Why do you, if you believe in "evolution" deny that there is most likely a "God"...?

[RedPonyDriver]

Just remember that what actually happened in the beginning - for now I'll say no more - is inherently unlikely to be decided by what a contemporary majority is pleased to want to believe.

ya know...to save my sanity and to avoid wasting my breath (or electrons), you're getting added to my ignore list. I've had enough.

 

[Armoured]

Why do you, if you believe in "evolution" deny that there is most likely a "God"...?

Of all the earth like planets out there, consider (those of you who believe in evolution) how many of them have, or more accurately "have had" long before us, have had lifeforms like us, on them... Probably billions, trillions perhaps, possibly even more... Would you deny that at the very least, at the very least, a "few" (but probably much more than that), continued evolving, some way, way, WAY "Beyond" us...

Consider the "limits" of physicality as it pertains to exploring and traversing the incredible vastness of the universe... Now of these "few" (but, probably many more), "how many" do you think "evolved" beyond being trapped and limited by physicality and physical matter and the "limits" of physical material "forms"...? And perhaps found a way to perhaps not even needing to be a part of the "physical", (as we define physical), universe... Becoming something else...?

Possible...?

What do you think these lifeforms would "do" in the universe as it pertains to lifeforms like us, who are now, what they once used to be, long, long ago...? Would they show themselves openly to us from the "realm", for lack of a better word, from which they now operate...? Could they even do that from there without having to manifest a physical form that isn't really their true form, because their true from cannot be seen from "this realm", this reality...? How would they interfere and choose to affect, guide and direct us, if they so chose to do so....?

Would they still exist long after this realm of physicality, this universe as we know it, comes to and end...? Did they exist "before" this realm of physicality or this physical universe even began...? Did they create this universe and perhaps others...?

As you can see, the God concept is not as "illogical" as you may think... And you guys who truly believe in "evolution" when considering the entire universe, should be able to see that the possibility is not only highly likely, but even a mathematical certainty...

God Bless!

There's plenty of evolution accepting people who believe in God, so I think your fundamental point is flawed.

 

[Jimmy D]

Consider the "limits" of physicality as it pertains to exploring and traversing the incredible vastness of the universe... Now of these "few" (but, probably many more), "how many" do you think "evolved" beyond being trapped and limited by physicality and physical matter and the "limits" of physical material "forms"...? And perhaps found a way to perhaps not even needing to be a part of the "physical", (as we define physical), universe... Becoming something else...?

Possible...?

What do you think these lifeforms would "do" in the universe as it pertains to lifeforms like us, who are now, what they once used to be, long, long ago...? Would they show themselves openly to us from the "realm", for lack of a better word, from which they now operate...? Could they even do that from there without having to manifest a physical form that isn't really their true form, because their true from cannot be seen from "this realm", this reality...? How would they interfere and choose to affect, guide and direct us, if they so chose to do so....?

So there are these timeless mega-beings who aren't even part of our physical reality? To these beings the history of life on Earth must seem shorter than a picosecond, yet one of them decides to start ordering us about, telling us not to be gay, eat shellfish etc.

Sounds feasible.

 

[doubtingmerle]

Look, I'm only trying to get strong, strict evolutionists most of which flat out deny the even the possibility of a creator God, or spirits or an invisible realm, "thinking" by stepping into their arena and line of thinking saying that the way they think, kinda proves that God or Spirits are not only very highly likely, but, based on the way they think almost mathematically impossible to deny...

Actually extraterrestrial spirits that interact with us are quite easy to deny. The distances in space are so immense, it is unlikely that any other creatures who may have evolved elsewhere would ever reach us. Perhaps some day we will receive radio waves from a distant civilization. We are actively looking for those. So far we have found none.

The nearest galaxy to us is 2.5 million light years away. If there were intelligent creatures that we tried to dialog with on that galaxy, it would take 5 million years from the time we asked them a question until they gave their response. That hardly can be called dialog. That is the reality we live with.

It is 50,000 light years to the center of the Milky Way. So if there are one or two other civilizations in the Milky Way that could communicate with us, it would probably still take many generations before they could answer a question we sent them. Additionally, at those distances, radio waves are so diluted, they are hardly distinguishable from background noise, so communication may be impossible.

So there is no denial that there may be creatures out there that we may be able to hear from. It is highly doubtful that we will ever communicate with such creatures that will be close enough to have meaningful dialog.

But it is a long way from saying there may be other civilizations out there, to saying a God created this universe, and favored one tribe of ancient warring people in the Mid East over other ancient tribes. And that is where this thread is headed, yes?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

You DO realize that creationists are a minority...right?

True believers have always been a pretty small group. "Fear not little flock..........".

 

[AirPo]

Why do you, if you believe in "evolution" deny that there is most likely a "God"...?

Critial thinking skills.

