Losing My Religion - My Struggle with God

[ThatWhichIsnt]

Why do you think Paul, a persecutor of early Christians, and James the brother of Jesus became followers?

I don't know. Why did a few Muslims believe god told them to fly planes into a few buildings? We are a creature with too small prefrontal cortexts and too large adrenaline glands. Study psychology. The human mind is an amazing thing.

 

[Asvin]

I don't know. Why did a few Muslims believe god told them to fly planes into a few buildings? We are a creature with too small prefrontal cortexts and too large adrenaline glands. Study psychology. The human mind is an amazing thing.

There is a difference.. Paul was a persecutor of Christians.. do you know of any Muslim that persecuted his own people before dying for his faith?

 

[Partaker of Christ]

PS: To those who will say,” You were never a true Christian to begin with.” I sincerely disagree, and you have no authority by which to make that accusation. I felt the “holy spirit”. I had experiences just like every other person who believes. I knew the doctrines both in my head and heart.

Forgive me, but how can you make that claim and then say that you no longer believe?
How can you claim to have felt the Holy Spirit, and then deny He ever exists?
If as you claim, you had (or felt) the Holy Spirit, then what more evidence do you need of the truth?

It seems to me from what you have written here, that your belief’s either way have never been yours, but what others have told you. It has been their beliefs/faith that you have intellectually accepted.

Faith does not come by reading, it comes by hearing and hearing the word of God.
Have you ever heard God speak to you personally, through His written word, or through another Christian, or preacher or teacher etc..?

Knowledge of God and His ways can be useful, but it can never replace or substitute knowing. Knowledge can change beliefs with different information, but knowing will always remain

 

[Nanopants]

I don't know. Why did a few Muslims believe god told them to fly planes into a few buildings? We are a creature with too small prefrontal cortexts and too large adrenaline glands. Study psychology. The human mind is an amazing thing.

Well, see, what we choose to believe about God says a lot about us as individuals. Some people believe in a cruel god, or a god of merciless wrath, etc, but I say God allowed this for a reason: He is the Judge of humanity, and He measures all of our hearts. God is like a mirror, measuring back to everyone the desires of our hearts. In some cases, cruelties are returned on people who measured out cruelties, but those who measured out blessings are themselves blessed. In this, God is shown to be perfectly just, and that He favors the merciful, kind and forgiving. For those who go further in pouring out their own lives for the sake of others, He measures back with His own life.

 

[ThatWhichIsnt]

There is a difference.. Paul was a persecutor of Christians.. do you know of any Muslim that persecuted his own people before dying for his faith?

Sure. I can name one that does both at the same time: suicide bombers.

 

[ThatWhichIsnt]

Forgive me, but how can you make that claim and then say that you no longer believe?
How can you claim to have felt the Holy Spirit, and then deny He ever exists?
If as you claim, you had (or felt) the Holy Spirit, then what more evidence do you need of the truth?

It seems to me from what you have written here, that your belief’s either way have never been yours, but what others have told you. It has been their beliefs/faith that you have intellectually accepted.

Faith does not come by reading, it comes by hearing and hearing the word of God.
Have you ever heard God speak to you personally, through His written word, or through another Christian, or preacher or teacher etc..?

Knowledge of God and His ways can be useful, but it can never replace or substitute knowing. Knowledge can change beliefs with different information, but knowing will always remain

Not to be purposefully demeaning, but every religious experience can be explained by brain phenomenon. Everything we feel and think are chemical reactions which take place in the brain. They are remarkable powerful.

This is a really interesting article: HowStuffWorks "Is the brain hardwired for religion?"

 

[Partaker of Christ]

That is the thing. It isn't well ordered. Chaos is still present around us, we just have escaped it long enough for life to form till as it is currently. One day that will change.

As someone who has a degree in physics you should know that we are barely at the tip of the iceberg when it comes to our understanding of it. Just because we do not have an answer now does not mean it is unattainable.

How do you know that?

Have you personally been there and witnessed it and personally studied it, or have you believed what other have said and written about it? Isn’t that also blind faith?

As for rationality:
Rationally I see the sun rise in the east and set in the west.
Rationally I see the sun, moon and stars orbiting the earth.
Rationally man tells me these things are not so.

Do I believe and trust what I rationally see, or what I am rationally told by man?

 

[ThatWhichIsnt]

How do you know that?

Have you personally been there and witnessed it and personally studied it, or have you believed what other have said and written about it? Isn’t that also blind faith?

As for rationality:
Rationally I see the sun rise in the east and set in the west.
Rationally I see the sun, moon and stars orbiting the earth.
Rationally man tells me these things are not so.

Do I believe and trust what I rationally see, or what I am rationally told by man?

What is the "it" you keep referring to?

 

[joey_downunder]

Using that logic atheism can be explained by brain phenomenon as well. I have met too many ex-believers who try to convince others it is purely logic that has caused them to reject Christianity.

What are you personally gaining by choosing to be an atheist? What sins, lifestyle choices and alternative ways of thinking would you have to give up if you chose to return to Jesus?

