Why Do Some Churches Preach Sin-Consciousness?

[Alithis]

(1Jn 3:9) Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.


(1Jn 3:10) In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil...

I think I've laid these scriptures out a hundred times over the years to folks surrounding this topic of righteousness, and other than Oscar's "Amen" a few days ago, most have burned me at the stake, condemning me for pride and justifying my self and then throwing First John verses at me then end up calling me a liar....
Thank you Oscar.
I don't see many who understand this and you're Amen was like a breath of fresh air.

you've not been burned at the stake ..you've been misunderstood .
Christ in me (his seed) can't sin.. ..i can .its a will thing .
i wont say more because to many say too much already
i only have Christ..my hope of glory. beyond knowing him every thing i think i know i don't know and everything i think i don't know i don't know
all i have is Christ Jesus ....

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

And if you say you are without sin..."we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us." So either John is mistaken or you are deceived and the truth is not in you, which one is it?

The person convicted of the Holy Spirit needs to confess that he is a sinner as the first step to being converted to Christ. He has to recognise sin in himself before he can accept Christ. Once he has accepted Christ all his sin is laid on Jesus so he no longer has to identify himself as a sinner because Jesus became sin for him. He now identifies himself as totally righteous in Christ. That's what John is talking about in this verse.

 

[ToBeLoved]

This doesn't alter the fact that in Christ we are seated at the right hand of God, clothed completely in the Righteousness of Christ and that God no longer sees our sins at all. If people want to live below their privilege, then the monkey is on their shoulders, not Gods. If we want to see the power of God in and through our lives, we need to think of ourselves and our standing with Christ as God sees us. All you are doing is giving very valid reasons why much of our church is just powerless religion and does not reflect how the Holy Spirit wants to move powerfully through the Church to make disciples for Christ.

I've never heard anyone analyze that in Christ we are seated in the position of God Himself at the right hand of the Father!

Woah, that's a stretch. That's such a stretch I can't believe that you committed that to written words. That is INCORRECT in ALL KINDS OF WAYS.

I didn't know that we are god now? Have you been listening to Benny Hinn's little gods theory?

 

[ToBeLoved]

The person convicted of the Holy Spirit needs to confess that he is a sinner as the first step to being converted to Christ. He has to recognise sin in himself before he can accept Christ. Once he has accepted Christ all his sin is laid on Jesus so he no longer has to identify himself as a sinner because Jesus became sin for him. He now identifies himself as totally righteous in Christ. That's what John is talking about in this verse.

Paul understood that 'postitionally' in Christ we are FORGIVEN sinners. However, that as Christians in the flesh, not yet given our FULL inheritance, that we still sin.

We are to walk BOLDLY in Christ, knowing that our sin is FORGIVEN. We are not to walk thinking we no longer sin.

Why can you not see the difference?

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I've never heard anyone analyze that in Christ we are seated in the position of God Himself at the right hand of the Father!

Woah, that's a stretch. That's such a stretch I can't believe that you committed that to written words. That is INCORRECT in ALL KINDS OF WAYS.

I didn't know that we are god now? Have you been listening to Benny Hinn's little gods theory?

Ephesians 2:5-7:
5even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.…

Mark 16:9
After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God.

I am amazed that you don't know this. I wonder where you are getting your doctrinal teaching from. Obviously it's not from the Bible. You ought to fire the guy who is teaching you doctrine and find someone who can give you good teaching in sound, scripture-based doctrine.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Ephesians 2:5-7:
5even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.…

Mark 16:9
After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, he was taken up into heaven and he sat at the right hand of God.

I am amazed that you don't know this. I wonder where you are getting your doctrinal teaching from. Obviously it's not from the Bible. You ought to fire the guy who is teaching you doctrine and find someone who can give you good teaching in sound, scripture-based doctrine.

I don't think that says that WE are seated at the right hand of God. That is a position for God Himself. Jesus is the Son and God, so of course He is there. HOwever, we have not received our full inheritance yet.

Of course, in Christ, heaven is our home, but not the right hand of God on the throne. That is a position specifically for the Son.

You do stretch scripture like silly putty. Remember that stuff from childhood?

