God Created the world 6000 years ago

[Phaedron777]

Creation VS Evolution, Science and Religion, Catholic, Protestant Bible

 

[CryptoLutheran]

There is no tension between Creation and evolution, the tension is between a particular view of creation through a wooden interpretation of certain passages of Scripture and what is uncovered through the scientific process.

If we find human artifacts, pottery, tools, sculpture, building remains that date a couple thousand years before the supposed "date of creation" then clearly our reading of the text that says the universe is only six thousand years old. If we find that there are human remains that are hundreds of thousands of years old, then the same, or fossils that date back two hundred million years.

Or the simple fact that when you look up at the night sky, some of those little points of light that you see, are hundreds of millions of light years away. The most distant observable object in the night sky that can be seen with the naked eye is the Andromeda Galaxy, it's over two billion light years away. That means that for the light you currently are seeing to have traveled the distance to your eyes, it has taken over two billion years.

That's a simple fact. It's unavoidable unless one believes that God decided to trick us all, creating light in mid transit. That is, God created a universe with a 14 billion year old history only six thousand years ago. That's deception, and what it says about God is theologically toxic.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Papias]

Phaedron, if you and not a hit and run poster just trying to get some publicity so as to get money from people, are you aware that the Catholic church is fully supportive of evolution, including strong statements from many in the Vatican, including the Pope?


-Papias

 

[Research2]

Phaedron, if you and not a hit and run poster just trying to get some publicity so as to get money from people, are you aware that the Catholic church is fully supportive of evolution, including strong statements from many in the Vatican, including the Pope?


-Papias

Not all Catholics support evolution, also the Vatican or Pope's views regarding evolution have been interpreted many different ways.

List of Catholic creationist organisations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Papias]

All well and good, Research2.

So how do you interpret Pope Benedict XVI's statement on evolution, below?

**************************
According to the widely accepted scientific account, the universe erupted 15 billion years ago in an explosion called the 'Big Bang' and has been expanding and cooling ever since. Later there gradually emerged the conditions necessary for the formation of atoms, still later the condensation of galaxies and stars, and about 10 billion years later the formation of planets. In our own solar system and on earth (formed about 4.5 billion years ago), the conditions have been favorable to the emergence of life. While there is little consensus among scientists about how the origin of this first microscopic life is to be explained, there is general agreement among them that the first organism dwelt on this planet about 3.5 - 4 billion years ago. Since it has been demonstrated that all living organisms on earth are genetically related, it is virtually certain that all living organisms have descended from this first organism. Converging evidence from many studies in the physical and biological sciences furnishes mounting support for some theory of evolution to account for the development and diversification of life on earth, while controversy continues over the pace and mechanisms of evolution.

-Pope Benedict XVI

****************

Papias

 

[Research2]

-Pope Benedict XVI

****************

Papias

''But it is also true that the theory of evolution is not a complete, scientifically proven theory''

- Pope Benedict XVI

Benedict added that the immense time span that evolution covers made it impossible to conduct experiments in a controlled environment to finally verify or disprove the theory.

Pope says evolution can't be proven - USATODAY.com

 

[Papias]

Research2, I hope you see that all his statements are consistent.

By "Finally verify" or "prove", he means in the absolute sense. Of course it can't be absolutely proven any more than any other scientific idea, including things like the theory of gravity. That's why he says "virtually certain".

And of course it's not complete - evolution is an active area of research, with more being learned constantly. I hardly see that as a news flash.

and that science has unnecessarily narrowed humanity's view of creation.

If you are familiar with the Catholic view of creation, you'll immediately see that this statement is in reference to the soul, divinely given by God, and outside of science's study.

So taken together, it all works fine. I agree with all his statements. Do you?

Papias

 

[Research2]

So taken together, it all works fine. I agree with all his statements. Do you?

Papias

The Pope's view is that evolution is just a theory, not a scientific fact. Therefore its down to the individual Catholic in what they want to believe, and there are many Catholics who are Young Earth Creationists or Old Earth Creationists and do not believe in evolution. See the link of Catholic creationist orgs i provided.

 

[Dark_Lite]

The Pope's view is that evolution is just a theory, not a scientific fact. Therefore its down to the individual Catholic in what they want to believe, and there are many Catholics who are Young Earth Creationists or Old Earth Creationists and do not believe in evolution. See the link of Catholic creationist orgs i provided.

Creationism is permissible under Catholic theology.

That doesn't mean it's actually correct.

 

[Papias]

Research2, you didn't answer my question.

I didn't ask you to put words in the Pope's mouth (that's for God to do), but rather, if you agreed with him. You of course don't have to do so - I don't think you are Catholic. So do you?