 

[seeingeyes]

Well, see, what we choose to believe about God says a lot about us as individuals. Some people believe in a cruel god, or a god of merciless wrath, etc, but I say God allowed this for a reason: He is the Judge of humanity, and He measures all of our hearts. God is like a mirror, measuring back to everyone the desires of our hearts. In some cases, cruelties are returned on people who measured out cruelties, but those who measured out blessings are themselves blessed. In this, God is shown to be perfectly just, and that He favors the merciful, kind and forgiving. For those who go further in pouring out their own lives for the sake of others, He measures back with His own life.

+1

 

[Partaker of Christ]

Not to be purposefully demeaning, but every religious experience can be explained by brain phenomenon. Everything we feel and think are chemical reactions which take place in the brain. They are remarkable powerful.

This is a really interesting article: HowStuffWorks "Is the brain hardwired for religion?"

Then I could say that you do not really exist, you are simply a brain phenomenon.

 

[Partaker of Christ]

What is the "it" you keep referring to?

The statement you made:

That is the thing. It isn't well ordered. Chaos is still present around us, we just have escaped it long enough for life to form till as it is currently. One day that will change.

 

[ChetSinger]

That is the thing. It isn't well ordered. Chaos is still present around us, we just have escaped it long enough for life to form till as it is currently. One day that will change.

You're in the realm of philosophy now, not science. I'm no philosopher so I won't follow you there.

I just have one last word of advice: don't burn your bridges behind you.

 

[orangeness365]

I became an atheist for a while, not because of my brain, but because my heart turned against God. I'm a Christian now. At the time I kept praying anyways though because I figured that it didn't matter, but then I became a Christian again later because of a dream I had. How about you keep praying anyway for faith? If your an atheist then you should believe it doesn't hurt anything, because you think that nothing is there. Why leave God for an argument? What if your wrong?

1 Timothy 6:20-21
20O Timothy, guard the deposit entrusted to you. Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called “knowledge,” 21for by professing it some have swerved from the faith.
Grace be with you.

 

[New_Wineskin]

I spent my Sundays at church in various Sunday school programs. I was taught the basic Christian doctrines at this time and prided myself in excelling in them as well.

Religion .

I went to church because I was forced to by my parents.

Religion .

My head knowledge of faith which was actively ideal once again morphed into an emotional one. I rediscovered my love for god. I dropped the classes I was in, and within 5 months was enrolled in a seminary type internship at the megachurch I attended.

Religion .

I spent a year of my life there (also five thousand dollars I might add). Eighty to one-hundred hours a week we spent running the church operations, conferences, services, special events, and the like. However, my favorite day and the one I excelled at the most was class day. Here we learned the ins and outs of Christian doctrine. To this day I believe I can quote the Bible and defend the Christian faith better than most believers.

Religion.

No wonder you question Christianity - this is all christianity - there is a huge difference .

 

[ThatWhichIsnt]

Using that logic atheism can be explained by brain phenomenon as well. I have met too many ex-believers who try to convince others it is purely logic that has caused them to reject Christianity.

What are you personally gaining by choosing to be an atheist? What sins, lifestyle choices and alternative ways of thinking would you have to give up if you chose to return to Jesus?

My life looks the same as it has in the past. I didn't renounce my faith so I can pick up a vice deemed sinful by some. The very fact that you think so is dripping with arrogance and judgement.

I did gain a belief system that makes rational and logic sense. In fact, I have felt more liberated than ever. No more cosmic tyrant who can send me to hell for mere thought crime.

 

[ThatWhichIsnt]

Then I could say that you do not really exist, you are simply a brain phenomenon.

Except I have am a physical being made of matter, sure.

 

[BluhdoftheLamb]

Mr OP:

I have joined the forum solely to be able to respond to you. Normally I'm content to just read, and there are certainly others capable of going head-to-head with you in terms of "defending the faith," which you said you could do as well as most, so I don't need to involve myself in any such debate.

I just want to say to you congratulations for leaving what is certainly not Christianity! Fortunately you have the good sense to do that.

Hopefully if God draws you, you will also have the good sense to recognize Him; not all do. From reading what you've said so far, you do not seem to be so drawn at this time. Do you agree?

 

[Gregory Thompson]

I'm gonna unsubscribe for now . hope what i said was helpful .

 

[Asvin]

My life looks the same as it has in the past. I didn't renounce my faith so I can pick up a vice deemed sinful by some. The very fact that you think so is dripping with arrogance and judgement.

I did gain a belief system that makes rational and logic sense. In fact, I have felt more liberated than ever. No more cosmic tyrant who can send me to hell for mere thought crime.

You say that your life looks the same? I beg to differ.. would you have called God a "cosmic tyrant who can send me to hell for mere thought crime"? if you still were a Christian? I don't think so. Reading your posts, I get the impression that you never even had a genuine faith BECAUSE (before you ask me how I or anyone can know) you mention your parents forcing you, your bad experience with pastors, and also being impressed by pathetic arguments from Christopher Hitchens. All of his arguments are either red herrings or logically fallacious. Please do you yourself a favor and read the wonderful books written by Alvin Plantinga, William Lane Craig, Gary Habermas, Craig S. Keener, etc. If you do in fact read them and be open minded, I GUARANTEE you that you will find good historical evidence to trust Jesus' claims about himself. That doesn't mean that you will become a Christian again. Only God can draw people to himself.

Hope you take this seriously!