I think it's very bad theology. Very bad and inaccurate.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I don't think that says that WE are seated at the right hand of God. That is a position for God Himself. Jesus is the Son and God, so of course He is there. HOwever, we have not received our full inheritance yet.

Of course, in Christ, heaven is our home, but not the right hand of God on the throne. That is a position specifically for the Son.

You do stretch scripture like silly putty. Remember that stuff from childhood?

I think it's very bad theology. Very bad and inaccurate.

If according to Mark 16:9, Jesus went up and sat at the right hand of God, and we, according to Ephesians 2:6 we are raised up and seated with Christ, then where else would we be? Surely? Simple comprehension.

 

[ToBeLoved]

If according to Mark 16:9, Jesus went up and sat at the right hand of God, and we, according to Ephesians 2:6 we are raised up and seated with Christ, then where else would we be? Surely? Simple comprehension.

Obviously we disagree on your interpretation of this scripture. I'll leave it at that.

 

[Gideons300]

Paul understood that 'postitionally' in Christ we are FORGIVEN sinners. However, that as Christians in the flesh, not yet given our FULL inheritance, that we still sin.

We are to walk BOLDLY in Christ, knowing that our sin is FORGIVEN. We are not to walk thinking we no longer sin.

Why can you not see the difference?

But we are to walk believing that God will keep us from sin, amen? When satan comes tempting, do we hold up the shield of faith that promises to quench that arrow? Do we trust that despite still being housed in a fleshly body, we, the new us, is not in the flesh anymore and owes the flesh nothing. I agree with Oscarr. How can we ever be overcomers if it is impossible to overcome? It is never we that do not sin, but Christ who keeps us from it. The results may seem like someone has defeated sin and people see that as impossible. What they do not see is that if we truly believe that we are crucified with Christ and it is now Christ who lives in us, that shield of faith will keep us from sinning. Who gets the glory? God. Who gets the benefit of such an amazing grace. Every single one of us, IF we simply dig into the word, see the very clear promises of God, and arm ourselves with them.

The vast majority of believers have rested content with forgiveness, but with no hatred of the sin in their lives that caused Jesus to have to endure the cross to begin with. When a man or woman is drawn deeper, to learn the HOW of possessing their vessels in sanctification and honor, HOW to walk as a living sacrifice, How to bring their body under... and keep it under, it is then that they see that their entire thought process must be overhauled. We see.... and accept...that we can't stop sinning. Now, we can either stop there, or we can "go on to perfection", not by our strenuous efforts, but by arming ourselves with the promises of our Father who cannot lie, believing that He can...and will... keep us from falling into sin if we will but trust and believe that we owe the flesh nothing anymore. Yes, we are housed in fleshly bodies, but Paul is clear in Romans 8. We are not in the flesh (fleshly nature) any longer. If we will truly believe this, we will find to our amazement that we can say no to satan no matter the strength of the temptation.

I hope this helps.

Many blessings,

Gideon

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

But we are to walk believing that God will keep us from sin, amen? When satan comes tempting, do we hold up the shield of faith that promises to quench that arrow? Do we trust that despite still being housed in a fleshly body, we, the new us, is not in the flesh anymore and owes the flesh nothing. I agree with Oscarr. How can we ever be overcomers if it is impossible to overcome? It is never we that do not sin, but Christ who keeps us from it. The results may seem like someone has defeated sin and people see that as impossible. What they do not see is that if we truly believe that we are crucified with Christ and it is now Christ who lives in us, that shield of faith will keep us from sinning. Who gets the glory? God. Who gets the benefit of such an amazing grace. Every single one of us, IF we simply dig into the word, see the very clear promises of God, and arm ourselves with them.

The vast majority of believers have rested content with forgiveness, but with no hatred of the sin in their lives that caused Jesus to have to endure the cross to begin with. When a man or woman is drawn deeper, to learn the HOW of possessing their vessels in sanctification and honor, HOW to walk as a living sacrifice, How to bring their body under... and keep it under, it is then that they see that their entire thought process must be overhauled. We see.... and accept...that we can't stop sinning. Now, we can either stop there, or we can "go on to perfection", not by our strenuous efforts, but by arming ourselves with the promises of our Father who cannot lie, believing that He can...and will... keep us from falling into sin if we will but trust and believe that we owe the flesh nothing anymore. Yes, we are housed in fleshly bodies, but Paul is clear in Romans 8. We are not in the flesh (fleshly nature) any longer. If we will truly believe this, we will find to our amazement that we can say no to satan no matter the strength of the temptation.

