End Times Research

Gentle Lamb

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Hello all! :)

I've been doing a lot of research about the end times, coming Christian persecution, tribulation, etc. and was wondering if anyone could direct me to possible sources that they have watched or read concerning visions, prophecies, upcoming events, etc.? It would be greatly appreciated, thanks! :)
 

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Hello all! :)

I've been doing a lot of research about the end times, coming Christian persecution, tribulation, etc. and was wondering if anyone could direct me to possible sources that they have watched or read concerning visions, prophecies, upcoming events, etc.? It would be greatly appreciated, thanks! :)

I think Billy Graham ministry might have an faq on this topic

check it out first because it is a reputable ministry and it might give you a good overview before you look into the details
 
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Gentle Lamb

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I think Billy Graham ministry might have an faq on this topic

check it out first because it is a reputable ministry and it might give you a good overview before you look into the details

Thanks! I will check there :)
 
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LoricaLady

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.I am personally very leery of people who have said "I have had visions about the end times." How can you reality check any of that? Some of it also seems to conflict with Scriptures. We are warned to watch out for false prophets and there are plenty of them around.

I prefer those who go line by line in the Scriptures and who have a grasp of the history and geography of the areas mentioned in the Bible - like what their names actually are now, and so on.

The first link I will give you is fascinating, but not necessarily fun to consider. As with all these vids, you can search the Scriptures and make up your own mind. We are told "You need that no man should teach you, but the Holy Spirit will teach you." Always go to Him first, for guidance to the truth, and protection from error. I personally am way unimpressed by Billy Graham due to some background checking I did on him - but again, you need to be going to the Holy Spirit yourself about him and any others. This takes time but you seem willing to take the time.


Here is a link which gives Bible verse after Bible verse in relation to the pretrib rapture, which is not accepted. One thing is very evident, there are countless Christians around the world who are suffering unimaginable tribulation right now, and such as frequently been the case historically:


Armaggedon News and Psalm 119 Ministries both have other vids on the end times if you want to see them.

I hope no one wants to debate the topics in the vids. You are free to give your resources, too, but we are told to remember that this is not a debate forum.

Praying for you to have wisdom and insight regarding these last days, but most of all for you to be prayed up and obeyed up so that you are well equipped to get through them.
 
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Gentle Lamb

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.I am personally very leery of people who have said "I have had visions about the end times." How can you reality check any of that? Some of it also seems to conflict with Scriptures. We are warned to watch out for false prophets and there are plenty of them around.

I prefer those who go line by line in the Scriptures and who have a grasp of the history and geography of the areas mentioned in the Bible - like what their names actually are now, and so on.

The first link I will give you is fascinating, but not necessarily fun to consider. As with all these vids, you can search the Scriptures and make up your own mind. We are told "You need that no man should teach you, but the Holy Spirit will teach you." Always go to Him first, for guidance to the truth, and protection from error. I personally am way unimpressed by Billy Graham due to some background checking I did on him - but again, you need to be going to the Holy Spirit yourself about him and any others. This takes time but you seem willing to take the time.


Here is a link which gives Bible verse after Bible verse in relation to the pretrib rapture, which is not accepted. One thing is very evident, there are countless Christians around the world who are suffering unimaginable tribulation right now, and such as frequently been the case historically:


Armaggedon News and Psalm 119 Ministries both have other vids on the end times if you want to see them.

I hope no one wants to debate the topics in the vids. You are free to give your resources, too, but we are told to remember that this is not a debate forum.

Praying for you to have wisdom and insight regarding these last days, but most of all for you to be prayed up and obeyed up so that you are well equipped to get through them.

Hey LoricaLady,

Thanks for taking the time to post these! I definitely will go line by line and test out these sources. I've already found some sources that are very well put together but have some wrong information in them according to Scriptures. One thing that makes me not leery of visions is when multiple people are saying the same thing/having the same vision, then I feel it's more likely to be true, and also yes, definitely asking God for guidance & wisdom on all things as He has no lack of either :) Thanks very much for the videos, I'll be watching them soon. God bless :)
 
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LoricaLady

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You sound like a nice, sweet, sincere person, and wise enough to know we must "Test everything."

Btw I'm not saying visions are not ever valid. Visions are certainly one way that Abba communicates to us. I'm just saying I'm leery of people who say they've had them, because there are some phony or deceived people out there. We can all be fooled, even if well meaning. It is not easy to know who is for real and who is not. At least not for moi! :)

As far as people having the same visions, well, I'm sure you'd agree that both the Father and the devil can duplicate their messages to more than one person.
 
