Who Created Bible Canon?

Ligurian

Cro-Magnon
Apr 21, 2021
3,589
536
America
✟22,234.00
Country
United States
Faith
Pagan
Marital Status
Private
Who Created Bible Canon?

Seriously. I can't figure it out. Was there a group of people invited to the show? Who did the invite? What input did the invitees have in the final decision? Why did it take so long to get it right? Are they done with it yet? Why weren't they done the first time they tried it?
 

Arcangl86

Newbie
Dec 29, 2013
11,165
7,525
✟347,559.00
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Green
Who Created Bible Canon?

Seriously. I can't figure it out. Was there a group of people invited to the show? Who did the invite? What input did the invitees have in the final decision? Why did it take so long to get it right? Are they done with it yet? Why weren't they done the first time they tried it?
So the biblical canon pretty much developed organically over time. This was especially true of the New Testament books, where different leaders held different books as being divinely inspired. Over time a sort of consensus developed, but there was no real formal discussion about what books made up the canon until the place of some of the Old Testament books was challenged during the reformation.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: pescador
Upvote 0

GreekOrthodox

Psalti Chrysostom
Oct 25, 2010
4,121
4,191
Yorktown VA
✟176,342.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
There is somewhat of an unlisted ranking of the books. The Gospels are the crown jewel. Books that were undisputed such as Paul's letters, and 1 John are also universally recognized. Once you get to 2 & 3 John, Jude, there was some debate. Revelation was only accepted as canonical in the Greek speaking eastern church in the 7th century and still hold a distinction that it is the only book that is not read in church services. The Old Testament gets a little murkier. Heck, the Hebrew version of Esther does not even mention God, while the Septuagint version does included some statements about Him. Song of Solomon is erotic poetry, what do we make of that being canonical?
 
Upvote 0

Friedrich Rubinstein

Well-Known Member
Aug 20, 2020
1,252
1,317
Europe
Visit site
✟174,437.00
Country
Germany
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
the biblical canon pretty much developed organically over time. This was especially true of the New Testament books
This is true. It happened pretty quickly though.
Clement of Rome, along with Ignatius and Polycarp together quote 25 of the 27 books of the New Testament. Each of these men lived at least part of their lives in the first century AD. This shows that the 27 canonical books of the New Testament existed and were well established throughout the various churches during the first century AD. (Source: Joseph Holden & Norman Geisler in: "The Popular Handbook of Archaeology and the Bible", 2013)
 
Upvote 0

rturner76

Domine non-sum dignus
Site Supporter
May 10, 2011
10,614
3,617
Twin Cities
✟734,987.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Green
The leaders of the Universal (Catholic) Churches got together at the Synod of Hippo in 393 and voted on the canon officially. Later the Reformers removed some books they didn't like.
 
  • Winner
Reactions: Daniel Marsh
Upvote 0

Athanasius377

Is playing with his Tonka truck.
Site Supporter
Apr 22, 2017
1,371
1,515
Cincinnati
✟708,393.00
Country
United States
Faith
Lutheran
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
God created the canon of Scripture. The Jews first and then Christians recognized the voice of the Master in certain writings and not in others. The Christians then collected these books recognized for their inspiration and made vast numbers of copies. The Canon was in use long before Hippo met and "Voted" on the canon. The church doesn't get to decide the canon. She recognizes what writings are canonical.
 
  • Like
Reactions: The Liturgist
Upvote 0

Leaf473

Well-Known Member
Jul 17, 2020
8,176
2,197
54
Northeast
✟181,191.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Who Created Bible Canon?

Seriously. I can't figure it out. Was there a group of people invited to the show? Who did the invite? What input did the invitees have in the final decision? Why did it take so long to get it right? Are they done with it yet? Why weren't they done the first time they tried it?
It's a fascinating topic. And as you can see, lots of different kinds of answers.

One thing I find interesting, and this comes from my very basic understanding of the history of the church and the canon:
Exactly what is scripture became much more important after the invention of the printing press and the Reformation. Then there were a lot more common people picking up Bibles and saying, "Hey, it says right here..."

Then you might hear:
"That's not scripture."
"Yes it is."
 
Upvote 0

GreekOrthodox

Psalti Chrysostom
Oct 25, 2010
4,121
4,191
Yorktown VA
✟176,342.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
The leaders of the Universal (Catholic) Churches got together at the Synod of Hippo in 393 and voted on the canon officially. Later the Reformers removed some books they didn't like.

Sigh... it is NOT that simple. There are a number of local synods and individual fathers that wrote lists that were approved to be read publicly.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

HTacianas

Well-Known Member
Jul 9, 2018
8,520
9,015
Florida
✟325,451.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Single
Who Created Bible Canon?

Seriously. I can't figure it out. Was there a group of people invited to the show? Who did the invite? What input did the invitees have in the final decision? Why did it take so long to get it right? Are they done with it yet? Why weren't they done the first time they tried it?

There were several synods held between 350-400 AD or so that determined the canon. By 400 AD the canon was fixed. The old testament of Christianity was always the books of the Septuagint. The new testament was a collection of books and letters believed to be apostolic in origin but also did not contradict any of the teachings of the Church. The only disputed book to make it into the canon is the Revelation. But you'll find among the original apostolic Churches some variances in the old testament. There are some books of the old testament that are considered ecclesial by some Churches, meaning they are not canonical but are worthy of being read. Over time the line between ecclesial and canonical was blurred so some Churches by usage and custom have more or less adopted certain ecclesial books as canonical. One example is the book of Enoch in the Coptic Churches.

