The only begotten Son of God

[Brotherbrown]

I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I had
heard and seen them, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel
who had been showing them to me. But he said to me, "Do not do it! I
am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers the prophets and
of all who keep the words of this book. Worship God!" (Rev. 22:8-9)

So John was not born of God?

I said
That is a gross mistake. We are not equal with God, never will be. John was talking to an angel.

 

[x141]

I said
That is a gross mistake. We are not equal with God, never will be. John was talking to an angel.

Did Jesus believe he was equal with God? That he was "I am" ... (which is just another way of saying one with his father).

Are we not to allow this mind to live in us, or allow the spirit that proceeded from the father to lead us back to where he came from ... that is, into all truth ...

 

[2ducklow]

I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I had
heard and seen them, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel
who had been showing them to me. But he said to me, "Do not do it! I
am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers the prophets and
of all who keep the words of this book. Worship God!" (Rev. 22:8-9)

So John was not born of God?

(Young) Revelation 22:9 and he saith to me, `See--not; for fellow-servant of thee am I, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of those keeping the words of this scroll; before God bow.'

god say bow down to him God never used the word worship. Christians invented the word worship to replace the word bow down. thus nobody bows down to God, well I do, but outside of me not too many obey god on this cause they don't know any better. oh well. see when people read the word worship they know that means they don't have to do anything. but if they read the word bow down, they kinda automatically know what that means. I suspect the reason people replaced bow down with worship is so they wouldn't have to do anything. people who worship don't do anything. it's all in the head. It's like oh yea I worship god you know thing good things about hijm love hime adore him anything but bow down.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

I said
They mistakenly said that He was calling Himself God. But He wasn't. It was their perverted understanding that caused the uproar. They accused Him of making Himself God. He tried to explain it to them. He was the Son of God, not God.

Right, then it should be easy to find verses where He explains the confusion since it seems to have occurred several times. Obviously those following Him would be curious and would have asked about it. And then we have Saint Thomas's revelation, "My Lord and my God" , surely Jesus would have corrercted Him. Let's talk about those verses where Jesus corrects people for misunderstanding Him.

 

[Brotherbrown]

Did Jesus believe he was equal with God? That he was "I am" ... (which is just another way of saying one with his father).

Are we not to allow this mind to live in us, or allow the spirit that proceeded from the father to lead us back to where he came from ... that is, into all truth ...

I said
THE I AM DELUSION

Matt 16:13-17
13 When Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, "Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?"
14 So they said, "Some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets."
15 He said to them, "But who do you say that I am?"
16 Simon Peter answered and said, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."
17 Jesus answered and said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.
John 7:39-43
39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
40 Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.
41 Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee?
42 Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
43 So there was a division among the people because of him.
John 7:51-52
51 Doth our law judge any man, before it hear him, and know what he doeth?
52 They answered and said unto him, Art thou also of Galilee? Search, and look: for out of Galilee ariseth no prophet.
John 8:1-2
1 Jesus went unto the mount of Olives.
2 And early in the morning he came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him; and he sat down, and taught them.
John 8:12
12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
John 8:16-18
16 And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me.
17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.
18 I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me.
John 8:21
21 Then said Jesus again unto them, I go my way, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sins: whither I go, ye cannot come.
John 8:23-24
23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
John 8:28-29
28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.
29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.
John 8:58-59
58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
(KJV)
xxx Jesus was teaching in the temple and they were questioning Him on whether or not He was the Christ. Then they all went home and came back the next day to question Him some more. When Jesus told them: you will die in your sins if you do not believe that I am He. Then in verse 58 Jesus was telling them that even before Abraham that I am . But they picked up stones to throw at Him so they cut Jesus off in the middle of His sentance and Jesus got out of there. Jesus was claiming that" I AM He" the Christ. Jesus was not claiming He was God.
verse 24 and 28 Jesus said it, I am he. Jesus was saying He was the Christ that they were speaking of in John 7-41. But in is obvious why they didnt understand from John 7-39 they havent received the Holy Spirit yet. And even today many do not know the Spirit and get deceived in the verses.