Papias

 

[philadiddle]

evolution is just a theory, not a scientific fact.

 

[Jazer]

If we find human artifacts, pottery, tools, sculpture, building remains that date a couple thousand years before the supposed "date of creation" then clearly our reading of the text that says the universe is only six thousand years old. If we find that there are human remains that are hundreds of thousands of years old, then the same, or fossils that date back two hundred million years.

6000 years has to do with the creation of Adam in the Bible. It goes back to the work of Bishop Ussher. He did address the question: did anything exist before Adam. His answer was pretty much that he did not know, because at the time science had no evidence one way or the other. Today we know that Adam and Eve lived about 6,000 years ago. So Bishops Usshers book today is still a valid work and study. The "Gap" theory attempted to deal with this also, but very little effort or study was put into that theory. So a lot of your evidence for whatever existed before Adam was found after Ussher published his book back in the 1600's.

 

[Research2]

Research2, you didn't answer my question.

I didn't ask you to put words in the Pope's mouth (that's for God to do), but rather, if you agreed with him. You of course don't have to do so - I don't think you are Catholic. So do you?

Papias

I answered your question.

It would help if you cut out the personal attacks. I see you post in most threads in this section and you have a rather horrible and cocky attitude where you just set out to attack or be nasty to creationists.

The Pope's view is that evolution is not proven and therefore that Catholics can embrace creationism (hence there are many Catholic creationist organisations). Perhaps this upsets you as an evolutionist, but i think its a position most agree with. The only people who think evolution is a scientific fact and 100% proven are mostly militant atheists, even the Pope pointed that out if you read the link i provided.

 

[philadiddle]

I answered your question.

No, he asked if you agreed with the pope's statements and you didn't answer that question.

It would help if you cut out the personal attacks. I see you post in most threads in this section and you have a rather horrible and cocky attitude where you just set out to attack or be nasty to creationists.

There was nothing about his post that was a personal attack.

Good job trolling.

 

[Research2]

There was nothing about his post that was a personal attack.

Good job trolling.

You might want to cut out the personal attacks as well.

Your only contribution to this thread was firstly a single '''' emote, and now accusing me of being a troll, which exposes you as the real troll.

Don't post in thread unless you have something to offer.

 

[Research2]

There was nothing about his post that was a personal attack.

His entire post was a personal attack -

He accused me of ''putting words'' in the Pope's mouth, and then sarcastically added ''that's for God to do'', however all i did was quote from an article which cites what the Pope himself stated.

Hence i pointed out this was a personal attack, and reported the post.

And the only reason you are defending a rule breaker over me, is because Papias is an evolutionist. This is typically how you evo-trolls work on this forum - gang up on the creationist. Seen it all so many times before.

 

[Walter Kovacs]

Quick correction: Andromeda is 2.6 million light years away. carry on.

 

[Notedstrangeperson]

And the only reason you are defending a rule breaker over me, is because Papias is an evolutionist. This is typically how you evo-trolls work on this forum - gang up on the creationist. Seen it all so many times before.

Heh, evo-trolls ...

You're having trouble debating evolutionists because you think anyone who disagrees with you is a 'troll' launching a 'personal attack'. You're going to end up with half of the CF users on your ignore list.

The debate over whether evolution is anti-Christian has been talked to death. It isn't - they're compatable.

 

[philadiddle]

Don't post in thread unless you have something to offer.

^This^

His entire post was a personal attack -

He accused me of ''putting words'' in the Pope's mouth, and then sarcastically added ''that's for God to do'', however all i did was quote from an article which cites what the Pope himself stated.

Hence i pointed out this was a personal attack, and reported the post.

That's not personal, he was attacking your arguments and choice of words, not your personality.

Take a deep breath and relax, if you misconstrue peoples disagreement as personal attacks you are going to make this very hard on yourself.

 

[Jazer]

There is no tension between Creation and evolution, the tension is between a particular view of creation

The tension is from a view of Creation that does not take Science into consideration. At least not modern Science as we now know it. In Chapter one of the Bible you have 7 days. We are told a day is equal to 1000 years. Then in the story of Adam you can add another 6000 years. SO if you look at Science and go back 13,000 years what do you have? You basicly have the end of an ice age and mass extinction. It is basicly the beginning of a new Age. The modern world that we currently live in. Also we know that in the last 13,000 years man stoped being a hunter gather and began to be a food producer. We have the beginning of domesticated animals. Themes that are covered extensively in the Bible. Before long we see the Bible is a lot more accurate of a history book then what some people want to give it credit for.