USA's first elected trans official arrested on....you guessed it....

[Ana the Ist]

Former N.H. lawmaker charged with distributing child sex abuse images - The Boston Globe

Some court records that detail the allegations against former state Representative Stacie Marie Laughton remained sealed Friday afternoon.

www.bostonglobe.com

The country's first elected transgender politician, who formerly served as a state representative in the New Hampshire legislature has been arrested on charges of distributing child pornography.
Stacie-Marie Laughton, a biological male who lives as a woman, was elected in 2012, but was unable to serve after her criminal past emerged in which she was sentenced to probation stemming from a 2008 felony conviction for credit card fraud.

I'm sure this is all just a coincidence. Thoughts? Sorry if the quote doesn't fit the link. I had to find a story that didn't include the words cheese pizza.

 

[PloverWing]

Yes, it's a coincidence.

The quote seems a little sloppy in its wording. Wikipedia (List of transgender political office-holders - Wikipedia) gives a list of transgender office-holders dating back to the 1990s. The writer might have meant to say "New Hampshire" instead of "the country"; see the linked Boston Globe article.

 

[FreeinChrist]

Are you presuming that all transgender folks are groomers and abusers and like child porn?

What if the person arrested for child porn or abuse is a straignt Republican.
See Recent news - Republican arrested for child sexual molestation and drug possession

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I can understand why some people want to highlight stories like this...but I tend to avoid doing so.

When you boil it down, it's a numbers game. A certain percentage of people from all walks, and all persuasions, are going to be caught doing this kind of stuff.

For every trans person who preys on children, you can find examples of cis/straight/whatever doing it too.


Unless here's some data or point of reference suggesting that these sort of crimes and behaviors are more wildly over-represented in the trans community than in others, it doesn't seem like a good attack angle.

Especially when so many the conservative side have been quick to dismiss clergy-related instances of this kind of stuff as "few bad apples".

 

[Ana the Ist]

Yes, it's a coincidence.

Is it?

The quote seems a little sloppy in its wording. Wikipedia (List of transgender political office-holders - Wikipedia) gives a list of transgender office-holders dating back to the 1990s. The writer might have meant to say "New Hampshire" instead of "the country"; see the linked Boston Globe article.

I'm not seeing this person on that list....and the list itself is a bit off with lots of people not identified as "transgender" but rather gender fluid or something similar.

 

[Hank77]

Former N.H. lawmaker charged with distributing child sex abuse images - The Boston Globe

Some court records that detail the allegations against former state Representative Stacie Marie Laughton remained sealed Friday afternoon.

www.bostonglobe.com

The country's first elected transgender politician, who formerly served as a state representative in the New Hampshire legislature has been arrested on charges of distributing child inappropriate contentography.
Stacie-Marie Laughton, a biological male who lives as a woman, was elected in 2012, but was unable to serve after her criminal past emerged in which she was sentenced to probation stemming from a 2008 felony conviction for credit card fraud.

I'm sure this is all just a coincidence. Thoughts? Sorry if the quote doesn't fit the link. I had to find a story that didn't include the words cheese pizza.

Seems this person had a co-conspirator...

Officials say Stacie Marie Laughton's child sexual abuse images charges are connected to arrest of Lindsay Groves on felony charges.

NASHUA — Stacie Marie Laughton, who served as one of three state representatives of Nashua’s Ward 4 until she resigned last December amid mounting criminal allegations, has been charged with

www.unionleader.com

 

[Ana the Ist]

I can understand why some people want to highlight stories like this...but I tend to avoid doing so.

When you boil it down, it's a numbers game. A certain percentage of people from all walks, and all persuasions, are going to be caught doing this kind of stuff.

For every trans person who preys on children, you can find examples of cis/straight/whatever doing it too.


Unless here's some data or point of reference suggesting that these sort of crimes and behaviors are more wildly over-represented in the trans community than in others, it doesn't seem like a good attack angle.

Especially when so many the conservative side have been quick to dismiss clergy-related instances of this kind of stuff as "few bad apples".

Back when Republicans used to hurl that accusation at gay people in general I used to defend them because I knew, like you do, that if you're unable to openly identify as gay....then it's quite simply not possible to even determine whether or not the lgbtq community has a history of disproportionately committing sexual abuse against children.

Since those days however, two things have changed....
1. You can now openly identify as lgbtq.
2. The quality of scholarship on the left has taken a nosedive.


So when I decided to revisit the issue during the whole "groomer" debacle...I was surprised to find this...