 

[DrBubbaLove]

I said
THE I AM DELUSION

I think the word is delusional.

 

[x141]

I said
THE I AM DELUSION

Matt 16:13-17
13 When Jesus came into the region of Caesarea Philippi, He asked His disciples, saying, "Who do men say that I, the Son of Man, am?"
14 So they said, "Some say John the Baptist, some Elijah, and others Jeremiah or one of the prophets."
15 He said to them, "But who do you say that I am?"
16 Simon Peter answered and said, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."
17 Jesus answered and said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven.
John 7:39-43
39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
40 Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.
41 Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee?
42 Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
43 So there was a division among the people because of him.
John 7:51-52
51 Doth our law judge any man, before it hear him, and know what he doeth?
52 They answered and said unto him, Art thou also of Galilee? Search, and look: for out of Galilee ariseth no prophet.
John 8:1-2
1 Jesus went unto the mount of Olives.
2 And early in the morning he came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him; and he sat down, and taught them.
John 8:12
12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
John 8:16-18
16 And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me.
17 It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.
18 I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me.
John 8:21
21 Then said Jesus again unto them, I go my way, and ye shall seek me, and shall die in your sins: whither I go, ye cannot come.
John 8:23-24
23 And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
John 8:28-29
28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.
29 And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.
John 8:58-59
58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
59 Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.
(KJV)
xxx Jesus was teaching in the temple and they were questioning Him on whether or not He was the Christ. Then they all went home and came back the next day to question Him some more. When Jesus told them: you will die in your sins if you do not believe that I am He. Then in verse 58 Jesus was telling them that even before Abraham that I am . But they picked up stones to throw at Him so they cut Jesus off in the middle of His sentance and Jesus got out of there. Jesus was claiming that" I AM He" the Christ. Jesus was not claiming He was God.
verse 24 and 28 Jesus said it, I am he. Jesus was saying He was the Christ that they were speaking of in John 7-41. But in is obvious why they didnt understand from John 7-39 they havent received the Holy Spirit yet. And even today many do not know the Spirit and get deceived in the verses.

The knowledge of God is not yet first person to you, or as something given. A little leaven leaven's the whole lump and distorts the truth and prevents us from entering and abiding as a pillar to go no more out, though this be the truth before all things were.

Jesus believed himself to be one with his Father in present form even though he spoke of being restored to this glory of one that was before all things were, which is the That they might be where I am. If you don't believe Jesus was one with God how will you ever be one with God ...

In reality, he is no more or less than you, seeing how the life that was granted to be in him of his father is the same life that was granted to be in you ... what is truth, what is life? is it something less than God? (not questions to answer but questions to ponder).

 

[Edgar44]

There is much confusion concerning Jesus, is He God, or was He a man?

Originally, God wanted to create a 'perfect human beings'. God's plan was to create one couple, Adam & Eve, this couple would grow (Be Fruitful) to perfection, and become in the image of God.

Adam & Eve, once perfected, would then have given birth to all future generations, with God as the Father of mankind.

As we know, this did not take place. Both Adam & Eve did not grow to fruition, did not become in the image of God. Instead, they gave birth to a fallen mankind with Satan as the father of this world.

God is eternal, absolute and unchanging, and God's original plan has not changed.
God needs a new Adam, one who will grow to become in the image of God. Such a person was realized in Jesus. Jesus was and is still the 'only begotten Son of God', because Jesus is the first human being to attain what God desires for all mankind.

Does this mean that Jesus is God? No, it means that Jesus stands in the midway position, neither God, yet neither a man like us. Jesus does not come from the lineage of a fallen Adam & Eve. God purified His lineage through generations of struggle, each generation having to accomplish a God given task, with each accomplishment reversing the effects of the fall.

Eventually, Jesus could be born, He came to save mankind, did we accept His salvation, or did we kill Him? We killed Him, Jesus knew that He would have to return if He was killed.

