Why Mormons Leave

[Peter1000]

Now thinking about it..... I'm wrong in what I've said... I have been baptized but not by water by by the Holy Spirit.

That's important too. Glad to hear it.

 

[Sophrosyne]

This is again a false picture of LDS beliefs. Do you know that?

Tell me why dead people need to be baptized then if it isn't for salvation then what?

 

[Peter1000]

I forgot this one too added onto the end of the previous one. Noticed we don't see "AND BAPTISED" here

Romans 10:13New American Standard Bible (NASB)
13 for “Whoever will call on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

I notice you are not using Mark 16:16, why not?

 

[Sophrosyne]

That's important too. Glad to hear it.

Not according to you since I didn't get H2O on me I'm not "saved" by Mormon standards.

 

[Sophrosyne]

I notice you are not using Mark 16:16, why not?

I've already discussed that scripture..... why are you IGNORING all my multiple scriptures here that show NO mention of baptism.. INCLUDING the woman that was pronounced as SAVED by Jesus? Did Jesus save her without baptism or not?

 

[Peter1000]

Here is another "no baptism" story from Jesus himself.

Luke 7:43-50New American Standard Bible (NASB)
43 Simon answered and said, “I suppose the one whom he forgave more.” And He said to him, “You have judged correctly.” 44 Turning toward the woman, He said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave Me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. 45 You gave Me no kiss; but she, since the time I came in, has not ceased to kiss My feet. 46 You did not anoint My head with oil, but she anointed My feet with perfume. 47 For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.” 48 Then He said to her, “Your sins have been forgiven.” 49 Those who were reclining at the table with Him began to say to themselves, “Who is this man who even forgives sins?” 50 And He said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”

Does this scripture trump Mark 16:16?

 

[Peter1000]

I'm not baptized.... so you say I'm not a Christian now? I believe I'm saved by the blood of the lamb that was slain.
Do you see any mention of Baptism here?

John 3:16-22New American Standard Bible (NASB)
16 “For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. 18 He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 This is the judgment, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the Light, for their deeds were evil. 20 For everyone who does evil hates the Light, and does not come to the Light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21 But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God.”

Does this scriptue trump Mark 16:16?

 

[Peter1000]

If you read ALL of Paul's writings he says BY GRACE (NO Baptism mentioned at all) we are Saved.

If you read ALL the words of Jesus, there is no mention of GRACE, but there is a mention that baptism is necessary to be saved. see Mark 16:16. Are the words of Paul more powerful than the words of Jesus?

 

[Sophrosyne]

Does this scripture trump Mark 16:16?

No, it doesn't trump it.... but it does trump your opinion of Mark 16:16. You have to explain the contradiction here along with all
the scriptures of Paul that OMIT baptism... I don't because I've already explained myself you however haven't explained nothing.

 

[Sophrosyne]

Does this scriptue trump Mark 16:16?

nope.. but it trumps baptism needed for salvation

 

[Peter1000]

No such scripture equating baptism by proxy... that is a made up thing mormons do because some deluded "prophet" thought it up on a whim.

1 Corinthians 15:29
29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?
When you read this scripture in the bible it has the words, "baptized for the dead" twice.

This scripture does not prove the Mormon doctrine of "baptism for the dead", but it does prove that there were people going around to the graveyards and digging up corpses and baptizing them for the dead (just kidding).

Seriously, it does prove that people were in fact "baptizing for the dead" at the time of Paul. Some of these people were Sadduceas, who did not believe in the resurrection, and so Paul asked them a very important question: if you don't believe there is a resurrection, and you don't believe people will rise from the dead, why are you baptizing for the dead?

So JS did not make up the doctrine, the bible mentions it 1830 years before JS. JS just found out from Jesus why these people in the bible were baptizing people for the dead and restored the proper doctrine in our day. Not on a whim, but by commandment of Jesus Christ.

 

[Ironhold]

God leads people out. Others who abuse their wives, cheat on their wives, and molest children stay in. Some are caught; some aren't.

Trust me: there are those who weren't led out by God.

For example, author Loftes Tryk was ex'd because he was convicted of a sex crime, something that he neglected to tell everyone in his little tell-all.

 

[Goatee]

I am an adulterer and i hope God has forgiven me! I have repented so much! I have fallen so much!

I dont want to go there again!

 

[Sophrosyne]

You say: Notice it does NOT say he that isn't baptised is damned here...

Jesus is not silly. If a person does not believe, they will be damned. Jesus also knew that a person that does not believe, will not be baptized, it is sort of given. So he didn't need to say if you don't believe and are not baptized, you will be damned, because an intelligent person would know that a person who does not believe, will not go get baptized in the name of the Father and the Son, and the HS. Jesus knew this, so no need to mention it.

Jesus isn't silly in that if baptism is required he would have mentioned it every time salvation is mentioned instead of leaving it out.

You say: at pentacost, I don't hear any mention of water baptism.

Are you sure you want to say this, OK, you have already said this. So now go and read:
Acts 2:38
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

This instruction from Peter was on the day of pentacost, and he was talking to a large crowd of people. They believed him and asked Peter what they should do. This is what Peter told them. So on the very day of pentacost Peter told them to be baptized.

So what you don't understand is that the bible conflicts all over the place about what one needs to do to be saved. This discussion highlights this confusion. mmksparbud and you have given us many scriptures and they are say different ways to be saved, did you notice this? That's why we say that the Christian churches today are in an apostacy status, because of the confusion of the word of God. This discussion also highlights the need for a true prophet of God in our day to help reconcile the bible, and know what the real truth is. It can only be unraveled by Jesus Christ, and in our day, that is through his prophet of God. That's why I say that Mormonism is the great reconciler of the bible.

Baptism here was to receive the Holy Ghost....

 

[Sophrosyne]

...and again, nothing is forced.

The baptism opens the door for them.

They still decide if they wish to enter through it.

If baptism has power then how can one decide to ignore that power? The fact is water baptism has no power at all in salvation and is unneeded. The "door" is Jesus and rejecting that door will do nothing when dead baptism isn't a savior.

 

[Truthfrees]

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