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/SORS-LGBTQ-May-2022.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjM3oWIofP_AhXGLkQIHaxzC2sQFnoECAkQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3WgzsV-kgxdUpf0M3pQ0Ye

That's going to lead to a link with some very informative tables and graphs.

What the study was trying to prove was that the gay community or rather lgbtq community was being "disproportionately targeted" by police regarding sex offender/sex crimes registries.

Because as you know, they see these statistical disparities as indicators of bias/bigotry in policing. This relates directly to point #2 above....the quality of scholarship taking a nosedive.

When you consider the way these investigations and arrests happen....the notion of bias becomes absurd. Typically...

1. A victim comes forward.
2. A warrant for arrest is issued.
3. The suspect is arrested for both questioning/evidence collection and then charged (if charges are filed).

It's not as if police are hanging outside of gay nightclubs with a fishing pole and a piece of cheese pizza on the hook and just reeling in a gay person to arrest. That's absurd.


So when looking at the charts....it's clear that they actually get arrested more often than cis-hetero subjects for possession of cheese pizza. It's also true that they are far more likely than a cis-hetero subject to commit an act of child sex abuse.

The unfounded accusations of conservatives in the past are now factual statements....thanks to these dumb scholars trying to prove that the lgbtq community is being unfairly targeted by police.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Seems this person had a co-conspirator...

Officials say Stacie Marie Laughton's child sexual abuse images charges are connected to arrest of Lindsay Groves on felony charges.

NASHUA — Stacie Marie Laughton, who served as one of three state representatives of Nashua’s Ward 4 until she resigned last December amid mounting criminal allegations, has been charged with

www.unionleader.com

Indeed. That's how these cases typically happen. Some cheese pizza sharing website or url is found on one person's computer and that leads to another and another, etc.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Back when Republicans used to hurl that accusation at gay people in general I used to defend them because I knew, like you do, that if you're unable to openly identify as gay....then it's quite simply not possible to even determine whether or not the lgbtq community has a history of disproportionately committing sexual abuse against children.

Since those days however, two things have changed....
1. You can now openly identify as lgbtq.
2. The quality of scholarship on the left has taken a nosedive.


So when I decided to revisit the issue during the whole "groomer" debacle...I was surprised to find this...

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/wp-content/uploads/SORS-LGBTQ-May-2022.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjM3oWIofP_AhXGLkQIHaxzC2sQFnoECAkQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3WgzsV-kgxdUpf0M3pQ0Ye

That's going to lead to a link with some very informative tables and graphs.

What the study was trying to prove was that the gay community or rather lgbtq community was being "disproportionately targeted" by police regarding sex offender/sex crimes registries.

Because as you know, they see these statistical disparities as indicators of bias/bigotry in policing. This relates directly to point #2 above....the quality of scholarship taking a nosedive.

When you consider the way these investigations and arrests happen....the notion of bias becomes absurd. Typically...

1. A victim comes forward.
2. A warrant for arrest is issued.
3. The suspect is arrested for both questioning/evidence collection and then charged (if charges are filed).

It's not as if police are hanging outside of gay nightclubs with a fishing pole and a piece of cheese pizza on the hook and just reeling in a gay person to arrest. That's absurd.


So when looking at the charts....it's clear that they actually get arrested more often than cis-hetero subjects for possession of cheese pizza. It's also true that they are far more likely than a cis-hetero subject to commit an act of child sex abuse.

The unfounded accusations of conservatives in the past are now factual statements....thanks to these dumb scholars trying to prove that the lgbtq community is being unfairly targeted by police.

A couple things to note here (and admittedly, I haven't had time to fully read through the Williams Institute link, but I plan to) that could be impacting some of the stats.
(to clarify, I'm not dismissing what you've provided yet, just pointing out a couple of things that could "change the dynamic")

Of the people who were arrested and added to the sex offender registry
9% percent of LGBTQ respondents had sodomy statutes that impacted their sentencing/punishment.
2% had their positive HIV status taken into account as their sentencing/punishment.

When it came to offenders who had victims aged 12 and under, the percentages (relative to the population size) were equal between LGBT and non-LGBT people.

When it comes to the age of the victim in comparison to the age of the perpetrator, for nearly 60% of LGBT child offenders, the victim was within 6 years of their own age...as to where for straight/cis offenders who prey on minors, >70% are preying on someone over 15 years their junior.


At the very least, it moves the needle and "closes the gap" so to speak when considering these factors.

