yet the very next verse says he had EYES to look up with. Luke 16:24 says the buried Rich Man had a TONGUE. The parable also says Lazarus has a FINGER and Abraham has a BOSOM. Do these physical attributes apply to a soul? Not according to Jesus. Doesn’t that blow the theory of “our souls reunite with our bodies”? Jesus said in Luke 24:39 that a spirit does not have flesh and bones!!
Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; FOR A SPIRIT HATH NOT FLESH AND BONES, as ye see me have.
I think we should believe Christ, don't you?

John 14:1-3 says the eternal home of the saved is in heaven, not Abraham’s bosom:
John 14:1-3 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that WHERE I AM, there ye may be also.
Is Jesus in Abraham’s bosom? No. Study the scriptures and you will find what is meant by bosom and that will give you a clearer picture of what is going on here; I’ll just tell you now that “Abraham’s bosom” is not heaven. I strongly urge readers to find out for themselves.

In the parable a great gulf exists between Lazarus and the Rich Man. This gulf is so vast in expanse that it is impossible for those on one side to pass through to the other side. In spite of this, the Rich Man is able to recognize both Abraham and Lazarus as well as hold an intelligent conversation? Does that make sense? No. This story is a parable and thus not to be taken literally. This parable actually illustrates how one should live, not how we die.

Another argument that I’ve heard is that the “glorified body” that we receive is a spiritual body and not one of flesh and bone.
Luke 24:39 - Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
This is Christ talking to the apostles when they first see Him after He rose from the grave. Does Christ say here that He is in a spiritual body or a flesh one? More on this point below.

Let’s look at the example of Jesus and see how He ascended:
Luke 24:39 - Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
This verifies that Christ had a physical body, not a spiritual one, after He resurrected. Agreed?
And then we find: John 20:17 - Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
This verifies that Jesus had not yet ascended to heaven, agreed?
Acts 1:3 - To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God:
This shows that Jesus was here on earth for 40 days after His resurrection – He did not ascend immediately following death.
And finally:
Acts 1:11 - Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
Acts 1:22 - Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
Here it is told of Jesus ascending to heaven. No where does it indicate that only Jesus’ spirit went to heaven and His body stayed behind – on the contrary, the disciples watched Him ascend with their own eyes. And since there is no information to show any change in Christ’s presence (switching from body to spirit) the only logical thing that can be concluded from this is that Christ went up in bodily form.

Further, if we are taken up in spiritual bodies, and such bodies do not require food or drink then reconcile these verses for me:
Isaiah 36:17 - Until I come and take you away to a land like your own land, a land of corn and wine, a land of bread and vineyards.
Isaiah 65:17 & 21 - For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind…And they shall build houses, and inhabit them; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.
Do spirits require food, drink, and shelter? No. We go to heaven in a fully fleshy body (the whole living soul as defined in Genesis).

Some people have tried to say the following supports Jesus had a spiritual body after His resurrection and not a physical one:
John 20:19 - Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
Now, when you compare this verse to the others where Jesus clearly says He is flesh I think it is a huge assumption to say that Jesus walked through the wall (and was thus in a spiritual body) to be with His disciples. I’m not joking, that is what has been argued to me. The plain teaching of the Bible is that Jesus had a physical body after His resurrection and maintained that state even at His ascension. He probably entered the room via the door like anyone with a body of flesh would do; I know it doesn't say He used the door but the Bible also doesn't say Jesus dressed Himself either - see what I mean?

The big question concerning those that will burn in hell centers around the character of God. Do we agree that God is good and merciful? Yes. Is God fair? Yes. Is God a tyrant? I say no, He isn’t. With that said, how can people burn in hell for eternity? Wouldn’t that also mean they have eternal life? Would it be fair for Cain (who killed his brother) to burn in hell about 4,000 years longer than Hitler? It is this belief that "sinners burn in hell forever" that has caused so many to turn from God and the teachings of Christianity. The problem is that mainstream Christianity, not the Bible, erroneously teaches that hell burns forever and that gives the impression that we are serving a tyrant. That simply is not so – that teaching is alien to the scriptures. However, that study is outside the scope of this study even though they are related. Let me just say for now that hell is not eternal, the meaning of “for ever” in the Bible does not mean the ceaseless ages of eternity – it merely means “until it is done”. But like I said, that is another study. I encourage you to study that for yourself or look at my other study in this forum called Is For Ever ceaseless?.

What about ghosts and those who channel spirits?Revelation 12:9 - And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Matthew 24:24 - For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Basically, it is Satan’s total intent that he deceive the entire world and he will use great signs and wonders (along with his more subtle tactics) in order to accomplish this goal. For you see, deception causes people to distrust the Word of God; it makes people doubt. And doubt is all Satan needs to pull people away from God. Sometimes the line between truth and error is so thin that unless you know what the Bible actually says you can become lost and believe a lie. Study it earnestly!
(end part 4)

 

[reddogs]

State of the Dead (part 5 of 5)


Final note: In order to find the Biblical truth of any topic; whether it be state of the dead, prophecy, hell and hell-fire, the old or new covenant, etc; the way you do it is to get together ALL of the verses of the Bible that talk about the topic and compare them. Look at the topic from all sides and gather all the verses that aptly pertain. Also note the sequence of events - that is vital! Getting just one or two verses will almost always paint an incomplete picture – so don’t stand on just 1 or 2 verses. Get all the verses together and then you’ll know you have Biblical truth! Then there will only remain one question; are you going to follow the Bible or the traditions of men or a church? Think about that when you read:
Colossians 2:8 - Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
Mark 7:9 - And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
Matthew 15:3 - But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
Matthew 15:6 - And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.
Ephesians 5:6 - Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
2 Thessalonians 2:3 - Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

