My Turn...

[JojotheBeloved]

Although I'm not always sure that posting articles and videos and various other materials for the purpose of convincing others is helpful... I guess it's my turn to take a potentially unhelpful stab at sharing a message that I found very powerful. My desire is to assist my Adventist church family - which is basically what this forum is for me right now. If it is not helpful, I apologize. If it is, than I am very glad.

Excerpt from the article: "We need to connect through Jesus, not theology."
Article Title: That's So Meta: The Post-Postmodern Church

https://s3.amazonaws.com/the1proj-main/documents/That's So Meta-The Post-Postmodern Church.pdf

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Great article defining where we are in society, however, I disagree that the answer to moving forward, in figuring out a new evangelical model, is to let each come to their own narrative of the 'truth'. There are immovable pillars holding a platform that we defend as God's Truth. Without absolutes, God and salvation becomes whatever we think, processed through our fallible, finite, post/meta/modern mind.

I guess I wasn't surprised at the authors conclusion, as he is writing for an ecumenical movement, 'The 1 Project'... sadly, where the GC seems to be taking the church.
I agree that we need to understand the state of peoples minds to reach them but that it doesn't mean we tailor the Truth to suit. The new 'metamodern' message from the church seems to be that preaching Jesus is sufficient for these times we live in... that is not the message for the hour! Satan will do whatever necessary to kill the 3 angels message. Identifying, exposing and calling a people out of Babylon is our calling and we cannot let modern philosophy distract us from it.

 

[Ubuntu]

Thanks for sharing, @jojo, food for thought indeed!

I live in a predominantly secular society, but in my experience people are interested in metanarratives such as the great controversy theme. People do have a deep rooted spiritual hunger, and more people than we realize are open to the advent message if it's presented in a way they understand.

I've had long talks (2+ hours) with random strangers that I've met while hiking up in the mountains, people who proved to be very receptive to the truth. People have told me that they had no idea that Christianity was like this, they've confessed that they've had their preconceptions about Christianity challenged.

Yet, if secular people are interested in the truth, why don't we see them in our churches? I don't think it's merely an issue of finding the correct evangelization formula, I think there's a more fundamental reason why our churches slowly are dying out:

“A city located on a hill cannot be hidden”.

 

[JojotheBeloved]

EastCoastRemnant: I hear what you're saying, and it's a valuable perpspective. My perspective is a bit different I guess. I don't see The 1 Project as being ecumenical. I see it as a forum to express honest frustrations with certain aspects of what we currently understand as "traditional" Adventism (although I'm not entirely comfortable with that label, but it will have to function for now), a forum to challenge preconceptions and really learn together and hear various perspectives from within the SDA Church, a forum for refocus on Jesus Christ - who is most important to all SDA Theology. I don't see it as trying to change biblical truth to fit our culture. I see it as understanding what our culture is, both in our areas of the world and within our SDA Church subculture, and discussing how we might better preach and teach the Gospel. Maybe that's just a difference in perspective. I don't know. But that's what I see.
As to this comment: "The new 'metamodern' message from the church seems to be that preaching Jesus is sufficient for these times we live in... that is not the message for the hour! Satan will do whatever necessary to kill the 3 angels message. Identifying, exposing and calling a people out of Babylon is our calling and we cannot let modern philosophy distract us from it." We'll have to agree to disagree. I think that without Jesus there is no 3 Angels Message and too often in my experience and the testimonies I've heard from others the prophecies from Revelation have been taught in a way that doesn't show Jesus. But without Jesus there is no message in Revelation, or in any other Adventist doctrine. The Great Controversy, the 3 Angels Messages, and all our eschatology means absolutely nothing without Jesus. That's not to say that those doctrines are at all lessened by focusing on Jesus, but just that to not focus on Jesus and understand how Jesus informs these doctrines does a disservice to those doctrines.
But I am happy to agree to disagree, if you wish. And it is a valid and good thing to critique the author of the message. I wouldn't have thought of the points you bring up. So thank you for doing so.

Ubuntu: Thank you for sharing your perspective as well. You bring up some very good points. I agree that there are more than one reason why secular people aren't seen in churches, even if they are interested in truth claims. I don't know where you're located, but as was pointed out in the article, things can be different in different parts of the world - and even possibly different regions of the same country. I don't know necessarily how things are in any particular area, but I find it interesting to hear the similarities and the differences. So thank you.

 

[JojotheBeloved]

Great article defining where we are in society,...

I agree. And that's really what I was most interested in from the article.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

I think that without Jesus there is no 3 Angels Message and too often in my experience and the testimonies I've heard from others the prophecies from Revelation have been taught in a way that doesn't show Jesus. But without Jesus there is no message in Revelation, or in any other Adventist doctrine. The Great Controversy, the 3 Angels Messages, and all our eschatology means absolutely nothing without Jesus.

You are, of course, absolutely right...

Thanx...

 

[JojotheBeloved]

Thank you

 

[Ubuntu]

I think that without Jesus there is no 3 Angels Message and too often in my experience and the testimonies I've heard from others the prophecies from Revelation have been taught in a way that doesn't show Jesus. But without Jesus there is no message in Revelation, or in any other Adventist doctrine. The Great Controversy, the 3 Angels Messages, and all our eschatology means absolutely nothing without Jesus. That's not to say that those doctrines are at all lessened by focusing on Jesus, but just that to not focus on Jesus and understand how Jesus informs these doctrines does a disservice to those doctrines.

Are you familiar with the book "The Lamb Among the Beasts? (Finding Jesus in the Book of Revelation)" by Roy C. Naden? This is a book that was a great inspiration to me when I first read it, and it sounds as if it would be right up your alley! You should check it out if you haven't already read it.

http://www.amazon.com/Among-Beasts-Finding-Jesus-Revelations/dp/082800983X