If a substantial number of LGBTQ offenders are cases where it's a "22 year old slept with a 17 year old, both were willing participants, but the parents got mad" kind of thing... and over 10% are cases where archaic sodomy statutes or their HIV status was used as the reason for charging them with a sex offense, then we're not really getting an apples to apples comparison here.

 

[Ana the Ist]

A couple things to note here (and admittedly, I haven't had time to fully read through the Williams Institute link, but I plan to) that could be impacting some of the stats.
(to clarify, I'm not dismissing what you've provided yet, just pointing out a couple of things that could "change the dynamic")

Of the people who were arrested and added to the sex offender registry
9% percent of LGBTQ respondents had sodomy statutes that impacted their sentencing/punishment.
2% had their positive HIV status taken into account as their sentencing/punishment.

When it came to offenders who had victims aged 12 and under, the percentages (relative to the population size) were equal between LGBT and non-LGBT people.

When it comes to the age of the victim in comparison to the age of the perpetrator, for nearly 60% of LGBT child offenders, the victim was within 6 years of their own age...as to where for straight/cis offenders who prey on minors, >70% are preying on someone over 15 years their junior.


At the very least, it moves the needle and "closes the gap" so to speak when considering these factors.

If a substantial number of LGBTQ offenders are cases where it's a "22 year old slept with a 17 year old, both were willing participants, but the parents got mad" kind of thing... and over 10% are cases where archaic sodomy statutes or their HIV status was used as the reason for charging them with a sex offense, then we're not really getting an apples to apples comparison here.

I'm sorry man, I should have been more clear....

You're correct of course in noting the study looks at 1000 sex offenders and if the % of sex offenders identifying as straight/cis/hetero shows that 30% of them were in possession of cheese pizza and the % of them identifying as lgbtq also has 30% of them in possession of cheese pizza....then I'm not exactly backing up my assertion am I?

What you need to keep in mind is this ...

Percentage of LGBTQ adults in U.S. has doubled over past decade, Gallup finds

If younger Americans continue to come out at increasing rates, Gallup predicts the proportion of adults who identify as LGBTQ will exceed 10 percent in the near future.

www.google.com

Only 7% of the population identifies as lgbtq. Even if you take that number on its face....the 20+% of sex offenders identifying as lgbtq means they're far more likely to offend than the straight/cis/hetero group. Frankly, I'd be surprised if the true number isn't closer to 5% of the population as we seem to be living in a time of identity-as-fad that probably won't last forever and a certain percentage of those identifying as the minority will grow out of it.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Seems this person had a co-conspirator...

Officials say Stacie Marie Laughton's child sexual abuse images charges are connected to arrest of Lindsay Groves on felony charges.

NASHUA — Stacie Marie Laughton, who served as one of three state representatives of Nashua’s Ward 4 until she resigned last December amid mounting criminal allegations, has been charged with

www.unionleader.com

I hate to be "that guy", but is this the woman who we're talking about here?

I would never have even guessed that this is a person who's trying to identify as a woman.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

Only 7% of the population identifies as lgbtq. Even if you take that number on its face....the 20+% of sex offenders identifying as lgbtq means they're far more likely to offend than the straight/cis/hetero group. Frankly, I'd be surprised if the true number isn't closer to 5% of the population as we seem to be living in a time of identity-as-fad that probably won't last forever and a certain percentage of those identifying as the minority will grow out of it.

but that kind of ties into what I was referencing...

If courts are giving more lenient treatment to "23 year old guys engaging in acts with a 17 year old female" than they are "23 year old gay guys engaging in acts with a 17 year old male" (either by direct bias from the judge, or by the invocation of archaic sodomy laws) wouldn't that represent some sort of disparity in how these cases are being calculated?


An interesting datapoint to figure out (and it may be tough to find) would be seeing what percentage of the offenses (comparing straight/cis to LGBTQ) would be seeing what percentage were statutory vs. non-statutory. Because if it's a case where the statutory cases are making up a lions share of the LGBTQ cases, then that may change how it should be viewed.



To clarify again, I'm not dismissing the assertion until I've read the entire UCLA write-up you've provided.

Just pointing out potential points of inconsistency with analyzing the statistics.

Sort of like I would if there were a conversation about crack vs. powder cocaine (knowing that one got harsher treatment in the courts than the other) and someone claiming "Black people are more likely to be involved in cocaine felony drug convictions"). It doesn't remove the personal decision making or agency, but it does explain some of the disparate outcomes.

 

[PloverWing]

I'm not seeing this person on that list

She's listed in the 2010s group.