I hope this helps.

Many blessings,

Gideon

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

 

[ToBeLoved]

But we are to walk believing that God will keep us from sin, amen? When satan comes tempting, do we hold up the shield of faith that promises to quench that arrow? Do we trust that despite still being housed in a fleshly body, we, the new us, is not in the flesh anymore and owes the flesh nothing. I agree with Oscarr. How can we ever be overcomers if it is impossible to overcome? It is never we that do not sin, but Christ who keeps us from it. The results may seem like someone has defeated sin and people see that as impossible. What they do not see is that if we truly believe that we are crucified with Christ and it is now Christ who lives in us, that shield of faith will keep us from sinning. Who gets the glory? God. Who gets the benefit of such an amazing grace. Every single one of us, IF we simply dig into the word, see the very clear promises of God, and arm ourselves with them.

The vast majority of believers have rested content with forgiveness, but with no hatred of the sin in their lives that caused Jesus to have to endure the cross to begin with. When a man or woman is drawn deeper, to learn the HOW of possessing their vessels in sanctification and honor, HOW to walk as a living sacrifice, How to bring their body under... and keep it under, it is then that they see that their entire thought process must be overhauled. We see.... and accept...that we can't stop sinning. Now, we can either stop there, or we can "go on to perfection", not by our strenuous efforts, but by arming ourselves with the promises of our Father who cannot lie, believing that He can...and will... keep us from falling into sin if we will but trust and believe that we owe the flesh nothing anymore. Yes, we are housed in fleshly bodies, but Paul is clear in Romans 8. We are not in the flesh (fleshly nature) any longer. If we will truly believe this, we will find to our amazement that we can say no to satan no matter the strength of the temptation.

I hope this helps.

Many blessings,

Gideon

But we are to walk believing that God will keep us from sin, amen? When satan comes tempting, do we hold up the shield of faith that promises to quench that arrow? Do we trust that despite still being housed in a fleshly body, we, the new us, is not in the flesh anymore and owes the flesh nothing. I agree with Oscarr. How can we ever be overcomers if it is impossible to overcome? It is never we that do not sin, but Christ who keeps us from it. The results may seem like someone has defeated sin and people see that as impossible. What they do not see is that if we truly believe that we are crucified with Christ and it is now Christ who lives in us, that shield of faith will keep us from sinning. Who gets the glory? God. Who gets the benefit of such an amazing grace. Every single one of us, IF we simply dig into the word, see the very clear promises of God, and arm ourselves with them.

The vast majority of believers have rested content with forgiveness, but with no hatred of the sin in their lives that caused Jesus to have to endure the cross to begin with. When a man or woman is drawn deeper, to learn the HOW of possessing their vessels in sanctification and honor, HOW to walk as a living sacrifice, How to bring their body under... and keep it under, it is then that they see that their entire thought process must be overhauled. We see.... and accept...that we can't stop sinning. Now, we can either stop there, or we can "go on to perfection", not by our strenuous efforts, but by arming ourselves with the promises of our Father who cannot lie, believing that He can...and will... keep us from falling into sin if we will but trust and believe that we owe the flesh nothing anymore. Yes, we are housed in fleshly bodies, but Paul is clear in Romans 8. We are not in the flesh (fleshly nature) any longer. If we will truly believe this, we will find to our amazement that we can say no to satan no matter the strength of the temptation.

I hope this helps.

Many blessings,

Gideon

It is not impossible to overcome sin at all. I have overcome many sins. I just know that I still sin. The Word talks about sin and overcoming sin a lot in the Word and much of it is directed at believers.

Just because one 'still' sins, doesn't mean I haven't overcome a lot. I have, praise God!

 

[emekrus]

Brother, what you say sounds good to us, for to believe sin really has no more power or authority over us and that we really can be kept from sinning is so high, so hard... so impossible, that what you say must be the logical conclusion, unless...... unless we have missed one key element of the gospel. I believe we have.