*Here are the verses where the Bible likens death to sleep in the Bible. Twenty three are listed here but I have been told there are many more:

1. Deuteronomy 31:16 - And the LORD said unto Moses, Behold, thou shalt sleep with thy fathers; and this people will rise up, and go a whoring after the gods of the strangers of the land, whither they go to be among them, and will forsake me, and break my covenant which I have made with them.
2. 2 Samuel 7:12 - And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom.
3. 1 Kings 1:21 - Otherwise it shall come to pass, when my lord the king shall sleep with his fathers, that I and my son Solomon shall be counted offenders.
4. Job 7:21 - And why dost thou not pardon my transgression, and take away my iniquity? for now shall I sleep in the dust; and thou shalt seek me in the morning, but I shall not be.
5. Job 14:12 - So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep.
6. Psalms 13:3 - Consider and hear me, O LORD my God: lighten mine eyes, lest I sleep the sleep of death;
7. Psalms 76:6 - At thy rebuke, O God of Jacob, both the chariot and horse are cast into a dead sleep.
8. Jeremiah 51:39 - In their heat I will make their feasts, and I will make them drunken, that they may rejoice, and sleep a perpetual sleep, and not wake, saith the LORD.
9. Jeremiah 51:57 - And I will make drunk her princes, and her wise men, her captains, and her rulers, and her mighty men: and they shall sleep a perpetual sleep, and not wake, saith the King, whose name is the LORD of hosts.
10. Daniel 12:2 - And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
11. Matthew 9:24 - He said unto them, Give place: for the maid is not dead, but sleepeth. And they laughed him to scorn.
12. Mark 5:39 - And when he was come in, he saith unto them, Why make ye this ado, and weep? the damsel is not dead, but sleepeth.
13. Luke 8:52 - And all wept, and bewailed her: but he said, Weep not; she is not dead, but sleepeth.
14. John 11:11 - These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep.
15. John 11:13 - Howbeit Jesus spake of his death: but they thought that he had spoken of taking of rest in sleep.
16. Acts 7:60 - And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep.
17. Acts 13:36 - For David, after he had served his own generation by the will of God, fell on sleep, and was laid unto his fathers, and saw corruption:
18. 1 Corinthians 15:51 - Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
19. Ephesians 5:14 - Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light.
20. 1 Thessalonians 4:13 - But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
21. 1 Thessalonians 4:14 - For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
22. 1 Thessalonians 4:15 - For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
23. 2 Peter 3:4 - And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

Even Tyndale, one of the great reformers of Protestantism, understood this concept well as did the early protestant churches:
WIlliam Tyndale: And ye, in putting them [the departed souls] in heaven, hell, and purgatory, destroy the arguments wherewith Christ and Paul prove the resurrection.... And again, if the souls be in heaven, tell me why they be not in as good case as the angels be. And then what cause is there of the resurrection?—William Tyndale, An Answer to Sir Thomas More's Dialogue (Parker's 1850 reprint), bk. 4, ch. 4, pp. 180, 181.

(end of essay)

 

[RccWarrior]

Wow, that's some cutting and pasting!!

 

[Knowledge3]

The soul created by God that undergoes the Dark Night of the Soul is graced and infused with immortality.

 

[Jimlarmore]

Good work Reddogs, this is a pretty comprehesive treatise on what the Bible teaches on the state of the dead and the immortality of the soul.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[Jimlarmore]

One of the reasons this incorrect doctrine of an immortal soul is so easily accepted is the very nature of mankind. God did not create man with the inclination of death or to want to die. God created man to live forever. The blue print for eternal life is in the cells of every living thing. The only reason we die now is because of the curse of sin and a few measly hormones that cause the aging process/catabolism to go on. Death is the enemy of men. No one wants to die and it's so easy to rationalize away the scriptures of God that tell us the dead know not anything Ecc 9:5.

Satan comes along and waves a carrot under our noses that we all desparately want to believe in and that is that the soul is immortal. This is a traditional doctrine handed down from ancient times but it is not supported by the Bible at all.


God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[redwine]

Good study Reddogs,

The oldest lie ever told still goes on strong in religion...

Here is what God said...

(Gen 2:16 LITV) And Jehovah God commanded the man, saying, Eating you may eat of every tree in the garden;

(Gen 2:17 LITV) but of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil you may not eat, for in the day that you eat of it, dying you shall die.


Here is what satan said...

(Gen 3:2 LITV) And the woman said to the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden,

(Gen 3:3 LITV) but of the fruit of the tree in the middle of the garden, God has said, You shall not eat of it, nor shall you touch it, lest you die.

(Gen 3:4 LITV) And the serpent said to the woman, Dying you shall not die,

(Gen 3:5 LITV) for God knows that in the day you eat of it, even your eyes shall be opened, and you shall be as God, knowing good and evil.


Peace.

 

[Eila]

Genesis 2 says "16And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, You may freely eat of every tree of the garden; 17But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and blessing and calamity you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."



Adam's body did not die that day and he went on breathing. What died?

 

[Tonks]

Closing temporarily. Thread under review

 

[Tonks]

This thread is being reopened for the time being. Carry on.

 

[Oye11]

Good work Reddogs,

What makes you assume that he did the "work"?

 

[Oye11]

Copy and paste okay? No problem, here goes...