 

[FreeinChrist]

I'm sorry man, I should have been more clear....

You're correct of course in noting the study looks at 1000 sex offenders and if the % of sex offenders identifying as straight/cis/hetero shows that 30% of them were in possession of cheese pizza and the % of them identifying as lgbtq also has 30% of them in possession of cheese pizza....then I'm not exactly backing up my assertion am I?

What you need to keep in mind is this ...

Percentage of LGBTQ adults in U.S. has doubled over past decade, Gallup finds

If younger Americans continue to come out at increasing rates, Gallup predicts the proportion of adults who identify as LGBTQ will exceed 10 percent in the near future.

www.google.com

Only 7% of the population identifies as lgbtq. Even if you take that number on its face....the 20+% of sex offenders identifying as lgbtq means they're far more likely to offend than the straight/cis/hetero group. Frankly, I'd be surprised if the true number isn't closer to 5% of the population as we seem to be living in a time of identity-as-fad that probably won't last forever and a certain percentage of those identifying as the minority will grow out of it.

Why are you bringing up cheese pizza?

 

[Ana the Ist]

I hate to be "that guy", but is this the woman who we're talking about here?
View attachment 332916

I would never have even guessed that this is a person who's trying to identify as a woman.

Looks a lot like Chris-Chan, am I right?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Why are you bringing up cheese pizza?

Because the website defaults to "inappropriate child contentography" and that ruins links with certain words in them.

So I'm using a harmless proxy phrase instead. One that people who trade in cheese pizza use themselves....so it's also hopefully something this websites users remember and associate with that illegal content, and if they come across it in the future and see discussion of cheese pizza that doesn't make any sense, they'll report it to the proper authorities.

 

[Ana the Ist]

but that kind of ties into what I was referencing...

If courts are giving more lenient treatment to "23 year old guys engaging in acts with a 17 year old female" than they are "23 year old gay guys engaging in acts with a 17 year old male" (either by direct bias from the judge, or by the invocation of archaic sodomy laws) wouldn't that represent some sort of disparity in how these cases are being calculated?


An interesting datapoint to figure out (and it may be tough to find) would be seeing what percentage of the offenses (comparing straight/cis to LGBTQ) would be seeing what percentage were statutory vs. non-statutory. Because if it's a case where the statutory cases are making up a lions share of the LGBTQ cases, then that may change how it should be viewed.



To clarify again, I'm not dismissing the assertion until I've read the entire UCLA write-up you've provided.

Just pointing out potential points of inconsistency with analyzing the statistics.

Sort of like I would if there were a conversation about crack vs. powder cocaine (knowing that one got harsher treatment in the courts than the other) and someone claiming "Black people are more likely to be involved in cocaine felony drug convictions"). It doesn't remove the personal decision making or agency, but it does explain some of the disparate outcomes.

If 23yo people dating 17yo people were the issue of concern, you'd have a point.

What I'm looking at though is a random sample of 1000 people on the sex offender registry where 20+% are identifying as lgbtq despite only being 7% of the population and 33% are in possession of cheese pizza while the straight offenders are 29% in possession of cheese pizza.

Even if you think the extra percentage of offenders on the registry are due to unfair characterizations of their relationships, you'd either have to conclude....

1. There's a lot of overlap with the 23yos and purveyors of cheese pizza.

2. If there is no overlap, then lgbtq offenders are over 8 times more likely than straight offenders to possess cheese pizza.

It's difficult to find a method to slice this pizza where the lgbtq community isn't over-represented in a very problematic way. It isn't a possibility I like considering....but it does make sense of a lot of their activism. In recent years you have all the examples of gay professors arguing for the destigmatizing of pedophilia. You have all the gay and trans authors writing children's books that frequently include instructions or depictions of gay sex. You have the drag queen story hour where they don't simply read Dr Suess...they read stories about being gay or trans. You've got examples of these same people either having records of sexual abuse or those supporting them having records (I'm thinking specifically of a judge in Iowa financing his state's chapter getting caught with cheese pizza). You have this push to teach children with no concept of sexuality about this stuff. Now, in your state (CA correct?), they passed a law making it child abuse if a parent doesn't affirm their child's chosen gender....and your child can be taken from you for it.

2000-2015 if you had said that gay people are more inclined to be child sex abusers....I would have said that was untrue, there's no real evidence for that, and it was a bigoted opinion. That's because that was what the evidence....or lack thereof....concluded.