It is wonderful to know and rejoice in the fact that when Christ died, we died with Him. In the same way, it is great to know that when Christ rose from the dead, so did we. But there is another step that we are asked to take. Paul tells us that because we know this, we are asked to do something. We are asked to reckon ourselves dead to sin and alive unto God. Our heavenly Father asks that we combine these wonderful truths with our faith that it is true for US..... right now. We are told to put off our old nature, the one that sins, that does its will rather than God's whenever they conflict. We are asked to believe that our old nature is dead. We are asked to believe that we really do have new natures and that God will actually keep "the new us" from sinning, because He has promised that He would.

Your premise is that even if we do sin in real time, those sins are invisible to God. I can think of several verses right off that make it impossible, however. The scripture in James 4 is a great example. The letters to the churches in Revelation is another. Did God tell each church that what He saw was totally pleasing to Him, and that He saw no sin? Nope. He saw the good, the commendable, and He saw the bad that needed repentance. I do not know exactly what "being spit out of the mouth of God" really means, but we all know this much.... it is not good.

We are told to not deceive ourselves. He that doeth righteousness, is righteous, even as He is righteous. We are told that if we see a brother in need, and pray a nice prayer with him, but do not help him, how dwells the love of God in us? It is a rhetorical question. It does not. He not only sees our sins, but the thoughts and intents of our hearts. John tells us that IF we sin....not when but IF.... then if we repent and turn from the sin, and confess it before God, He is faithful and just to forgive us and to cleanse us of all unrighteousness. If we do not, and continue on along our path of sin and grieving the Spirit, then we are in truth rejecting the correction and chastening of the Spirit and we are in essence rebuilding that which He destroyed, as we are making ourselves transgressors again.

If God sees us as perfect, how is it that the Spirit chastens us? Is this not making us sin conscious? Do we ignore God when the needed correction or paddling comes? Are we to attribute that voice to satan and not God, because it is making us sin conscious? If sin is in our lives, the path laid out before us is confession and repentance, and THEN for us to believe again that we are new creatures in Christ.

When satan comes tempting, do you not see that if we have not actually appropriated our new natures, and put off the old sinful flesh, and come into full agreement with God that we owe the flesh nothing, we have no shield to protect us? What matter is it if we give in..... again.... if God never sees it? Of course He sees it, and He longs for us to pick up our shield of faith that shouts back at the accuser of the brethren "That WAS me, satan, but that is not me any longer. I am a new creature and my God can and will keep me from falling. He will deliver me from the power of darkness." And
satan, totally frustrated, has no answer for that. Why? It is truth.

The miracle we have for the most part never yet believed is this. God WILL keep us from sinning, if we will simply believe it to be true. Faith works. Do we believe this? Up till now, pretty much universally NO. But it is as you say. Either we lean on our logical minds.... OR.... we believe our God and use His words, His amazing promises as weapons of war. We fight back, and praise God, we win, every time. That is why God tells us that He will not allow us to be tempted above our ability to withstand it. No matter how big or small, we can be kept from falling. Our sins are not to become invisible to God, but non-existent. Glory.

Brother, this is far from "theory". Over six years ago, God met me and showed me what I had missed. I had no armor, no shield. I had the blood of the lamb but no words of my testimony about what that blood accomplishes. Who overcomes? He that combine one with the other. Until we do, we will find that we are still satan's fodder, and that no matter how much we long to be free from the power of sin, it will still be our master, and yes, God will still see it.

There is real deliverance from the fleshly nature. We can be caused to walk in full 100% obedience, but first we must hate our old nature that looks for any opportunity to do its thing. Real holiness is possible. In truth it is guaranteed. But we will not find the highway of holiness until our hearts are so miserable as we continue to live as the old natured man, that we, like Paul, cry out for the deliverer to come and deliver us.

The world is unimpressed with our form of holiness that is all words but no actions. They call it hypocrisy. When we they again look and listen to u as so many did with the church in the first century? God gives us that answer and we are to be a part of it.

"....and the heathen shall know that I am the Lord, when I shall be sanctified in you before their very eyes."

