, Mom Defends Teen Son Charged With Hate Crime: ‘He’s A Good Child’

Johnboy60

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Ana the Ist

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On Tuesday, CBS 2’s Dana Kozlov broke the story about a 14-year-old student who was charged with a hate crime against a fellow classmate.

The in-school attack happened Monday in Crystal Lake, and the eighth-grader was charged with two felonies.

On Wednesday, the family of the alleged attacker called to tell their side of the story, in this Original Report.

Mom Defends Teen Son Charged With Hate Crime: ‘He’s A Good Child’ « CBS Chicago

"There should be more adults around." Someone should tell her that if the kid had one good parent he wouldn't need adult supervision all the time. I don't know if it's a hate crime though...seems like a stretch.
 
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Habbit Animal

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I agree. A hate crime? I'm thinking they're charging this this way because of the ethnicity of the victim. Which would be racist in itself to imply someone who gets in a fight with someone not of their own race are guilty of a hate crime.

But good boys don't break the collar bones of other boys so that the victim needs surgery to install plates to repair the damage.

There's more to this story. Hopefully it'll come out soon.
 
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Ana the Ist

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I agree. A hate crime? I'm thinking they're charging this this way because of the ethnicity of the victim. Which would be racist in itself to imply someone who gets in a fight with someone not of their own race are guilty of a hate crime.

But good boys don't break the collar bones of other boys so that the victim needs surgery to install plates to repair the damage.

There's more to this story. Hopefully it'll come out soon.

Well, supposedly the boy who assaulted the victim said a racist remark or two. It's just at that age, I can't say with any certainty that it wasn't merely an attempt to bully or get under the skin of the victim. Kids say things all the time that they don't really mean.
 
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CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN

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Omid said his attacker first swiped at his Middle Eastern ethnicity and then insulted his mother before slamming him to the ground.
That would make it a hate crime. As for the mother of the teen charged, she needs to wake, her son is a bad boy. No good boy would be so violent.
 
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I think the mom is in denial and her kid obviously has some issues - anger or otherwise. The kid who got beaten may have ran his mouth, but ultimately, the kid who broke his collarbones needs to learn there are consequences for bad choices. I don't think a hate crime, even though he may have thrown out a racist comment. Lots of details remain to be revealed. Right now the reason for the attack is still up in the air.
 
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TravelerFarAwayFromHome

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On Tuesday, CBS 2’s Dana Kozlov broke the story about a 14-year-old student who was charged with a hate crime against a fellow classmate.

The in-school attack happened Monday in Crystal Lake, and the eighth-grader was charged with two felonies.

On Wednesday, the family of the alleged attacker called to tell their side of the story, in this Original Report.

Mom Defends Teen Son Charged With Hate Crime: ‘He’s A Good Child’ « CBS Chicago

they ALL are "a good child"! DUH! ( roll eyes).

there should be laws in place to punish parents such as those as well!
 
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OllieFranz

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It is easy to vilify a violent person as a hate criminal in the press simply because he is also white. It is much harder prove it in court. It takes much more evidence than what was presented in this article. (We only have the statements of each boy, accusing the other of suddenly switching from good-hearted joking to a threat or racial epithets. The police surely interviewed other witnesses, whose statements have not been released to the public.)

On the other hand, the violent "aggravated assault" does not appear to have been denied, and the other boy's broken bones are real. At 14, the defendent is still a juvenile. I'm not sure what Illinois law and common practice are as to whether he is more likely to be tried as a juvenile or as an adult, or what sentences he might be facing in either case.
 
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poolerboy0077

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I think there's a lot of confusion here about how hate crime laws function. Here is an excerpt from the oral arguments of the (unanimously decided) case of Wisconsin v. Mitchell, 508 U.S. 476 (1993) upholding a Wisconsin hate crime law. Hopefully this will provide clarification:
Mr. Doyle: The jury is given a special verdict under the Wisconsin penalty enhancement statute and it is, they return two verdicts, guilt or innocence on the charge and as well as the question on whether or not the defendant intentionally selected the victim because of the victim's race, or whatever the particular status may be in the case.

And it is that point, I believe, that is extremely important in this case.

What the Wisconsin statute does is look at the intentional selection of the victim.

There is a lot of talk about biased thought, hate thought, and so on.

The Wisconsin statute does not go after biased thought or hate thought.

We don't know whether Mr. Mitchell had racial bias or not.