Part 1

Does the Bible teach existence after death, or do we cease to exist, as Jehovah's Witness claim? And what of the soul-sleep of the Seventh Day Adventists?
First, let's look at what the Jehovah Witnesses believe. This comes from Charles Taze Russell being influenced by what was called Second Adventism, (meaning the second advent). This is before they became the Seventh Day Adventists where they based themselves on the Sabbath day belief. Jehovah Witnesses believe that when someone dies their personality and life is so united with the body that it ceases to exist. This not only occurs with believers, but also non-believers and with Jesus, so God has to refashion everyone by memory.
What we're dealing with here is re-creation. What they have is not a resurrection, because the individual's body and soul are carbon copied to exist later on Paradise Earth. This is what they teach as their good news of the kingdom. Everyone is going to live on paradise earth one day. one of the problems is if you die before the resurrection, well, you won't be there. You will not participate in the new earth because God will copy you from memory and your duplicate will be enjoying all the benefits of all your hard work for the kingdom. Of course, none of this is biblical, it's all fantasy and never going to happen. If we ask the Jehovah's Witness about this and explain this to those who come to our door it can strongly affect their false belief system and make them question what hope they have as a Jehovah Witness. So annihilations, which is what they teach, is not a biblical answer for how God deals with the after life of the soul and the body.
When we come to the subject of soul-sleep we find this view has been sporadically held throughout church history. The Ana-Baptists believed in this in the 1500's. King Edward VI stated in his fortieth article out of forty-two, that "The souls that do depart hence do sleep, being without all sense, feeling, or perceiving until the day of judgment, do utterly decent from the right that is closed to us in Holy Scriptures."
In modern times we have two well known major groups that hold to this teaching. One is Christadelphianism and the other is Seventh Day Adventism. Soul-sleep is the denial of man's conscious existence between when he dies and the resurrection day. It's what is called the intermediate state of the believer, in which their view is both the body and the soul lay rest in the ground.
Christadelphian's deny the existence of hell and they hold to what is called conditional immortality, as do the Seventh Day Adventists. What most groups do, who deny an immortal existence either with the Lord or in punishment in the hereafter, end up camping on the Old Testament Scriptures to prove their points.
We need to understand that there are a number of mysteries in the Bible that were not fully revealed until Christ came. This doctrine comes under that heading. It was concealed in the Old Testament and revealed in the New Testament. What most people do is look to the Old Testament Scriptures to validate this teaching such as Eccl. 9:5-6, "For the living know they shall die: but the dead know not any thing," or Psalm 146:4, "His spirit departs, he returns to the earth; in that very day his thoughts perish". Or Psalm 115:17, "The dead do not praise the Lord, nor any who go down into silence" or Psalm 6:5 "For in death there is no remembrance of Thee; in the grave who shall give Thee thanks? And of course, there is Ezek. 18:4, "the soul that sinneth, it shall die. "From these Scriptures and many others, the Seventh Day Adventists and other groups make their air-tight case that death is a peaceful sleep for the soul. Well, actually, it's not so air-tight, it's more like Swiss cheese. This means that it is spiritual death, a separation not a non existence. Otherwise they would cease to exist as soon as they sin. There are many scripture that say the soul is dead even when someone is alive, he is dead even when alive
When someone does a study on this or any other subject, they need to take all the body of literature and weigh it out and see which covenant these things were spoken under, are they a metaphor, is it a hyperbole, is it poetic? To make biblical sense out of this serious issue, we need to look at all the literature of that particular subject.
Because this is not just a spirit sleeping, waiting for the resurrection that is being promoted. This doctrine actually affects other crucial doctrines, such as eternal punishment and eternal life.
As I read the fundamental doctrines of Seventh Day Adventism, there are a few Scriptures either missing or purposely neglected which actually changes one's view on this particular subject, because they hold vital information on the afterlife. Before I go to that I'm going to walk us through the arguments and some biblical answers.
There is poetry in the Psalms, for instance Psalm 22:26:" The meek shall eat and be satisfied; they shall praise the Lord that seek him; your heart shall live forever." Now, logically, I don't think anyone takes this Scripture in its solid, literal sense or would believe that someone's physical heart is going to live forever while our body and our soul die. Our heart is not going to be outside our body living forever. The word heart obviously means something other than how we interpret it today. the intent of this word means something other than the physical organ. Proverbs 23:7 tells us as a man thinks in his heart, so is he, or Matt. 13:5, lest they should understand with their heart. Obviously there's an intent of this Scripture that means not just the physical organ.
Actually the word heart represents the inward man, his soul, his spirit, and is usually interchangeable throughout the Scriptures. Just as soul can be substituted for one's life, their heart, mind and body, so can the word heart. They are interchangeable throughout the Scriptures.
The main argument for those who promote soul-sleep are these: the word sleeping is for those who die, that it is unconsciousness (1 Thess.4:13-14, 1 Cor. 15:20,51). Some go so far to say that one's eternal destiny is determined, not at death, but later at the final judgment. And some will even claim that we can still repent, even in the afterlife. We don't find this is the Seventh Day Adventism but there are other groups that believe this kind of teaching.
So, let's look at the word sleep, because that's what's crucial here. What does sleep mean? The Bible uses this term when speaking of death in that the physical body, a dead body, looks very similar in this state. It's always referring to the physical body, not the soul. It is the appearance of the body that is sleeping, no one is able to see the spirit . It is also a term used exclusively for believers. The term sleeping, in reference to death, is not used for unbelievers. I find that to be crucial in understanding what the Bible is trying to portray to us when it says that the dead in Christ are sleeping.
Believers and unbelievers do not experience the same afterlife. So, sleeping is used for one who is in Christ, it is God' s viewpoint of a temporary suspension of physical activity, yet, there is a continuation of the mind and the soul, the personality.
Does the believer wake up in the resurrection? Is he put back in an immortal physical body? Yes, he is, yet, we never see a spirit resurrected because they have not died like the body. The term resurrection only applies to the body.
The Bible is very clear that the spirit can live outside the body. Angels can and do function outside a body and yet, they can also function within a body. We see they can possess people and actually there can be more than one spirit or fallen angels inside a body. Although this alone does not make a strong case for a continuation of an afterlife, it does show that a spirit can operate and function outside the body.