Of all the earth like planets out there, consider (those of you who believe in evolution) how many of them have, or more accurately "have had" long before us, have had lifeforms like us, on them... Probably billions, trillions perhaps, possibly even more... Would you deny that at the very least, at the very least, a "few" (but probably much more than that), continued evolving, some way, way, WAY "Beyond" us...

Consider the "limits" of physicality as it pertains to exploring and traversing the incredible vastness of the universe... Now of these "few" (but, probably many more), "how many" do you think "evolved" beyond being trapped and limited by physicality and physical matter and the "limits" of physical material "forms"...? And perhaps found a way to perhaps not even needing to be a part of the "physical", (as we define physical), universe... Becoming something else...?

Possible...?

What do you think these lifeforms would "do" in the universe as it pertains to lifeforms like us, who are now, what they once used to be, long, long ago...? Would they show themselves openly to us from the "realm", for lack of a better word, from which they now operate...? Could they even do that from there without having to manifest a physical form that isn't really their true form, because their true from cannot be seen from "this realm", this reality...? How would they interfere and choose to affect, guide and direct us, if they so chose to do so....?

Would they still exist long after this realm of physicality, this universe as we know it, comes to and end...? Did they exist "before" this realm of physicality or this physical universe even began...? Did they create this universe and perhaps others...?


As you can see, the God concept is not as "illogical" as you may think... And you guys who truly believe in "evolution" when considering the entire universe, should be able to see that the possibility is not only highly likely, but even a mathematical certainty...

God Bless!

If your God concept is based on this flawed argument, then it's even more illogical than I thought.

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Critial thinking skills.

Rare as hen's teeth and frog's hair around here

 

[Neogaia777]

So there are these timeless mega-beings who aren't even part of our physical reality? To these beings the history of life on Earth must seem shorter than a picosecond, yet one of them decides to start ordering us about, telling us not to be gay, eat shellfish etc.

Sounds feasible.

Well, I am glad that you do not deny at the very least the "possibility", unless you meant that with a measure of sarcasm...? Did you...?

As for those last few parts about ordering us around, the one of them that did (J.C.)(YHWH) knows what has destroyed, and had a prior knowledge of what had destroyed other civilizations like us, before us "out there"... We just don't seem to see the danger... The only difference between him and The Father is that he didn't seem to know "why" he couldn't get us to listen or obey, or see the reason behind what he was doing, or why he couldn't "save us"... Until he became "one of us" that is... And, even then he still made one last ditch effort to "try"... He understands "now" though...

God Bless!

 

[MasonP]

Well, I am glad that you do not deny at the very least the "possibility", unless you meant that with a measure of sarcasm...? Did you...?

He did, I suspect he wrote it with a smile on his face and a sadness in his heart for you.

 

[Neogaia777]

He did, I suspect he wrote it with a smile on his face and a sadness in his heart for you.

What's wrong with you people...? I'm open to many different possibilities, and this is only one, don't be sad for me, keep that for yourselves, I'm on exciting journey pondering "all" the vast possibilities of existence and experience in this life... Yet, you still deny even the possibility of what I propose, that makes me sad for you...

Why do outright eliminate it as such...?

See these please (if you will please):

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...-own-pre-conceived-notions-and-ideas.7967470/

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...-on-numbers-all-of-it-we-can-observe.7967464/

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...ll-he-really-find-faith-in-the-earth.7966847/

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/ship-in-a-bottle.7964503/

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...ions-or-fabrics-or-layers-of-reality.7964616/

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/understanding-our-triune-god-beginning-to-end.7963339/

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/what-does-it-mean-to-be-human.7966263/

God Bless!

 

[MasonP]

What's wrong with you people...? I'm open to many different possibilities, and this is only one,

That's nice, but what you are not open to is the fact that you could be wrong, unless you are open to that then you are not open at all, you are in fact the exact opposite, you are closed minded.

 

[RedPonyDriver]

I'm open to many different possibilities, and this is only one,

Are you willing to make a serious study of evolutionary biology, cosmology, paleontology and archeology? Are you willing to take a look at other cultures' creation myths?

If not, you're not.

 

[Neogaia777]

That's nice, but what you are not open to is the fact that you could be wrong, unless you are open to that then you are not open at all, you are in fact the exact opposite, you are closed minded.

Oh, I'm very willing to admit that, especially if it is (wrong), and welcome it, for I know that not all "my" theories are right or correct, but that's why I call them theories and ideas... One of my links I provided explains how very willing and open I am to that possibility and why I welcome that...

This explains it: http://www.christianforums.com/thre...-own-pre-conceived-notions-and-ideas.7967470/

I'm very acutely aware that it is a process...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

Are you willing to make a serious study of evolutionary biology, cosmology, paleontology and archeology? Are you willing to take a look at other cultures' creation myths?

If not, you're not.

I'm trying to see a the big picture right now, that requires, due to my human limitations, in order to get at what I'm seeking, that I know a "little bit" about each one, and not get to bogged down in details that do not matter when it comes to the big picture...

