The Duggar Family

[Root of Jesse]

Oh my gosh. This is why Christians are laughed at.

Why, because they handled it the way Jesus said in Matthew 15:18 and following?

 

[Liberasit]

How do you know that this is not what was happening???

. Because playing mums and dads is for 4 - 6 year olds, and it is done equally by all parties. No one preys on another when they are supposedly asleep.

Agreed, but all the kids were home-schooled.

and this is when home schooling is worrying. Supposedly to keep children out of the world, but it also keeps children's experiences secret from the wider society. There are no safeguards for these children.

I don't know that 'dry humping' would get 19 kids and counting...

I recall a particular episode where Jim Bob and Michelle were "double dating" with Jill and her man, at a crazy golf. They were definitely rubbing in what the courting couple were not allowed to do. It was quite sickening, tbh

Ever read Ephesians 5-6?

Many times. What does this passage teach you?

 

[ToBeLoved]

I trust In Touch Magazine as much as I trust Charles Manson. Do you think that, just because some authority comes knocking on your door, you have to comply? If that's the case, why, in McKinney, TX, is that young girl not in jail, and the cop still working?

I would normally agree with you as far as 'In Touch' magazine, however, there is a 911 call that is public record. That is what they are reporting from, a public 911 call made this morning by a DHS employee who could not access the minor in question.

So, in this instance, I think In Touch magazine has the story right.

I think with a child abuse official checking on an underage minor child, it seems that they have to comply. If DHS is involved, then that is a sign that all is not well in the Duggar home.

Just an observation as you stated that 'all seemed well' in this home.

 

[Liberasit]

it sounds like his actions have tarnished Christianity's image even further and just made witnessing that much harder. Everything happened a while ago, and they have all forgiven each other, but justice still must be done. I think his image forever tarnished with his sins made public is punishment enough. IMHO, and is probably the justice that was denied 13 years ago.

I think if they had kept their opinions within their own family then there would have been sympathetic head nodding - "there but the grace of God go I".

The main problem is that they, after this event, were vocal opponents of the LGBT population citing higher levels of child abuse. The person who conducted multiple events of indecent assault was actually a lobbyist against the actions that he himself perpetrated.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Oh my gosh. This is why Christians are laughed at.

That is exactly why I wanted to know about this case in particular. Because the overlying thing is that they are Christians, but these people are in a cult. They do all sorts of weird stuff in the name of Christianity, however their actions betray them and their hate speech is mortifying as it is full of accusations of a particular group of people that have no findings.

Even today, they take more care in covering up problems and trying to save their tv show, then showing Christianity. It's just a sick, sick situation.

 

[ToBeLoved]

I think if they had kept their opinions within their own family then there would have been sympathetic head nodding - "there but the grace of God go I".

The main problem is that they, after this event, were vocal opponents of the LGBT population citing higher levels of child abuse. The person who conducted multiple events of indecent assault was actually a lobbyist against the actions that he himself perpetrated.

BINGO!

Not just Josh, but the entire family! I think that God is trying to show them something, but their pride and ego is off the charts.

 

[ToBeLoved]

it sounds like his actions have tarnished Christianity's image even further and just made witnessing that much harder. Everything happened a while ago, and they have all forgiven each other, but justice still must be done. I think his image forever tarnished with his sins made public is punishment enough. IMHO, and is probably the justice that was denied 13 years ago.

What is most ironic (and the irony is well ....) is that if they would have come clean when it happened and followed the law, then the file would have been closed.

It is only after their bobbing and weaving in this mess that allowed the perpetrator to turn 18 which in turn allowed for open records. I wonder if God is teaching them humility.

 

[Root of Jesse]

. Because playing mums and dads is for 4 - 6 year olds, and it is done equally by all parties. No one preys on another when they are supposedly asleep.

I don't know, never heard of 'mums and dads'.

and this is when home schooling is worrying. Supposedly to keep children out of the world, but it also keeps children's experiences secret from the wider society. There are no safeguards for these children.

I don't want to have to trust the state to teach my children. But when it comes to socializing children, many home-schoolers have play dates with other home-schoolers.

I recall a particular episode where Jim Bob and Michelle were "double dating" with Jill and her man, at a crazy golf. They were definitely rubbing in what the courting couple were not allowed to do. It was quite sickening, tbh

Don't know, never saw it. I did see them in a service at FBC in Atlanta, though.

Many times. What does this passage teach you?

It teaches wives and husbands to be submissive to each other and to love each other as they love the Church.

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

What is most ironic (and the irony is well ....) is that if they would have come clean when it happened and followed the law, then the file would have been closed.

It is only after their bobbing and weaving in this mess that allowed the perpetrator to turn 18 which in turn allowed for open records. I wonder if God is teaching them humility.

I would have had a lot more respect if he took a the hit and asked for his redemption during whatever punishment the law allowed. The fact his affluent family protected him from the law of the land.. I dunno. I thought we were supposed to follow the laws of the land as Christians? Wouldn't a reformed person who lobbies against something he did have more weight than what happen? The best advocate for wearing seatbelts and had the biggest impression on people I had ever met was a woman in a wheelchair because she didn't wear hers.