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LoricaLady

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I'd wait for Jesus to come back and explain it all, he's the only one who'd know what it all means

I guess if Abba didn't want us to know anything about the last days, then He wouldn't have spoken of them as He does, at great length in both the OT and NT. We are told those things, I believe, so that we will be prepared for what is to come. Again, we have the Holy Spirit to teach us, to guide us away from false interpretations to the real truths as we lift our hearts in prayers for His help
 
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You know what I find really amusing about " end times " interpretations ?

Not one time have I ever heard somebody say " well, keep in mind I could be wrong about what I am saying here "

....given the situation, it's guaranteed they are wrong, because, I'll say it again - only Jesus would know objective truths of the scriptures

I'm sure people can just tell Jesus when he comes back, that they don't need any answers about the Bible from him because they had it all figured out already

Of course, the Jews believe the messiah will teach them the hidden things of the scriptures

So we have 2 groups here- people who think they know it all already and are infallible ( just like God ) and those who acknowledge the limits of their ignorance and wait for messiah to show them

I wonder, what the reactions will be, from pastors, rabbis and end times fanatics who get their teachings shredded by messiah ?

I wonder if they'll be humbled, or embarrassed, etc ?

What will their congregations do when they learn they've been led by liars and conmen ?

Interesting times we live in
 
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LoricaLady

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Wow what an interesting set of phrases you have used:

"...people who think they know it all....end time fanatics...led by liars...."

Maybe those words gave enlightenment to someone, but....maybe not? Oh well, what does it matter? The Bible gives tons of info on the end times and that is what will be my guide and standard for wisdom, personally. :)
 
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Goodbook

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The best thing to do is read the Bible first, esp book of revelation.

Different people have different interpretations...but God can show YOU what it means to be prepared.

Sadly there are some end time cults floating around. Stay away from JWs is my advice.
 
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Matthew Twentyfour

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I hope no one wants to debate the topics in the vids. You are free to give your resources, too, but we are told to remember that this is not a debate forum.

Woah, not so fast huckleberry. People shouldn't post videos like this that would mock other people's theology and expect to get away with this by declaring this place a non-debate forum.

More importantly, let's review the errors in this video. The guy advocated a strong emphasis on "testing everything" throughout the video. Well, let's have a look at the verses he covered. Keep in mind the guy in the video is against a pre-tribulation rapture and is pro post-tribulation in his belief.

1) He used Matthew 24:29-31 extensively in the video and claims this is the rapture. Well let's have a look.

How can this be the rapture if the elects are gathered from heaven? I say again, how do you rapture someone already in heaven? How else did these people get there in the first place? This scripture refutes any possibility of a post-trib rapture. Check every translation, they all say HEAVEN in Matthew 24:31.

29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


2) He claimed Rev 20:4 is the resurrection of the church part of the rapture. How can this be the rapture if this resurrection ONLY involves those that did not take the mark of the beast nor worshipped the beast? This can only involve people that died during the tribulation, not outside the tribulation in the last 2000 years. This is not the resurrection part of the rapture. If it was, it would include everyone that died in Christ the last 2000 years.

Now here's a SERIOUS question to ponder. If you place the rapture at the end of the tribulation, that would mean TWO RESURRECTIONS AT THE SAME TIME: a resurrection of those that died during the tribulation (Rev 20:4) and the resurrection of those in the rapture (1 Thes 4:16). THIS IS COMPLETELY ILLOGICAL. And refutes any possibility of a post-trib rapture.

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

3) In John 17:15, the guy completely took the verse out of context and twist the meaning around in his favor implying this as the rapture verse.

15 I do not pray that You should take
them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=john+17:15&version=NKJV

Now if you read all of chapter 17, you'll see from verses 6-19, Jesus was praying only for His disciples, not the world. The them in verse 15 are His disciples. They lived 2000 years ago and already dead. How can this be the rapture?

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=john+17:6-26&version=NKJV

John 17:6-26 NKJV
Jesus Prays for His Disciples

6 “I have manifested Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, You gave them to Me, and they have kept Your word.7 Now they have known that all things which You have given Me are from You. 8 For I have given to them the words which You have given Me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came forth from You; and they have believed that You sent Me.

9 “I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. 10 And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them. 11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves. 14 I have given them Your word; and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 15 I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one. 16 They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 17 Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth. 18 As You sent Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. 19 And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they also may be sanctified by the truth.

Jesus Prays for All Believers
20 “I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe in Me through their word; 21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me. 22 And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one: 23 I in them, and You in Me; that they may be made perfect in one, and that the world may know that You have sent Me, and have loved them as You have loved Me.