I am currently looking into other cultures creation myth's and flood stories... I have to limit myself to just what I need to get at what I'm wanting... So, serious study as in depth, no, not so much... I'll give you an example, someone was sharing with me details about information they had about what was going to happen in the near future, the job sector, the economy, technology changes and advancements, basically, a lot of details... I read all of it, and took it all in, but only took and kept what I felt I needed for what I wanted, and discarded the rest... Only about 5-10% of it I found very useful for me and my purposes... I am willing and am doing similar things with different fields of study and knowledge everyday...

I'm in a process and am learning and growing in new things everyday...

God Bless!

 

[MasonP]

I am currently looking into other cultures creation myth's and flood stories...

Why would you think that your creation myth and stories are any better or more reasonable than any of the others?

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

..To suggest that evolution, which is a physical process which acts on physical molecules which in turn builds physical bodies which are then subject to a physical fitness test (=natural selection), can somehow lead to non-physical beings , is absurd to the highest degree.

I made this same point (less forcefully!) recently in the 'What does it mean to be human' thread, to no effect.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

I'm trying to see a the big picture right now, that requires, due to my human limitations, in order to get at what I'm seeking, that I know a "little bit" about each one, and not get to bogged down in details that do not matter when it comes to the big picture...

There's a happy medium to be found between getting 'bogged down' in details and being ignorant of the fundamentals. Instead of thinking about a 'little bit' of the topic, consider picking up the fundamentals.

... I read all of it, and took it all in, but only took and kept what I felt I needed for what I wanted, and discarded the rest... Only about 5-10% of it I found very useful for me and my purposes... I am willing and am doing similar things with different fields of study and knowledge everyday...

For subjects you don't know much about, the risk is that you throw the baby out with the bath water because you don't know enough to know what's really worth keeping. This is the Dunning-Kruger effect ('little do they know how little they know').

The other risk is that you keep only what agrees with your belief system. This is confirmation bias, often associated with belief bias.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

As for those last few parts about ordering us around, the one of them that did (J.C.)(YHWH) knows what has destroyed, and had a prior knowledge of what had destroyed other civilizations like us, before us "out there"... We just don't seem to see the danger... The only difference between him and The Father is that he didn't seem to know "why" he couldn't get us to listen or obey, or see the reason behind what he was doing, or why he couldn't "save us"... Until he became "one of us" that is... And, even then he still made one last ditch effort to "try"... He understands "now" though...

If you're serious about alien 'gods', it might help to get some perspective - there are anything from 100 to 400 billion stars in the galaxy (here's just one billion of them mapped, to give you some idea - pick out a single star and think of it as the sun). There are at least 100 billion galaxies in the observable universe (here's a scale display to give you some idea).

Are you seriously suggesting some hyper-advanced god-like alien(s) evolved somewhere in all that vastness, and rather than take an interest in the (possibly millions of) advanced interplanetary or interstellar civilizations scattered around, were bored enough to find and take an interest in the beliefs of a particular tribe of primitive ape on a small planet of an ordinary star among billions in a spiral arm in the suburbs of an anonymous galaxy that is one of a hundred billion... seriously?

 

[doubtingmerle]

Possible...?

What do you think these lifeforms would "do" in the universe as it pertains to lifeforms like us, who are now, what they once used to be, long, long ago...? Would they show themselves openly to us from the "realm", for lack of a better word, from which they now operate...? Could they even do that from there without having to manifest a physical form that isn't really their true form, because their true from cannot be seen from "this realm", this reality...? How would they interfere and choose to affect, guide and direct us, if they so chose to do so....?

You seem to be making a huge jump from saying something is possible, to saying it is probable, to saying it happened. Scientists regularly have a hunch that they think is possible. They then explore it to see if they can form a reasonable hypothesis. Then they test the hypothesis against alternate explanations to see if it can be confirmed.

So can you please get beyond the broad range of possibilities, and suggest a working hypothesis you want us to consider? For instance, are you asking us to believe that a space alien who went by the name YWHY somehow formed and took control of the solar system, and did the acts recorded in the Old Testament? Are you suggesting that this alien might have created the earth in 7 days, flooded the entire earth in Noah's day, raised people from the dead, and caused the sun to stand still for hours?

If not, what are you asking us to consider?

What's wrong with you people...? I'm open to many different possibilities, and this is only one, don't be sad for me, keep that for yourselves, I'm on exciting journey pondering "all" the vast possibilities of existence and experience in this life.

What is wrong is that you have not defined clearly what you want us to consider. Please state clearly what you think this space alien, YHWH, did.

Are you open to the view that the universe began with the Big Bang about 13 billion years ago, that stars and planets formed by natural forces, that elements formed in the stars, that one collection of elements from the stars formed the earth about 4.5 billion years ago, and that single cell life originated and then evolved on that planet? Since you are open to all views, is that one of the views you are open to?

 

[-57]

I'm a different breed of creationist, did you watch the video in my link in the prior post, I'd like to hear your take on it...

God Bless!

Are you a believer in the gap theory?