That is not positional holiness, as we cling to the hope that when we sin, God simply casts a blind eye towards it. What is coming is real, heart changing, character refining, loved filled saints of God, armor on, swords sharpened, and most importantly, shields of faith us as to who we are in Him. We are new, but as yet, it has not profited us, not being mixed with faith in our hearts. Thank God He is lovingly awakening us to the truth we have missed, then we can indeed actually put off our old nature, and disassociate from it. We can, praise God, put on our new natures, that can and will be caused to obey God in ALL things.

The only question that remains is..... will we remain content to continue to sin and live fleshly, worldly lives, trusting that God cannot see it, or will our desire to walk like Christ, to love like Christ, to hate evil like Christ put us on our knees and cry out to Him to open our eyes to the truth, so tat we can then arm ourselves with Christ in us and with the old us dead, and walk out our lives as overcomers, free indeed.

Will we really believe what the Word tells us? It tells us that sin has no more dominion over us, that the power of sin is broken over us. It tells us that we are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwells in us. It tells us we owe the flesh NOTHING. It tells us that He will not allow us to be tempted to the point we cave in. It tells us that our shield of faith in what Jesus has accomplished in us WILL quench ALL the fiery arrows of the enemy. What will we believe?

Blessings, brother

Gids

My dear brother Gideon I love you so much, because of the truth I find in you here. God bless you so very much.
Contrary to popular opinion that folks like us who are 'righteousness craving' but mistaken to be sin-conscious, do not walk in the Power of God, it is the folks who are allowing themselves to be deceived by this appropriated righteousness that do not have much result to show.

You know, as a result of their hearts caked with unconfessed and recalcitrant sins, the power of God is far-fetched from many of them. All they do is to approach God with bold-face instead of holy boldness in order to get answer.

While on the other hand, the folks who are hitting the nail right on the head are seeing the move of God in an extra ordinary way. Please my dear brother, never give ear to this end-time delusion (From the pit of hell) of appropriated righteousness and all-grace sermons.

 

[Gideons300]

My dear brother Gideon I love you so much, because of the truth I find in you here. God bless you so very much.
Contrary to popular opinion that folks like us who are 'righteousness craving' but mistaken to be sin-conscious, do not walk in the Power of God, it is the folks who are allowing themselves to be deceived by this appropriated righteousness that do not have much result to show.

You know, as a result of their hearts caked with unconfessed and recalcitrant sins, the power of God is far-fetched from many of them. All they do is to approach God with bold-face instead of holy boldness in order to get answer.

While on the other hand, the folks who are hitting the nail right on the head are seeing the move of God in an extra ordinary way. Please my dear brother, never give ear to this end-time delusion (From the pit of hell) of appropriated righteousness and all-grace sermons.

Thank you brother, and it is good o see you here. I hope you post more.

The truth is, what I share IS all grace, LOL. We simply have been blinded to what grace is capable of and think it makes up for what is lacking in our walks. But praise God, He has shown me in a most remarkable and experiential way that when we finally come to Him with NO strength, NO goodness, and all the righteousness we think we are possessing as filthy rags, we are finally in the position to ONLY believe.

Faith is, in my mind, not an act of strength but the ultimate act of weakness, where we confess that unless Christ does it for us, we will never walk as He desires of us. I so love the 36th chapter of Ezekiel, where God lays out the coming new covenant and exactly what it is to accomplish for us. After telling us that he will forgive us, He promises to "cause us" (His exact words in the KJV) to walk obediently. What was the flaw in the old covenant? They continued not in it. Disobedience. We have concluded that under the new covenant, grace makes obedience unnecessary. Nice of course. Even desireable. But our hearts, hardened by sins, even little ones if there be such a thing, cannot fathom how God can actually cause us to will AND to do of His good pleasure.

Why is this? Many reasons. First, our ministers do not walk in it or believe it it possibls neer preacheded. Secondly, we have made the promises of our God something to embroider on a wall hanging, but as to believing them? Our earthly minds cannot wrap our heads around it. You see, when we believe what Paul told us we must KNOW in Romans 6, our heads nod, but our hearts are unmoved. We do not see that God asks something of us. No, not works. Not more effort. He asks us to PUT OFF the old nature, and confess that OUR old nature died. We must make it personal. We must then appropriate for ourselves the brand new hearts, new natures, that can indeed "grow up into Him in all things".

