The Works Based Salvation

[Thursday]

So Paul says:

For we maintain a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law/ works. Rom3:28

So how many good works must you do to prove you have faith?

Paul is speaking of the Jewish Law.

You have to strive for holiness. God knows your heart and will forgive you if you confess your sins.

Heb 12:14
Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.

Phil 3
10I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead. 12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.

Gal 6
7Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up

 

[stuart lawrence]

Paul is speaking of the Jewish Law.

You have to strive for holiness. God knows your heart and will forgive you if you confess your sins.

Heb 12:14
Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.

Phil 3
10I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead. 12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.

Gal 6
7Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up

Paul is speaking of the WHOLE law.
Read rom ch7

 

[Thursday]

Paul is speaking of the WHOLE law.
Read rom ch7

Yes, the Jewish Law.

Now back to Christianity:

Heb 12:14
Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.

Phil 3
10I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead. 12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.

Gal 6
7Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Yes, the Jewish Law.

Now back to Christianity:

Heb 12:14
Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.

Phil 3
10I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead. 12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.

Gal 6
7Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

Paul is including the Ten Commandments in rom3:28

It is easily proved I you disagree

 

[Thursday]

Paul is including the Ten Commandments in rom3:28

It is easily proved I you disagree

Why don't you address the scriptures I provided?

 

[stuart lawrence]

The parable of the sower is good.
In the second example given people accept the word with joy, but soon give up when persecution comes for they had no true root. They walk away.
However, in the third example people accept the message and are saved, but they don't mature as Christians because they keep getting sidetracked by the world.
Note Jesus did not say they lose their salvation, but they never matured

 

[stuart lawrence]

Why don't you address the scriptures I provided?

Well I could, then I could give you twice as many as you quoted me!

However, as you responded to rom3:28

Do you accept Paul was referring I that verse to the whole law, including the Ten Commandments. Then we can move on

 

[Thursday]

The parable of the sower is good.
In the second example given people accept the word with joy, but soon give up when persecution comes for they had no true root. They walk away.
However, in the third example people accept the message and are saved, but they don't mature as Christians because they keep getting sidetracked by the world.
Note Jesus did not say they lose their salvation, but they never matured

7Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants.

 

[Thursday]

Well I could, then I could give you twice as many as you quoted me!

However, as you responded to rom3:28

Do you accept Paul was referring I that verse to the whole law, including the Ten Commandments. Then we can move on

Yes, the 10 Commandments are part of the Jewish Law, as are many other things. That is irrelevant to the passages I posted.

Heb 12:14
Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.

Phil 3
10I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead. 12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.

Gal 6
7Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

 

[stuart lawrence]

7Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants.[/QUOTE

7Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants.

Do you agree, in the third example given people accepted the message but never matured in the faith due to continually being sidetracked by the world?

 

[stuart lawrence]

Yes, the 10 Commandments are part of the Jewish Law, as are many other things. That is irrelevant to the passages I posted.

Heb 12:14
Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord.

Phil 3
10I want to know Christ—yes, to know the power of his resurrection and participation in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, 11and so, somehow, attaining to the resurrection from the dead. 12Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.

Gal 6
7Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

Glad you agree we are justified apart from obeying the TC

Then works God requires are done out of love and gratitude for a free salvation. God will reject works done with the view they will better enable you to enter heaven.
By linking works to salvation, you speak of works God will reject

 

[stuart lawrence]

7Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up and choked the plants.

Do you agree? In the third example given in the parable of the sower they accepted the message/ were saved but never matured in the faith by being continually sidetracked by the world?

 

[Thursday]

Yes, and their faith was choked. That doesn't mean they attained salvation.

 

[Thursday]

Glad you agree we are justified apart from obeying the TC

Then works God requires are done out of love and gratitude for a free salvation. God will reject works done with the view they will better enable you to enter heaven.
By linking works to salvation, you speak of works God will reject

Wrong.

Romans 2
6God will repay each person according to what they have done. 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

 

[CodyFaith]

Just curious.
How many good works must one do exactly to prove they have faith and are saved?

Nobody works to "prove" they have faith. If they have faith, they will do good works.

Christ will judge the tree by the fruits of the tree. If he sees bad fruit, he will see that the tree itself is bad. If he sees good fruit, he will see that the tree itself is good.

I've seen those "works" verses in James so often misquoted, but really they aren't hard to grasp.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Yes, and their faith was choked. That doesn't mean they attained salvation.

It says they did not mature, NOT they lost their salvation.
It is a basic understanding of the christian faith you mature by practising doing what is right. The more you do that the more you mature in the faith.
This is consistent with Heb5:11-14 and compliments Christs third example in the parable of the sower

 

[stuart lawrence]

Wrong.

Romans 2
6God will repay each person according to what they have done. 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

Wrong!

Move onto chapter three:

What shall we CONCLUDE then( concerning what Paul has previously written in the preceding two chapters) Are we any better? Not at all! We have already made the charge that Jews and gentiles alike are ALL( ALL) under sin.
As it is written:
There is no one righteous, not one.....

Rom3:9&10

Read the conclusion to get the correct picture.

You would be righteous by obeying the law if you obeyed it, but man cannot be righteous by obeying the law, that is why Christ died at Calvary

 

[Thursday]

It says they did not mature, NOT they lost their salvation.
It is a basic understanding of the christian faith you mature by practising doing what is right. The more you do that the more you mature in the faith.
This is consistent with Heb5:11-14 and compliments Christs third example in the parable of the sower

It says that they were choked by the thorns. That is death.

A man reaps what he sows.

 

[Thursday]

Wrong!

Move onto chapter three:

What shall we CONCLUDE then( concerning what Paul has previously written in the preceding two chapters) Are we any better? Not at all! We have already made the charge that Jews and gentiles alike are ALL( ALL) under sin.
As it is written:
There is no one righteous, not one.....

Rom3:9&10

Read the conclusion to get the correct picture.

You would be righteous by obeying the law if you obeyed it, but man cannot be righteous by obeying the law, that is why Christ died at Calvary

Judging us according to our works is not the same as adherence to the Jewish Law.

You can't just ignore Paul's words and insert your dogma.

Gal 6
7Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.

 

[stuart lawrence]

Wrong.

Romans 2
6God will repay each person according to what they have done. 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

More confirmation concerning the parable of the sower:

When we are faithless he remains faithful, for he cannot disown himself
2tim2:13