 

[reddogs]

Many denominations believe that the righteous dead immediately go to Christ as disembodied spirits. While this may seem to be a benign idea, it destroys the need for resurrection so strongly preached in the NT. Others, such as Roman Catholics, say that the dead go to a place of purging (Purgatory).

Clearly, if the dead have not gone on to a spirit existence, these ideas are incorrect. And if prayers are being offered to non-existent heavenly saints, they are worse than useless, they are idolatry. Idolatry is such a direct offense to God that it gets more mention in the Bible than almost any other sin. Certainly, it is something to be avoided. Therefore, we must be careful to examine the Biblical understanding of the state of the dead if we are to avoid committing such a sin unwittingly.

In studying any Biblical subject, you must be aware that if there are many references to that topic, they will not all necessarily be presented clearly. Some statements may be metaphorical. Others may be direct. Some will be poetic, and others parabolic. So you must seek out the clearest statements on the subject, and evaluate them. If there are direct statements which do not have confounding contexts, then it may rightly expect that those statements represent the basic truth of the matter. We may then proceed to less clear material, using the more clear to illuminate the less clear. We must never reverse this process, because to do so is to deny the truth of clear statements of scripture. The only time when it is proper to reverse an understanding based on a clear statement is when we discover that there is a confounding context which was not earlier appreciated.


Our first clear statement on the state of the dead comes from God’s pronouncement of the curse on Adam.

19 By the sweat of your face You shall eat bread, Till you return to the ground, Because from it you were taken; For you are dust, And to dust you shall return. " Gen 3:19
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Notice that God tells Adam that he is dust. God doesn’t say that Adam’s body is dust, but that Adam is dust. Similarly, God tells him that he will return to dust. There is no hint that part of Adam will go anywhere else. All of Adam will go to the ground. This ultimate destiny of man is revisited by Solomon.

19 For the fate of the sons of men and the fate of beasts is the same. As one dies so dies the other; indeed, they all have the same breath and there is no advantage for man over beast, for all is vanity.
20 All go to the same place. All came from the dust and all return to the dust.
21 Who knows that the breath of man ascends upward and the breath of the beast descends downward to the earth?
22 And I have seen that nothing is better than that man should be happy in his activities, for that is his lot. For who will bring him to see what will occur after him? Eccl 3:19-22
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Solomon points out that both men and animals have exactly the same fate. They will return to dust.

4 For whoever is joined with all the living, there is hope; surely a live dog is better than a dead lion.
5 For the living know they will die; but the dead do not know anything, nor have they any longer a reward, for their memory is forgotten.
6 Indeed their love, their hate, and their zeal have already perished, and they will no longer have a share in all that is done under the sun. Eccl 9:4-6
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Here Solomon tells us that you have hopes as long as you are alive. Once you die, all your hopes die. This does not say that there is no hope of resurrection, but rather, your awareness of your hopes and dreams ceases, because the dead are unaware (v. 5). He then emphasizes the point by saying that all involvement of the dead with the affairs of the living has "perished" (v. 6). The Hebrew word "abad", here translated "perish", describes a complete and total destruction, so that nothing whatever is left. As in our previous texts, there is no hint here of a disembodied "soul" which survives the death of the body.
Explicit references to death in the OT continue with the Psalms.

17 The dead do not praise the LORD,… Psalm 115:17a
4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish. Psalm 146:4 (KJV)
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Many suggest that the souls of the dearly departed are taken up into heaven to be with Jesus. If they were in heaven they would be continually praising God (Rev 4:8-11; 15:2-3; 19:1-7). Yet here we are explicitly told that they cannot be in heaven, because the dead do not praise the Lord. The Psalmist makes it even more explicit.

5 For there is no mention of Thee in death; In Sheol who will give Thee thanks? Psalm 6:5
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This shows that in the explicit passages regarding the state of the dead, there is no separation of the living soul or man into parts, where one dies and the other goes to heaven (or some other place).
Solomon was not content to simply say that the dead do not know anything (Eccl 9:5), he says it four different ways here! Not only are the dead without brain function, there is no brain function of any type by any person or spirit in the place of the dead. It is tough to be more emphatic about this.
As we study the less direct or figurative statements, we must keep in mind that those statements cannot contradict what we have already discovered. If there are contradictions between statements on the same subject, one of two things must be true: 1) we do not understand the statements because there is some element of them which we have misunderstood, or 2) the Bible is not the word of God. Since we all agree that the Bible is the word of God, we have to reassess our understanding if there are apparent contradictions. And, as we have noted before, when clear didactic statements are present, they are the standard against which all other statements must be understood.

It is common in the OT to refer to death figuratively as a "sleep". We see thirty-six statements (not counting variants) where someone is referred to by the form "so and so slept with his fathers" (1 Ki 2:10, etc.) In every case, the reference is to the death of the individual. The verb commonly used is "shachav", which means to lie down to rest. This is seen in God’s statement to Moses that he will not enter the promised land.