I did not come to this conclusion by my "deep" study. I was brought to this by God in a visitation almost seven years ago now after watlking for 38 years as a Christian was also a ball and chain inappropriate content addict and very angry man. I wanted to be holy to honor the Lord, but I knew not how. I have fasted for up to 21 days,pastored, memorized large portions of the word, and all to no avail. The temptation would come, and I would fall.....again. But that amazing night, when I was ready to walk away from God if I could not honor and obey Him, He met me and pointed me to Romans 6:6. He asked me...

"In all your trying, did you ever do what I asked you to do through Paul?"

I knew exactly what He was referring to. I wasted no time. I spoke. I spoke out loud. Loud enough for God to hear me. Loud enough for satan to hear me, But most importantly, I spoke loud enough for MY own ears to hear me. Why? Because faith comes by hearing, even if it is our own mouths that are speaking the truth that sets free indeed.

" I reckon myself dead to sin and alive to God because I have been crucified AND resurrected with Christ. I put off the old nature and put on my new man and believe that I am no longer in the flesh but in the Spirit and owe the flesh NOTHING. I now hold up my shield of faith that no weapon formed against me shall prosper, and trust that God will cause me to walk in obedience to His Spirit within me."

I cannot even express adequately what the last seven years have held for me. To look in the mirror and see the change He has and continues to make to my life is joy unspeakable and full of glory. To see the sins that once bound me like a ball and very short chain simply fall away, what can I say, except to praise our God. Has it led to pride? No, just the opposite. On the highway of holiness, we know how weak we are, but we also see how strong Christ in us is, and that changes everything.

The final awakening is coming. Just as stated in Ezekiel 36, God has et to be inquired of by His people to DO IT FOR THEM. And when we break and admit our great need, He will move on us, and breathe on our faith, and the church, long asleep holding onto half 0f of the covenant, is about to awake and discover how deep grace really goes.

It is coming. It is mind blowing. And praise God, it is sure to all who love the light and desire to BE light. Even the weakest among us will walk as conquerors and overcomers,, when we learn to combine the blood of the lamb with the words of OUR testimony. And the world, who have concluded we are all pretty much hypocrites, will be amazed at the change us, when He shall be sanctified IN us, right before their eyes.

Many blessings to you, dear brother

Gids

 

[Dave-W]

When I was about 10 or 11 a traveling "evangelist" said these words (as close as I can remember them) to our congregation one sunday evening:

You can come down here tonight and kneel at this altar and get every thing right with God. You then get up, grab your coat and go out that door and cross the street to get to your car; get hit, die, and GO STRAIGHT TO HELL becaus you already committed 20 sins you know nothing about before you ever hit that door.

To which the pastor quipped a couple of weeks later:

Maybe we should have someone with a six shooter to blow these people away while they are still on their knees. That is the only way to guarentee they go to heaven.

 

[camphigrades]

Sin-consciousness has been destroying me and my walk with Christ for nearly 30+ years. Only in the past year have I gotten a true revelation of Grace, and it's completely changed my life and my relationship with the Lord.

I'm so thankful He led me to the teaching of Andrew Wommack and Paul Ellis, because it was through those teachings that I got the life-changing revelation of my righteousness in Christ. It's set me free to have a real relationship with God, whereas before, I spent more time running from Him out of fear of my sins than fellowshipping with Him through freedom in Christ. Now whenever I sin, I simply acknowledge my sin and spend time thanking Jesus for exchanging my sin for His righteousness. Whereas before, I'd spend hours (literally, hours) confessing every sin I could think of, feeling horrible guilt over them, and begging God to forgive me...not realizing that He already had, even before I committed the sin.

 

[dayhiker]

Thanks for sharing your testimony, camphigrades.
I read Luther's biography many years ago. He seems to have had the sin-consciousness as well for much of his early life.
I guess I was too literal, as I'd confess my sin and believe that I was forgiven right there.
As I read your post, it comes to me how unsatisfying that would be even to God. God is love and how much does he want us and Himself to be experiencing that love in the time we spend together. But hours of confessing sin, doing penitence, feel shame for our sin, etc doesn't feel to me like something that anyone would call a loving time together. Much better be thankful for the blessing of living in God's creation and the fellowship with God's people. Now that feels loving.