It's likely he did given the facts of the case, but we don't know.

And to a large measure in Wisconsin we don't care.

For example, Mr. Mitchell might have selected that victim because of his race simply to show off to the group of young men that was around him about how tough he was or some other reason.

We don't know.

Mr. Mitchell may have the benignest thoughts about race relations as are possible, and yet he would be guilty under the Wisconsin law because he intentionally selected the victim because of the victim's race.


Justice Scalia: Is there any limit on the reasons for selection that the state can specify for higher punishment?

I mean, could it say if you select a victim on the basis of whether or not he believes in the hole in the ozone layer?

Could you do that?

Or whether he believes that the earth revolves around the sun rather than vice-versa?


Mr. Doyle: I believe that in view of the state if the particular category serves a legitimate state interest and meets equal protection tests and meets vagueness... some of the examples you have given, Justice Scalia, I think would be difficult obviously to put into a statute that would meet the vagueness test.

But if it meets those, that--


Justice Scalia: It has to serve a legitimate state interest?


Mr. Doyle: --I believe that--


Justice Scalia: So one has to judge whether being against flat earth people is less important than being against people who don't like particular religions, for example?


Mr. Doyle: --No, that would not be the legitimate state interest.

The legitimate state interest is if, for example, you have had a problem in your state, there is a large debate going on about flat or round earth and there have been a great number of fights that have gone on in your state for a period of time and the state legislature decides that the violence attached to this debate is one that needs to be addressed and that people who are acting out of, who are selecting victims because of that reason present a particular danger to the community, then I think the state could act.


Justice Scalia: Okay.

So it isn't the goodness or badness of the idea that you're talking about, it's whether attacks on the basis of that idea are a particular problem?


Mr. Doyle: That's right, whether they present, in a traditional criminal context that they present a significant law enforcement problem to the State of Wisconsin.
 
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OllieFranz

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I think there's a lot of confusion here about how hate crime laws function. Here is an excerpt from the oral arguments of the (unanimously decided) case of Wisconsin v. Mitchell, 508 U.S. 476 (1993) upholding a Wisconsin hate crime law. Hopefully this will provide clarification:
Mr. Doyle: The jury is given a special verdict under the Wisconsin penalty enhancement statute and it is, they return two verdicts, guilt or innocence on the charge and as well as the question on whether or not the defendant intentionally selected the victim because of the victim's race, or whatever the particular status may be in the case.

And it is that point, I believe, that is extremely important in this case.

What the Wisconsin statute does is look at the intentional selection of the victim.

There is a lot of talk about biased thought, hate thought, and so on.

The Wisconsin statute does not go after biased thought or hate thought.

We don't know whether Mr. Mitchell had racial bias or not.

It's likely he did given the facts of the case, but we don't know.

And to a large measure in Wisconsin we don't care.

For example, Mr. Mitchell might have selected that victim because of his race simply to show off to the group of young men that was around him about how tough he was or some other reason.

We don't know.

Mr. Mitchell may have the benignest thoughts about race relations as are possible, and yet he would be guilty under the Wisconsin law because he intentionally selected the victim because of the victim's race.


Justice Scalia: Is there any limit on the reasons for selection that the state can specify for higher punishment?

I mean, could it say if you select a victim on the basis of whether or not he believes in the hole in the ozone layer?

Could you do that?

Or whether he believes that the earth revolves around the sun rather than vice-versa?


Mr. Doyle: I believe that in view of the state if the particular category serves a legitimate state interest and meets equal protection tests and meets vagueness... some of the examples you have given, Justice Scalia, I think would be difficult obviously to put into a statute that would meet the vagueness test.

But if it meets those, that--


Justice Scalia: It has to serve a legitimate state interest?


Mr. Doyle: --I believe that--


Justice Scalia: So one has to judge whether being against flat earth people is less important than being against people who don't like particular religions, for example?


Mr. Doyle: --No, that would not be the legitimate state interest.

The legitimate state interest is if, for example, you have had a problem in your state, there is a large debate going on about flat or round earth and there have been a great number of fights that have gone on in your state for a period of time and the state legislature decides that the violence attached to this debate is one that needs to be addressed and that people who are acting out of, who are selecting victims because of that reason present a particular danger to the community, then I think the state could act.


Justice Scalia: Okay.

So it isn't the goodness or badness of the idea that you're talking about, it's whether attacks on the basis of that idea are a particular problem?