16 And the LORD said to Moses, "Behold, you are about to lie down with your fathers; Deut 31:16a
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It is important to note that the Lord Himself is using this metaphor. Another Hebrew word used is "yashen". It directly refers to sleep in the common sense. This is a natural nightly phenomenon from which the individual awakes in the morning.

3 Consider and answer me, O LORD, my God; Enlighten my eyes, lest I sleep the sleep of death, Psalm 13:3
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We should note that the literal translation is "lest I sleep the death". The words "sleep of" are added. It is impossible not to note that death is regarded as a form of sleep. However, it is a sleep from which man could not awaken from on his own. The prospect of resurrection, while not as obvious as in NT discussions, is intrinsic to the metaphor.
This leads to two aspects of death for which the sleep metaphor which is highly important. First, it is a natural state of unconsciousness. During this period there is no purposeful activity. Second, it leads to an expected arousal, implying the assurance of a later awakening. This is the prophecy and the promise given to Daniel.

2 "And many of those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake, these to everlasting life, but the others to disgrace and everlasting contempt.
13 "But as for you, go your way to the end; then you will enter into rest and rise again for your allotted portion at the end of the age." Daniel 12:2, 13
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We first note the combination of Gen 3:19 with the metaphor of "sleep". Gabriel is clearly telling Daniel that the location of the sleep is the "dust" from which man came, not some heavenly realm. Then Daniel is to go to his own rest, secure in the knowledge of his ultimate awakening to eternal life. But we must be most emphatic in noting that Daniel’s reward comes at the end of time, not at his death. There is no hint of any reward prior to the resurrection.

In the NT, we find this same metaphor in use. At Christ’s death, a number of saints were resurrected.

52 and the tombs were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised;
53 and coming out of the tombs after His resurrection they entered the holy city and appeared to many. Matt 27:52-3
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The "bodies" of the sleeping saints were raised. Since they walked around Jerusalem, it is clear that the whole person was raised. We have no indication that there was a "joining" of disembodied souls with the bodies, so this nicely fits the metaphor. A similar form is used in the familiar story of Lazarus.

11 This He said, and after that He said to them, "Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep; but I go, that I may awaken him out of sleep."
12 The disciples therefore said to Him, "Lord, if he has fallen asleep, he will recover."
13 Now Jesus had spoken of his death, but they thought that He was speaking of literal sleep.
14 Then Jesus therefore said to them plainly, "Lazarus is dead, John 11:11-14
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At first, Jesus tells the disciples that Lazarus is sleeping. They make the natural conclusion that he will wake up. Jesus then clears up their confusion by saying that Lazarus is dead. In the raising of the son of the widow of Nain, we find this metaphor again.

14 And He came up and touched the coffin; and the bearers came to a halt. And He said, "Young man, I say to you, arise!" Luke 7:14
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The verb translated "arise" is "egiero", which literally means "to wake up". This verb is also used in the story of the raising of Jairus’ daughter (Mark 5:41). This repetitive use of the sleep metaphor for death is no accident. Jesus properly understood sleep as a time when the dead were utterly unaware, but could awaken to the voice of God. These three examples bring us to our next point.

Advocates of the idea that the disembodied essence of a man goes to heaven at the death of the body have a problem. If these persons died, went to heaven, and returned to their bodies, they should have a tale to tell. Yet not one of the three had such a story. In fact, they had no story whatever. They give no evidence of having had any awareness whatever while dead. When we look at the stories of resurrected individuals in the Bible (1 Ki 17:17-24, 2 Ki 4:25-37, Luke 7:11-15, Luke 8:41-56, Acts 9:36-41; 20:9-11), not one of these people has any story of heaven. In order to believe that the "soul" goes to heaven at the death of the body, we must believe that all these people saw the most unimaginably beautiful place in the universe, met the most glorious person (God), and had nothing whatever to say on their return. This proposition boggles the mind. After all, the leper who was healed (Mark 1:40-45) told everyone who would hear of the miracle, after Jesus instructed him not to! To not tell of infinitely greater wonders that would have been seen is simply impossible.

One more resurrection must be examined here. In this case, we have direct testimony as to whether the dead person’s soul went to heaven. On Sunday morning, Mary Magdalene went to Christ’s tomb to anoint His body. This was about thirty-six hours after He died on the cross.

17 Jesus said to her, "Stop clinging to Me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to My brethren, and say to them, 'I ascend to My Father and your Father, and My God and your God.'" John 20:17

​

Jesus had laid in the tomb dead. He tells Mary that He had not been to heaven. If the "soul" of a dead person immediately goes to heaven, why didn’t Jesus’ "soul" go to heaven when He died? Could it be that there is no separate "essence of a man" to go to heaven? Could it be that the texts we reviewed which plainly say that death is a sleep are true? Jesus used the metaphor, and He meant it.

But what about Jesus’ statement to the thief on the cross?Jesus promised salvation to the thief. Our question here is: Just when would he receive the reward? If we believe the translation, the thief should have received it that very day. But notice the key phrase. The thief was to be "with Me" that day in Paradise. Jesus told Mary that he had not gone to paradise. Therefore, if the reward was to be that day, Jesus was not correct or the translation of his promise is not correct.
The solution to this problem lies in the fact that the Greek text contains no commas, so with the correct placement it reads correctly.