 

[com7fy8]

Now, I think that the churches that preach sin-consciousness by imposing their own set of religious rules and threatening discipline and condemnation by God if folks break them are doing it because they sense that they have lost their power in the Holy Spirit and they see that churches down the road are attracting more people than they are. So they impose the rules and threaten their people that if they leave the church, they are walking away from God and that they will always have a second-grade Christian life because they have walked out of where the "cutting edge" of what God is doing in their city at the present time. Of course, this is spiritual arrogance to think that they are the church closest to God in the city and every other church is inferior.

The real motives which the leadership does not disclose to the members at large is that they are afraid that people will leave their church and consequently the offerings will go down and they won't be able to pay the bills, and they might have to lose one of their full-time pastors because they might not be able to pay him either.

I think it is possible for certain leaders to feel they are rescuing their people; but there are ones who are first about getting money. Ones could be getting an ego fix by having people; so when people start to leave, they can be trying to keep their fix and not only be seeking money. It can be like how a boyfriend is so sure he is so great that no way would his girlfriend leave him, and then he is devastated when she does. Ones can get quite attached to the people in their churches.

Animal hoarders, one woman on TV said, think they are rescuing the animals, though they do not give them what they need. Like this, I think there are religious leaders and even worldwide groups which are people hoarding, "and there is not personal love sharing and example with the leaders, like with Paul, in 1 Thessalonians 2:1-12, with the Thessalonians.

There wasn't a lot of teaching about where we stand in Christ.

Ones only preach how we stand in Christ, but they do not deal with the correction we need to seek > Hebrews 12:6-11 > but they have a more "passive" salvation message, nothing about "work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." (in Philippians 2:12; also please consider Galatians 6:1 with James 5:16, Philippians 2:14-16). I think ones fear starting guilt and looking like they are preaching works in order to get right with God; so they stop at being "imputed" righteousness, and leave out being corrected and cured in God's love so that "as He is, so are we in this world." (1 John 4:17).

women not to wear trousers, nor should be in employment if married.

If women are not employed, this could mean less tithes!! So, if the church is after money, it could be counterproductive, to keep married women from working!! And if they can't wear trousers - - also . . . this is not financially practical, maybe > if the women who don't wear pants and shorts are spending a lot of money on a wardrobe of dresses which are more expensive than pants?

So, it is interesting how wrong people can do their own selves in, with no help from anyone else. I have done this; so I can speak for myself. And then blame others, so ones are sure to keep on doing what brings them down.

I think some people have an ego that thinks 'they are right and others need to be led to what is right'.

If one truly believes, with conviction that there theology is right, than those type of people probably can in their own mind substantiate any controlling type of behavior (in their own minds) by believing that they are shepharding dumb sheep towards the Lord. The 'end' must justify the 'means'.

About being truly Christian >

Even if we have the perfectly correct doctrine and even if we have programs for feeding and helping the poor and other needy . . . "I am nothing" > "it profits me nothing" (1 Corinthians 13:1-3) if I am not real in God's love.

And controlling does not make people love.

"nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5:3)

 

[ToBeLoved]

One thing I wanted to add is their are churches who are spiritually abusive in that they preach sin in a hellfire and damnation way. To me, that is way beyond sin-conciousness, that is abusive. We are to fear the Lord, but much, much more to love Him.

I'd like the OP to define what he means by sin-concious in this post so we are all on the same page. Does it just mean that we as Christians should be cognicent that we still do sin?

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

One thing I wanted to add is their are churches who are spiritually abusive in that they preach sin in a hellfire and damnation way. To me, that is way beyond sin-conciousness, that is abusive. We are to fear the Lord, but much, much more to love Him.

I'd like the OP to define what he means by sin-concious in this post so we are all on the same page. Does it just mean that we as Christians should be cognicent that we still do sin?

I've been associated with churches of different denominations for 46 years now, and I haven't experienced any churches such as you describe.

I think that I have admirably described sin-consciousness in the posts that I have submitted. All you have to do is read them.