Mr. Doyle: That's right, whether they present, in a traditional criminal context that they present a significant law enforcement problem to the State of Wisconsin.

In that sense they are closer in intent and in definition to laws against incitement to riot and terroristic threats than to the strawman "hate speech."

"Hate speech" is a strawman in The USA, because of the First Amendment. In the UK and Canada, where they do not have First Amendment protection, as such, on speech they do appear to have enacted "hate speech" laws (at least according to the sources quoted in many threads started by our more conservative posters). Even so, most of the "hate speech" arrests that those sources report on -- where a street preacher is arrested "for just quoting the Bible" -- the LEOs ignored the preacher until he started obstructing traffic, and even then politely asked him to simply step a couple of feet out of the traffic flow several times before they essentially had no choice but to arrest him. So even when talking about those counties' laws, "hate speech laws" ( as described by many Conservative posters, are a strawman in practice, if not necessarily by definition.
 
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The article in the original post is a bit short on details, and heavy on hype. That a crime has been committed is not in question. I do have to say that in my experience as a pre-adult these things are rarely one sided. The newspaper should have interviewed some witnesses and got some quotes to make the story a little easier for the court of public opinion to weigh in upon it. By the way I once knew a very upstanding child who put another child in the hospital because for nearly six months the hospitalized child had picked on the other, and the school citing lack of evidence would do nothing about it. One person assulting another person is still wrong I believe but it is not always without provication, which this article really doesn't want to adress. Addressing all the aspects of a news items appears to no longer be within the scope of the newsmedia.

Thr existence of hate crime legislation is most unfotunate and does nothing to lessen the type of crime it was introduced to lessen. People in a mood for felinous assult simply don't stop to think "may my intententions here perchance be taken as a malicious attack on this fine fellow based on (you name the inequalizing factor)". People just don't have that much foresight. The idea of a hate crime in the case of assault is kind of silly really, I'm sure you don't beat the snot out of someone with the love of Jesus filling your heart. But we do not prosecute for a hate crime if one same race neighbor beats up the other over playing the radio too loud. Allow the one beaten to be of another minority color (I don't belive the eugenic race thing btw we are of the human race, color of skin is no more or less than a genetic traiy such as hair or eye color) or a homosexual then its on. I'm sure hate plays in either. These type of laws are why we have overflowing prisons and more prisoners per capita than any other nation on earth. There are atvantages to the sensationalism aspect of having hate crimes legislation, in many juridictions one felony commited in conjunction with another allows for agravated circumstances, therefore madating even more severe punishment than either crime carries on its own. American justice is a huge mess, and hate crime legislation is simply another thing draging it down.
 
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It looks like it was a hate crime, as the suspect seemed to have made some remarks about the victim's race. That said, I've never seen the point in hate crime laws. Does it matter if the person who broke your clavicles did so because he doesn't like your ethnicity? All that matters is that individual is clearly violent, and shouldn't be allowed to roam free any time soon.
 
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muslimsoldier4life

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Does it matter if the person who broke your clavicles did so because he doesn't like your ethnicity? All that matters is that individual is clearly violent, and shouldn't be allowed to roam free any time soon.

C'mon brother, America is a victim driven society. If anyone, outside of a white male is subject to any kind of assault, victimizing, or crude acts, and it's perpetuated by whitey, then of course there's a need for a hate crime law. Now if it's a minority doing it against a white male, then no hate law stipulation will be added, regardless of what was said.
 
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keith99

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It looks like it was a hate crime, as the suspect seemed to have made some remarks about the victim's race. That said, I've never seen the point in hate crime laws. Does it matter if the person who broke your clavicles did so because he doesn't like your ethnicity? All that matters is that individual is clearly violent, and shouldn't be allowed to roam free any time soon.

The reason for hate crime laws is because the perpetrator presents a danger to all individuals of at least one group.

It was intended for those who attack a person solely or at least primarily because of mere membership in said group.

It is not supposed to be for a conflict where the only difference is a person on one side uses a racial or ethnic slur instead of Ahole or you SOB.

What is given in the article does not support a hate crime charge. But it does seem there may be a lot more to this story.
 
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I agree there has to be more to this story. Though I would also say that a boy who assaults another child with such force that it breaks their collar bones is not someone I would right off the bat consider a good kid.

The force required so as to shatter those bones to the point plates are needed to repair the damage is immense. It's not simply a small matter of punching a kid that's bothering you.
 
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