Certain apologists for the immortality of the soul argue that this is not correct, since the Jews of the century before Christ believed in the dual view of humanity: body and soul which separate at death. There are two basic answers for this objection. First, Jesus spent his entire ministry correcting false ideas. In this case, he dealt with the state of the dead repeatedly. After all, the Pharisees and the Sadducees had a major argument over whether there would be a resurrection. So Jesus invested a great deal of effort in teaching the truth.

Second, the concept of dualism was not Jewish. Throughout the OT (the last books of which were written about 400 years before Christ), there is a consistent understanding of death. We have explored the outline of it above. The first century BC Jews imported pagan ideas into their thinking. In particular, they brought in the Platonic dualism of "body and soul". Plato believed that the flesh was evil, but that the spiritual part of man was good. Therefore, when man died, the evil body was destroyed, but the good "spirit" would return to its origin in the spirit world. This belief system grew into what we know as gnosticism. Much of the thinking was adopted from those who surrounded the Jews.
It is of note that when the gospel went to the Gentiles, large numbers of them were former gnostics. It is impossible for a new convert to lose all of his old ideas immediately. Also, when the apostles died, their writings became the primary source of teaching for new converts. Thus, many gnostic ideas crept into Christianity. The dualism promoted by Plato found its way into the interpretive literature. Since the ancients did not have the easy study tools we have today, it was far more difficult to root out such heresy, particularly when there seemed to be more pressing issues such as the human and divine natures of Christ to be understood. The pagan Platonic dualism view of the nature of man crept in, and has hung on for millennia.

 

[reddogs]

I guess you didnt take into account time is relative, when you are living forever, and a billion years is but a nano second, eating from the tree and having to die in (relative to his living infinitely), a few years is death. Adam's body did begin to die that very day and he stopped breathing because the wages of sin was death. Read the scriptures with a prayer to the Spirit of God to give you understanding.

Genesis 5:3-5
3 When Adam had lived 130 years, he had a son in his own likeness, in his own image; and he named him Seth. 4 After Seth was born, Adam lived 800 years and had other sons and daughters. 5 Altogether, Adam lived 930 years, and then he died......

 

[Oye11]

Part 2

When we come to the subject of soul-sleep we find this view has been sporadically held throughout church history. The Ana-Baptists believed in this in the 1500's. King Edward VI stated in his fortieth article out of forty-two, that "The souls that do depart hence do sleep, being without all sense, feeling, or perceiving until the day of judgment, do utterly decent from the right that is closed to us in Holy Scriptures."
In modern times we have two well known major groups that hold to this teaching. One is Christadelphianism and the other is Seventh Day Adventism. Soul-sleep is the denial of man's conscious existence between when he dies and the resurrection day. It's what is called the intermediate state of the believer, in which their view is both the body and the soul lay rest in the ground.
Christadelphian's deny the existence of hell and they hold to what is called conditional immortality, as do the Seventh Day Adventists. What most groups do, who deny an immortal existence either with the Lord or in punishment in the hereafter, end up camping on the Old Testament Scriptures to prove their points.
We need to understand that there are a number of mysteries in the Bible that were not fully revealed until Christ came. This doctrine comes under that heading. It was concealed in the Old Testament and revealed in the New Testament. What most people do is look to the Old Testament Scriptures to validate this teaching such as Eccl. 9:5-6, "For the living know they shall die: but the dead know not any thing," or Psalm 146:4, "His spirit departs, he returns to the earth; in that very day his thoughts perish". Or Psalm 115:17, "The dead do not praise the Lord, nor any who go down into silence" or Psalm 6:5 "For in death there is no remembrance of Thee; in the grave who shall give Thee thanks? And of course, there is Ezek. 18:4, "the soul that sinneth, it shall die. "From these Scriptures and many others, the Seventh Day Adventists and other groups make their air-tight case that death is a peaceful sleep for the soul. Well, actually, it's not so air-tight, it's more like Swiss cheese. This means that it is spiritual death, a separation not a non existence. Otherwise they would cease to exist as soon as they sin. There are many scripture that say the soul is dead even when someone is alive, he is dead even when alive
When someone does a study on this or any other subject, they need to take all the body of literature and weigh it out and see which covenant these things were spoken under, are they a metaphor, is it a hyperbole, is it poetic? To make biblical sense out of this serious issue, we need to look at all the literature of that particular subject.
Because this is not just a spirit sleeping, waiting for the resurrection that is being promoted. This doctrine actually affects other crucial doctrines, such as eternal punishment and eternal life.
As I read the fundamental doctrines of Seventh Day Adventism, there are a few Scriptures either missing or purposely neglected which actually changes one's view on this particular subject, because they hold vital information on the afterlife. Before I go to that I'm going to walk us through the arguments and some biblical answers.
There is poetry in the Psalms, for instance Psalm 22:26:" The meek shall eat and be satisfied; they shall praise the Lord that seek him; your heart shall live forever." Now, logically, I don't think anyone takes this Scripture in its solid, literal sense or would believe that someone's physical heart is going to live forever while our body and our soul die. Our heart is not going to be outside our body living forever. The word heart obviously means something other than how we interpret it today. the intent of this word means something other than the physical organ. Proverbs 23:7 tells us as a man thinks in his heart, so is he, or Matt. 13:5, lest they should understand with their heart. Obviously there's an intent of this Scripture that means not just the physical organ.
Actually the word heart represents the inward man, his soul, his spirit, and is usually interchangeable throughout the Scriptures. Just as soul can be substituted for one's life, their heart, mind and body, so can the word heart. They are interchangeable throughout the Scriptures.
The main argument for those who promote soul-sleep are these: the word sleeping is for those who die, that it is unconsciousness (1 Thess.4:13-14, 1 Cor. 15:20,51). Some go so far to say that one's eternal destiny is determined, not at death, but later at the final judgment. And some will even claim that we can still repent, even in the afterlife. We don't find this is the Seventh Day Adventism but there are other groups that believe this kind of teaching.
So, let's look at the word sleep, because that's what's crucial here. What does sleep mean? The Bible uses this term when speaking of death in that the physical body, a dead body, looks very similar in this state. It's always referring to the physical body, not the soul. It is the appearance of the body that is sleeping, no one is able to see the spirit . It is also a term used exclusively for believers. The term sleeping, in reference to death, is not used for unbelievers. I find that to be crucial in understanding what the Bible is trying to portray to us when it says that the dead in Christ are sleeping.
Believers and unbelievers do not experience the same afterlife. So, sleeping is used for one who is in Christ, it is God' s viewpoint of a temporary suspension of physical activity, yet, there is a continuation of the mind and the soul, the personality.
Does the believer wake up in the resurrection? Is he put back in an immortal physical body? Yes, he is, yet, we never see a spirit resurrected because they have not died like the body. The term resurrection only applies to the body.
The Bible is very clear that the spirit can live outside the body. Angels can and do function outside a body and yet, they can also function within a body. We see they can possess people and actually there can be more than one spirit or fallen angels inside a body. Although this alone does not make a strong case for a continuation of an afterlife, it does show that a spirit can operate and function outside the body.