Now unfortunately, I not only have to drop the part where I think that's a bigoted position....but the ever increasing pile of evidence makes it increasingly difficult to disagree.

I'm reminded of Milo Yiannopolis' take that eventually got his job of trolling the left taken from him. The time he said that the "dirty secret" of the gay community is that these "sexual relationships" between an adult gay man and an underage boy were somewhat normalized within the community.

Burying one's head in the sand doesn't seem like it's helpful.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

If 23yo people dating 17yo people were the issue of concern, you'd have a point.

What I'm looking at though is a random sample of 1000 people on the sex offender registry where 20+% are identifying as lgbtq despite only being 7% of the population and 33% are in possession of cheese pizza while the straight offenders are 29% in possession of cheese pizza.

Even if you think the extra percentage of offenders on the registry are due to unfair characterizations of their relationships, you'd either have to conclude....

1. There's a lot of overlap with the 23yos and purveyors of cheese pizza.

Well, it's important to keep in mind though, the same situation exists in the digital realm that exists in real life.

If you're a 22 year old who has a 17 year old "love interest" and they're sending nudes back and forth, the 22 year old is guilty of "receiving cheese pizza"

The porn culture in our country has not been a good thing, and has created a lot of legal anomalies and moral quandaries (for lack of a better term).

The difference between what one of those sites puts on their home page as an officially recognized "sub-genre" of "Teen" and what is technically a felony can be a matter of a week's worth of time.

You share images with someone who's 18 years and 1 hour old, it's viewed as "just what guys are in to", rewind the clock a few days, that person is officially guilty of "possessing cheese pizza"

I'm reminded of Milo Yiannopolis' take that eventually got his job of trolling the left taken from him. The time he said that the "dirty secret" of the gay community is that these "sexual relationships" between an adult gay man and an underage boy were somewhat normalized within the community.

I somewhat remember that interview, it was with either Rogan or Maher if I'm not mistaken.

He elaborated on how when he was 16, he had "gay mentors" who were in their 20's.

But again, you have to consider the dynamic. There's a valid reason why people view a 16 year old straight guy (who's 28 year female teacher seduces him) with less of a "he's a victim" persona than when the gender roles are reversed.

The part of this conversation that's tricky to discuss is that there sometimes are 16-17 year olds that are more physically, mentally, and emotionally mature than some 18-19 year olds.

But as a society, we obviously had to draw a cutoff line somewhere, so the age of 18 makes sense.

The point I was making was if it's a case where the majority of straight/cis offenses are creepy 42 year olds preying on 10 year old girls, and the majority of LGBT offenses are 22 year olds "hooking up" with 16-17 year olds (but getting the book thrown at them due to certain biases), it may not be a fair comparison.

 

[Say it aint so]

Don't think the first elected transgender.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Well, it's important to keep in mind though, the same situation exists in the digital realm that exists in real life.

If you're a 22 year old who has a 17 year old "love interest" and they're sending nudes back and forth, the 22 year old is guilty of "receiving cheese pizza"

The inappropriate content culture in our country has not been a good thing, and has created a lot of legal anomalies and moral quandaries (for lack of a better term).

The difference between what one of those sites puts on their home page as an officially recognized "sub-genre" of "Teen" and what is technically a felony can be a matter of a week's worth of time.

You share images with someone who's 18 years and 1 hour old, it's viewed as "just what guys are in to", rewind the clock a few days, that person is officially guilty of "possessing cheese pizza"


I somewhat remember that interview, it was with either Rogan or Maher if I'm not mistaken.

He elaborated on how when he was 16, he had "gay mentors" who were in their 20's.

But again, you have to consider the dynamic. There's a valid reason why people view a 16 year old straight guy (who's 28 year female teacher seduces him) with less of a "he's a victim" persona than when the gender roles are reversed.

The part of this conversation that's tricky to discuss is that there sometimes are 16-17 year olds that are more physically, mentally, and emotionally mature than some 18-19 year olds.

But as a society, we obviously had to draw a cutoff line somewhere, so the age of 18 makes sense.

The point I was making was if it's a case where the majority of straight/cis offenses are creepy 42 year olds preying on 10 year old girls, and the majority of LGBT offenses are 22 year olds "hooking up" with 16-17 year olds (but getting the book thrown at them due to certain biases), it may not be a fair comparison.

As much as I'd prefer this was the situation at hand....page 19 includes the footnote that for both categories of offenders, roughly 1/3 victims were 12yo or younger.

Again, this means that the disproportionate number of offenders makes 1 category several times more likely to offend.