24 “Father, I desire that they also whom You gave Me may be with Me where I am, that they may behold My glory which You have given Me; for You loved Me before the foundation of the world. 25 O righteous Father! The world has not known You, but I have known You; and these have known that You sent Me.26 And I have declared to them Your name, and will declare it, that the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them.”


4) He claimed there is only one Day of the Lord, and it happens at the end of the tribulation. Now he's correct there's a Day of the Lord at the end of the tribulation but it's not just one Day of the Lord because Christ's second coming involves two stages.

Notice in Luke 17:22, it said days. It's plural. There's an "S" at the end of days.
22 And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it.

The two witnesses in Malachi 4:4-5 comes on the day of the Lord. Here's another SERIOUS question. If the two witnesses comes on the day of the Lord at the end of the tribulation, that would mean they testify for 1260 days (Rev 11:3) after the tribulation. This is completely illogical too. And this absolutely proves another day of the Lord.

4 Remember ye the law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments.
5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord:

5) He tries to make Acts 3:21 look like a post-tribulation rapture by declaring that Christ must remain in heaven till all things are made new. Well his argument doesn't make sense. Christ returns to earth at the battle of Armageddon --- the darkest and worst time in the history of mankind.

Christ also comes in 2 stages. He never comes to earth in the 1st stage.

21 But Jesus must stay in heaven until God makes all things new, just as his holy prophets promised long ago.

6) He also mentioned Luke 17:30-35. I hear a lot of people with a post-tribulation view on the rapture claim that you can't survive unless you're prepared to enter the tribulation. Stock up on food, water, bomb shelter etc.

But I say read what God said in Luke 17:33.


30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.
31 In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.
32 Remember Lot's wife.

33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.
34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

7) He covered 1 Corinthians 15:51-52 as the rapture against Pre-trib. Well surprise, the 7th trump is at the middle of the tribulation, not the end. This also refutes a post-tribulation belief.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52
In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

8) He claimed no one knows the day or hour based on Matthew 24:36.....which is correct. But later he claimed that we do know the day. What?!?!?!

Matthew 24:36 ESV "But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only.

Here's another serious question to ponder. Matthew 24:36 is about the day and hour of the rapture, not the second coming.

Once the tribulation started, how can people not know they're in the tribulation with billions of people dying, huge natural disasters, the abomination of desolation, 100 pound hailstone dropping, etc.

Once the tribulation started, how is it possible that even Jesus Himself not know day and hour? Jesus returns to earth at 6PM Israel time, 1260 days + 1335 days from the day the antichrist confirms the covenant. Christ was crucified at 9AM, died at 3PM and resurrected 3 days later at 6PM.

Acts 1:11 KJV Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Daniel 12:12 KJV Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

Zechariah 14:7 KJV But it shall be one day which shall be known to the Lord, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light.

The rapture and the second coming cannot be on the same day if no man knows the day or hour because the second coming can easily known once you're in the tribulation.

9) 1st Resurrection vs 2nd Resurrection. He just doesn't know the difference between the two.

The 1st resurrection is the resurrection of those obedient in-Christ being resurrected to Jesus (in multiple stages) to be rewarded before the millennium. The 2nd resurrection is the resurrection of unbelievers and disobedient to be judge at the Great White Throne before God (single stage) after the millennium.

http://www.gotquestions.org/resurrection-first-second.html


10) In John 6, there are several verses that say "I will raise him up on the last day." This is also completely taken out of context and had it's true meaning twisted. Read everything, all of John chapter 6 is about communion, not a resurrection in the end times.

John 6:35 KJV And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

If you read all the chapters in the book of John beyond chapter 6 all the way to the last chapter, you won't find anything about the resurrection in the end times. The only place in John about a resurrection is in the previous chapter, John 5:28-29. This resurrection already happened when Christ resurrected the OT saints that were taken up into paradise.

John 5:28-29 KJV
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.


Matthew 27:50-53 KJV

50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.


The last day Jesus spoke of was His last day on earth when he died.

Do you guys see how the guy in the video took all the scriptures out of it's context? And he had the audacity to tell us to test everything while he himself twisted and turned everything upside down to fit his argument, and not what the bible tell us.