 

[Oye11]

Part 3

There are numerous passages that teach that humans are conscious after their death, so let's look at a few. Matt. 17:1-8 and Luke 9:28-36 are just a few of the passages on the transfiguration where we find Moses and Elijah appearing on the Mount with Jesus and a few of His disciples. Elijah was taken to heaven alive while Moses died a physical death, yet, Moses is consciously alive just like Elijah. Moses couldn't have been resurrected because Christ is to be the firstfruits of the resurrection and he had risen yet. While Christ raised may from the dead they were people that recently died not old Testament saints dead for hundred of years. There were others raised to life on earth on earth by Jesus only to die again later. But, here is someone who is dead for 1,500 years, so it isn't Moses' decomposed body brought back out of the ground as a resurrection, this was a spiritual appearance.
Jesus taught that he is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of the living, not of the dead, referring to Exodus 3:5, I am who I am, insinuating that all these prophets were still living. This silenced the Sadducee’s who challenged Him on this matter because they did not believe in an afterlife. So we have Moses here, appearing in spirit. That is the only plausible explanation because, again, Jesus had to be the first body resurrected unto eternal in life in that way.
Paul himself relates a story in the New Testament In 2 Cor. 12:1-4 in which, fourteen years before, he was caught up to the third heaven. This is the place where God dwells. He calls this place Paradise and he was awed by the experience and the things that he heard but, he wasn't sure if this occurred in his body or without his body, so he wasn't sure if he was alive or dead when this event occurred. Now obviously, his corruptible body could not enter heaven since all must go through transformation to be able to function there. Mortal flesh is unable to enter heaven, as Jesus said, flesh and blood cannot enter, so there has to be some kind of transformation to enter in there.
What happens to believers, according to the Bible, at death? This is the question we're pondering about as far as soul-sleep. Do we just rest in the ground just like our body? What exactly happens to our body, what exactly happens to our soul? The Bible speaks about a material and immaterial part of man. We find in Gen. 3:19 our bodies are made of the earth and they return to the earth. In Phil. 1:23-24, Paul states that he desired to depart to be with Christ, which is far better. Now, Christ is in heaven, He's not in the ground, so if this was soul-sleep, he being with Christ, Christ would have to be in the ground. Paul goes on to say, nevertheless, to be in the flesh is more needful for you. so he wanted to stay to help out the saints in the church and fulfill his ministry.
We also find in 2 Peter 1:13, Peter talks about putting off his tabernacle, or tent, calling it a temporary dwelling place. James 2:26 tells us the body without the spirit is dead. He doesn't say the spirit also dies, he says the body without the spirit dies. In Gen. 35:18, speaking of Rachel, it tells us, her soul was departing and she died. The spirit exists afterwards and gives us life, when he leaves the body it dies. The body dies and goes back into the ground, yet the spirit continues on with a life of its own.
Eccl. 12: 6-7 describes in poetry the shattering of life, that the dust returns to earth, and the spirit returns to God who gave it. Yet, earlier, in verse 5, he writes a man goes to his eternal home and mourners go about the streets. So Solomon is speaking about those who turn to God as he started off this chapter, stating remember your Creator in the days of your youth, before difficult days come. And then he speaks about our eternal home. If it is sleep in the grave, as people are claiming, then that means we are going to stay in the grave, the ground, forever, if our soul actually sleeps. They are using this scripture in a way that it's an eternal home in the ground and we are never to be raised up. Of course, that is not what it means.
One of the scriptures they use is Eccl. 9:5, the dead know nothing. Now this is true, since it is the body that dies, that part of the man which dies and goes into the ground, knows nothing. But there is a part of man that flies away at death and returns to God who gave it, Psalm 90. So, Those who believe, go to rest in Christ. It couldn't mean only our breath since that would not go to God but to the atmosphere.
Many of the Old Testament Scriptures, rather that showing a state of unconsciousness of the soul, are really languages of appearance, that after death they had the inability to continue the process that was normal while they were here on earth in their bodies. So it is a language of appearance as man's perspective is looking at the body functions. Yet, in Heb. 9:27 we find after death, the judgment, in other words one goes either to heaven or to hell, and it is determined at death, not afterwards. So we go to rewards, to rest, or to punishment and eternal separation. Death is not a cessation of existence, but a separation of existence. We have choices to make now that will effect our eternal destiny. Jesus knew very well of this and he warned of it constantly.
Now, what of the Scripture in 1 Tim. 6:16 speaking of God, who alone has immortality? The Scripture applies mortal and immortality to one's bodily condition. It is the body that is mortal, never the soul, or spirit. For example, Paul writes in 1 Cor. 15: this mortal will put on immortality, speaking of the resurrection of our bodies. Likewise, in 1 Tim. 6:16, he's speaking of Jesus as the immortal God/man. Spirit, by its own nature, is a deathless entity. God is spirit, and so are angels. God is spirit and fashioned man in the image of Himself, and, while God has always existed, no beginning or end, he has given mankind a limited similarity, like Himself, something that lives on. The body is described as mortal the soul is never described in these terms. Paul states this mortal must put on immortality (1 Cor.15:53). He is speaking of a resurrected body just as it was said in 2 Pt.1:13 to put off this tent as a temporary dwelling. In. Rom. 6:9: "Knowing that Christ having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over him." Therefore 1 Tim.6:16 means he alone has immortality as his nature and being the first fruit raised in the resurrection.