 

[Liberasit]

I don't know, never heard of 'mums and dads'.
I don't want to have to trust the state to teach my children. But when it comes to socializing children, many home-schoolers have play dates with other home-schoolers.
Don't know, never saw it. I did see them in a service at FBC in Atlanta, though.


Many times. What does this passage teach you?

It teaches wives and husbands to be submissive to each other and to love each other as they love the Church.[/QUOTE]

The really disturbing thing is that girls are taught to be totally submissive of all men. It's not limited at husbands and wives.

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

I mean i think about it more, the back of my mind screams for justice that was avoided..but if the victims are actually over it and have forgiven him over it..well what can you do?
The victims actions towards him are prime example of Christian forgiveness. I don't know if I could forgive someone who did that to me. That is the Holy Spirit at work.

 

[ToBeLoved]

This is an article about the teachings of ATI which is the Duggars #1 recommended homeschool teaching program. They follow this and send their kids to all the events and this is the institute (ATI) that Josh was sent to.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/05/26/duggars-homeschooling-sex-abuse_n_7445238.html

 

[Root of Jesse]

I would have had a lot more respect if he took a the hit and asked for his redemption during whatever punishment the law allowed. The fact his affluent family protected him from the law of the land.. I dunno. I thought we were supposed to follow the laws of the land as Christians? Wouldn't a reformed person who lobbies against something he did have more weight than what happen? The best advocate for wearing seatbelts and had the biggest impression on people I had ever met was a woman in a wheelchair because she didn't wear hers.

We're only required to follow the law of the land when it doesn't violate our faith. The Catholic Church, during WWII, did not turn over Jews to the Nazis, as the law demanded, for example.
Look, from a high-level view, the child admitted what he did, the parents disciplined him several ways...I agree about the hemming and hawing, and so on, but nobody likes to air their dirty laundry, especially a few years after it had, supposedly, been dealt with.
It is true that someone who can say "Been there, done that, reformed, forgiven, done the time!" is a better witness. But the kid was a kid, and the girls were kids, and none of this should have been revealed after it had been sealed.
By the way, my brother stinks too...

 

[Root of Jesse]

It teaches wives and husbands to be submissive to each other and to love each other as they love the Church.

The really disturbing thing is that girls are taught to be totally submissive of all men. It's not limited at husbands and wives.[/QUOTE]Where? I don't see the passage saying that.

 

[ToBeLoved]

I mean i think about it more, the back of my mind screams for justice that was avoided..but if the victims are actually over it and have forgiven him over it..well what can you do?
The victims actions towards him are prime example of Christian forgiveness. I don't know if I could forgive someone who did that to me. That is the Holy Spirit at work.

What I have a problem with is that the girls were forced to forgive. Forgiveness is a point that each person needs to come to in their heart, so that cannot be forced.

As far as Josh asking God for forgiveness which is what his parents said happened, who can say but God who has asked for forgiveness. These parents expect obedience from the kids, however in these type of situations, forgiveness cannot be forced with obedience. Not true forgiveness anyway.

Having the parents speak for a now 27 year old man is odd. It shows how big of control freaks they are.

 

[Liberasit]

The really disturbing thing is that girls are taught to be totally submissive of all men. It's not limited at husbands and wives.

Where? I don't see the passage saying that.

No, the passage doesn't say that, but that is how the Duggar girls are brought up.

 

[Root of Jesse]

What I have a problem with is that the girls were forced to forgive. Forgiveness is a point that each person needs to come to in their heart, so that cannot be forced.

As far as Josh asking God for forgiveness which is what his parents said happened, who can say but God who has asked for forgiveness. These parents expect obedience from the kids, however in these type of situations, forgiveness cannot be forced with obedience. Not true forgiveness anyway.

Having the parents speak for a now 27 year old man is odd. It shows how big of control freaks they are.

What leads you to believe that the girls were forced to forgive? I mean, the boy ratted on himself, did penance, and received forgiveness. The family took measures to prevent it from happening again, and it didn't, apparently.

I gotta say, forgiveness is a tough thing. I did something 10 years ago my wife hasn't totally forgiven me for, but I live with that. Josh has to live with what he did. But juvenile records should remain sealed.

 

[Root of Jesse]

No, the passage doesn't say that, but that is how the Duggar girls are brought up.

Maybe all men who have authority, but not all men. I could not walk up to one of those girls and tell her to do something, and expect that she'd do it. Be real.

 

[Open Heart]

but children are not adult

a 14 year old is not exactly a little child. He is was a teenager. In most times and places that means he is morally responsible as an adult. In juvenile hall, he could receive counseling, and still have the dignity of being treated as a responsible person and not like a baby.

 

[Open Heart]

the boy ratted on himself, did penance, and received forgiveness.

What penance?