Jesus said to his apostles:

Mat 18:19 “Again I say to you that if two of you agree on earth concerning anything that they ask, it will be done for them by My Father in heaven.

Mat 18:20 “For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them.”

That authority given to the apostles was then handed down to their successors. Those successors convened the synods that determined the canon. And at that gathering of the synods Christ was -as he promised- there with them.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Pavel Mosko
Upvote 0

Ligurian

Cro-Magnon
Apr 21, 2021
3,589
536
America
✟22,234.00
Country
United States
Faith
Pagan
Marital Status
Private
So the biblical canon pretty much developed organically over time. This was especially true of the New Testament books, where different leaders held different books as being divinely inspired. Over time a sort of consensus developed, but there was no real formal discussion about what books made up the canon until the place of some of the Old Testament books was challenged during the reformation.

So... the notion of all Scripture being inspired... changes... because the definition of Scripture itself was being changed.
 
Upvote 0

concretecamper

Member of His Church
Nov 23, 2013
6,787
2,580
PA
✟275,302.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
The Catholic church put the Canon together with the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
and decided which writings were in conformance with the teachings handed down from the Apostles. The purpose of setting a canon was to decide which writings should be ready at the Divine Liturgy.
 
Last edited:
  • Winner
Reactions: Lost4words
Upvote 0

concretecamper

Member of His Church
Nov 23, 2013
6,787
2,580
PA
✟275,302.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Exactly what is scripture became much more important after the invention of the printing press and the Reformation. Then there were a lot more common people picking up Bibles and saying, "Hey, it says right here...
considering the literacy rate at that time was less than 5%, I doubt many said "hey, it says right here"
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

ChetSinger

Well-Known Member
Apr 18, 2006
3,518
650
✟124,958.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
Who Created Bible Canon?

Seriously. I can't figure it out. Was there a group of people invited to the show? Who did the invite? What input did the invitees have in the final decision? Why did it take so long to get it right? Are they done with it yet? Why weren't they done the first time they tried it?
One of the criteria was authenticity of authorship. Was the book written by an apostle (e.g. Matthew), or by a companion of an apostle (e.g. Mark)? One of the reasons 2 Peter was slow to be recognized was that not everyone was convinced Peter wrote it.

The vast majority of our New Testament was recognized quite early. But a few books, such as Hebrews, 2 and 3 John, 2 Peter, and Revelation, required some extra time to be universally accepted.

The creation of our canon is a fine subject for study. I once read a book by Dr. Dan Wallace about it. But I've since forgotten many of the details. :(
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Site Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
11,194
5,710
49
The Wild West
✟476,728.00
Country
United States
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
Who Created Bible Canon?

Seriously. I can't figure it out. Was there a group of people invited to the show? Who did the invite? What input did the invitees have in the final decision? Why did it take so long to get it right? Are they done with it yet? Why weren't they done the first time they tried it?

Regarding the New Testament canon, I just gave a brief summary of the history of the current 27 book canon in another thread: Which Canon is Right? With Michael Kruger

That thread also touches on the more complex issues surrounding the Old Testament canon.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Athanasius377
Upvote 0

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Site Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
11,194
5,710
49
The Wild West
✟476,728.00
Country
United States
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
God created the canon of Scripture. The Jews first and then Christians recognized the voice of the Master in certain writings and not in others. The Christians then collected these books recognized for their inspiration and made vast numbers of copies. The Canon was in use long before Hippo met and "Voted" on the canon. The church doesn't get to decide the canon. She recognizes what writings are canonical.

Theologically, I think that is correct, in that the canon is inspired, although there are some legitimate differences in opinion on what constitutes canonical scripture and what books are canon, but certainly there is ecumenical consensus on the majority of Scripture.

Now, like with the authors of Scripture being inspired, I think the redactors of the canon, for example, St. Irenaeus of Lyons, who insisted on there being four legitimate Gospels and only four, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, and your own beloved St. Athanasius who fought Arianism contra mundum, who also, in addition to writing a wonderful biography of St. Anthony the Great and the definitive guide On The Incarnation which explains the Christian doctrine versus the Arian doctrine, also gave us the 27 book New Testament canon in his 39th Paschal Encyclical (which he sent to the bishops over whom he was the Metropolitan each year to advise them when to celebrate Easter), in the late 360s, and this canon, which became the standard in the Church of Alexandria, was soon adopted by the Church in Rome, and then in Antioch, Constantinople and Jerusalem.
 
Upvote 0

DragonFox91

Well-Known Member
Dec 20, 2020
5,034
3,146
32
Michigan
✟215,871.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
Worth mentioning as well the books that became canon were widely distributed & taught before the canon became official.

I was watching a YouTube video once that showed which books were circulating where over time. We can chart these things.
 
  • Informative
Reactions: Ligurian
Upvote 0

concretecamper

Member of His Church
Nov 23, 2013
6,787
2,580
PA
✟275,302.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Worth mentioning as well the books that became canon were widely distributed & taught before the canon became official.
that is not the point. There were many more books widely distributed and taught that didn't make the canon.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: The Liturgist
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

BNR32FAN

He’s a Way of life
Site Supporter
Aug 11, 2017
22,660
7,392
Dallas
✟889,994.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Who Created Bible Canon?

Seriously. I can't figure it out. Was there a group of people invited to the show? Who did the invite? What input did the invitees have in the final decision? Why did it take so long to get it right? Are they done with it yet? Why weren't they done the first time they tried it?

No one knows exactly. It’s not exactly mentioned who, where, or when the scriptures were officially canonized.
 
Upvote 0