In our human experience our spirit never feels old, no matter how old the body gets our spirit inside does not feel the same age. If one becomes an invalid it doesn’t affect their spirit, their spirit does not also become an invalid , it essentially is unaffected by the outer person it still is free. Science tells us our body renews all its cells every 7 years. If we were only our body we would have to relearn everything again because all of our knowledge is contained in the physical aspect of man. But this again is not so, even the bible shows people who died in heaven remembering and recognizing others.
The New Testament teaches Spirit existence after death as doctrine. James says the body without the spirit is dead not the spirit itself. For example, in Rev. 6:9-10, we see souls who have been slain, under the alter of God, asking the Lord to avenge them. We find they are conscious and they are speaking. The soul and personality of each one of us lives on. Jesus taught in Matt. 10:28, Fear not those who kill the body but are not able to kill the soul, but rather fear him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. The Greek word for destruction, aplollumi, has numerous meanings. We have to look at the context it's put in. It can mean perish, lost, destroy, to render useless, or to give over to eternal misery, and I believe that is the correct rendition when we look at where he's saying the soul will be in the afterlife of those who disobey the Gospel.
In Matt. 25:46 there are those in the judgment who go into everlasting punishment and those who go into everlasting life. The same Greek word means eternal and forever. If there is no eternal punishment, then the same word that is applied for eternal life means there is no eternal life, ever. So the Greek, appropriated to both these places that destined for those who either believe or not believe, means eternal. Likewise in Luke 16, the story of the rich man and Lazarus. Jesus always used real-life situations to illustrate His teachings. In this story He actually names the person. Jesus does not teach fictitious stories and it's not a parable, in my opinion, because He actually names a person, which He did not do in parables.
These are living conditions in the afterlife of torment and peace. The New Covenant has revealed what was unclear in the Old Testament writings. 2 Cor. 4:16,18 tells us "though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day. . . .While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal." Now here, Paul applies the outer man to the temporal and the tabernacle we live in, and the inner man to the eternal. In the following verse he states, "For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens" Here is the scripture that is often neglected and, put in context, we find it fully elaborating on the continual existence of man, 2 Cor. 5:1-8. He sums it all up in verse 8 saying, we are always confident knowing that while we are home in the body we are absent from the Lord. and he goes on to say to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. When all our earthly tent is dissolved, we can be assured that we will be in the presence of the One we serve and we love here on earth We will be further clothed. This is the Scripture that is consistently neglected by those who promote soul-sleep. As in Phil.1:23 Paul states to be with Christ is far better. This would be impossible if we go to sleep in the ground with the body.
Likewise, in 1 Thess. 4:13-17, we are told that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him. Then he states, those who are alive will not precede those who have fallen asleep. The Lord from heaven will come down with a trumpet call and the dead in Christ will rise first. And then those who are alive will be caught up together with them in the air with the Lord forever.
Since the resurrection did not occur before this event, who is Jesus bringing with him from heaven? They don't have bodies, the resurrection hasn't occurred, so they are immaterial souls that will be united with their bodies at this resurrection event. They existed fellowshipping with the Lord in heaven. Jude says the Lord comes with ten thousands of His saints. Paul describes this event in 1 Cor. 15:51 Behold, I show you a mystery; we shall not all sleep, but we shall be changed. When? At the last trump. The dead are raised incorruptible, and then he goes on to describe that mortal will put on immortality. So he's talking about our bodies. Then death, he states, is swallowed up in victory; our souls are not dead because we were made alive in Christ.
Rom. 8:11 says, But if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who dwells in you.
There is a day of uniting with those who fell asleep in Christ, with their bodies to be transformed and live forever, and the hope of the believer is that, whether we live or die, we are to be with the Lord. It is stated in the Scriptures, I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor height, death, nor any other created thing shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is Christ Jesus our Lord.
If you're in Christ be persuaded, be encouraged, we have assurance. Yet, there are many other people all around us who don't have this assurance and I hope that we will be the ones to bring the good news to them. We should not sorrow as the world does (1 Thess.4:16-18)

http://www.letusreason.org/Doct15.htm