Now, once again, mankind waits for the bridegroom to return.

There is God. There is fallen mankind. Then there is Jesus, a Divine Jesus who is the only begotten man of God, not God Himself, but of God's direct lineage.

Jesus is the first perfected man, which was God's desire from the foundations of the world.

 

[Brotherbrown]

There is much confusion concerning Jesus, is He God, or was He a man?

Originally, God wanted to create a 'perfect human beings'. God's plan was to create one couple, Adam & Eve, this couple would grow (Be Fruitful) to perfection, and become in the image of God.

Adam & Eve, once perfected, would then have given birth to all future generations, with God as the Father of mankind.

As we know, this did not take place. Both Adam & Eve did not grow to fruition, did not become in the image of God. Instead, they gave birth to a fallen mankind with Satan as the father of this world.

God is eternal, absolute and unchanging, and God's original plan has not changed.
God needs a new Adam, one who will grow to become in the image of God. Such a person was realized in Jesus. Jesus was and is still the 'only begotten Son of God', because Jesus is the first human being to attain what God desires for all mankind.

Does this mean that Jesus is God? No, it means that Jesus stands in the midway position, neither God, yet neither a man like us. Jesus does not come from the lineage of a fallen Adam & Eve. God purified His lineage through generations of struggle, each generation having to accomplish a God given task, with each accomplishment reversing the effects of the fall.

Eventually, Jesus could be born, He came to save mankind, did we accept His salvation, or did we kill Him? We killed Him, Jesus knew that He would have to return if He was killed.

Now, once again, mankind waits for the bridegroom to return.

There is God. There is fallen mankind. Then there is Jesus, a Divine Jesus who is the only begotten man of God, not God Himself, but of God's direct lineage.

Jesus is the first perfected man, which was God's desire from the foundations of the world.

I said
I like that.

 

[RevelationTestament]

I have found that one's perception of the word God differs from another in how full this word has been defined to them, defined only by the one who fits this word to full measure, which in the end is the one purpose of God from the moment that was the beginning.

Only God reveals God, which the knowledge of this is not had without becoming what is revealed, or something in picture form that is akin to a land that is your own (being not a stranger in it (a part of the language of God).

Anyone who has seen the Father must surely die.

 

[Brotherbrown]

Anyone who has seen the Father must surely die.

I said
ok

 

[x141]

Anyone who has seen the Father must surely die.

We become not.

 

[RevelationTestament]

Or become what is.

 

[x141]

Or become what is.

Lose your soul ... gain your soul ... : )

 

[Edgar44]

Lose your soul ... gain your soul ... : )

or lose a pound and find a penny.

 

[x141]

or lose a pound and find a penny.

I like the language of the pound ... as they are servants the pound never becomes theirs ... only a son abides in the house forever.

 

[All Souls]

Have you read Andrew Chester's essay, “High Christology–Whence, When and Why?”.

 

[RBPerry]

STRICT RULES OF BELIEVING


Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book;
19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

That passage only applies to Revelations not the entire Bible, remember John knew nothing about the New Testament when he wrote Revelations.

In the movie "good will hunting" there is a very good comment, it goes like this, "Why not try thinking for yourself and not just regurgitate what someone else has taught you."

Personally I believe God still speaks to us, sometimes we are so set in our ways we don't listen or pay attention. We all must remember that what we have in our current Bible is only what the Catholics wanted us to have. Of course then we protestants through out the books we felt weren't important, so much for adding to and removing from.

 

[Edgar44]

That passage only applies to Revelations not the entire Bible, remember John knew nothing about the New Testament when he wrote Revelations.

Unless of course, God was behind the scenes (so to speak), directing how the finished product (the Bible), should appear to mankind.

In which case, the possibility exists that God intended for the passage in Revelations to include the whole book.

Isn't there a similar passage given for the Old Testament too? Daniel I believe.

 

[x141]

It is the book opening in us that cannot be added to or taken away from, which becomes to us when we do the same as the eating of the tree of knowledge, it becomes the law of our mind that binds us.