 
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Gentle Lamb

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If the rapture is a stumbling block, then forget about the rapture. My bible says in Matthew 24:31 "from one end of the world...". I know it sounds silly as a Christian to say "forget about the rapture", but in truth, it is yet another issue causing division among Christians. In truth, there is a large part of the body of Christ that is facing heavy persecution, losing their lives and being beheaded daily, and I don't even know much about this because it largely goes unreported in the media. The fact is, it's happening. In addition, things in the USA are likely to get very very ugly very very soon and the Body of Christ in this country will soon be facing the same heavy persecution. We need to be aware of these things and we need to be aware of current events & things that are slated soon to happen. Jesus commanded us to watch and pray, and we must be diligent in our vigilance. We HAVE to be informed about what is going on otherwise we are NOT doing our jobs as Christians. I don't want Jesus to be disappointed with me on the day I stand before Him and have Him ask why I did not do more research and reading in the vast amounts of free time He has given me of late. What an eternal shame that would be for me. Here are some things that as Christians & humans we need to be looking into: CERN, Project Blue Beam, the Shemitah, the upcoming forecasted economic collapse, blood moons, guillotines in America. That's just a short list of some incredibly important issues that are affecting us today whether we know it or not. Being unaware of these things was not helping me, and now that the Lord has opened my eyes as to what is going on in our world today I need to know more, so please, if anyone has any other sources they can recommend as to which direction to go in to continue research, pointers would be much appreciated.

Also, here is a list of some sources I've already read. I'm not saying that they have ALL of the truth, but they have at least a part of it, and when you pray for guidance, wisdom, and intelligence from the Lord God, He will help you to know fact from fiction.

David Wilkerson was a truly blessed man who walked in the spirit, this prophecy, given in 1973, has seen a great part of it already fulfilled (unfortunately).

http://informedchristians.com/index.php/Articles/list


http://signpostsofthetimes.blogspot.com/2012/05/cdc-warns-public-to-prepare-for-zombie.html

http://www.tribulation-now.org/2014/03/29/project-blue-beam-and-the-real-rapture/

educate-yourself.org/cn/projectbluebeam25jul05.shtml

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/sociopolitica/esp_sociopol_bluebeam04.htm

http://www.thewatcherfiles.com/bluebeam.html

http://injesuschrististand.blogspot.com/2015/06/a-reminder-to-united-states-of-america.html

(A Reading of the Above article)
 
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LoricaLady

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MATTHEW TWENTY FOUR - To be honest I only glanced over your post. I saw that your accused me of leaving a vid "mocking" those who believe in pre trib. I doubt if you watched the vid. It doesn't mock anyone. It is very sensitive to others' feelings and presents its point of view through Scripture after Scripture in a moderate, never ridiculing, way. You could have simply left your own vid with another point of view, but you turned your way long post into a debate and this forum Is not for that purpose. The OP expessed interest in the vids. Of course any string on the end time will bring some kinds of comments about pretrib or postrib, whatever. I was not the first one to bring up the topic here.

justneedhelp is free to do critical analysis and come to his own conclusions and seems quite capable of doing that!
 
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Matthew Twentyfour

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MATTHEW TWENTY FOUR - To be honest I only glanced over your post. I saw that your accused me of leaving a vid "mocking" those who believe in pre trib. I doubt if you watched the vid. It doesn't mock anyone. It is very sensitive to others' feelings and presents its point of view through Scripture after Scripture in a moderate, never ridiculing, way. You could have simply left your own vid with another point of view, but you turned your way long post into a debate and this forum Is not for that purpose. The OP expessed interest in the vids. Of course any string on the end time will bring some kinds of comments about pretrib or postrib, whatever. I was not the first one to bring up the topic here.

justneedhelp is free to do critical analysis and come to his own conclusions and seems quite capable of doing that!

Lori, I didn't accused you of mocking anyone, I said the video you linked mocked the belief of others.


Go to about 80% of the video around the 1:09 mark. The guy in the vid believes during the rapture, the wicked will be taken away while the righteous will be left behind. He sited the Parable of the Tare and the Wheat in Matthew 13:24-27, 40-43 for his claim. Do you actually believe this?

The Parable of the Tare and Wheat is not the rapture, it's the judgement when Christ comes to judge the world during Armageddon.

That vid has some serious issues, so much so that I decided to investigate Psalms 119 Ministries on google. I found about a half dozen sites with some very unkind words against them. Here's one of the sites and what they had to say.

http://www.gotquestions.org/119-Ministries.html

119 Ministries is a Hebrew Roots organization primarily operating through their website. The group’s name is a reference to Psalm 119, which speaks in depth about following God’s Law. 119 Ministries is extremely active on social media and the internet, with smartphone apps and an extensive library of online teachings. DVDs, books, and videos are available as tools to promote their theology.

119 Ministries is associated with the Hebrew Roots movement, which claims Jesus did not do away with many of the Old Testament restrictions on diet, ceremonial purity, and so forth. This is a view long rejected by the majority of Christian theologians. Most Hebrew Roots teachers accept generally correct views of salvation, sin, Christ, and the Bible. However, they often reject the Trinity, and the strained approach they’re forced to use on the New Testament presents some additional problems. The general, clear sense of Scripture is that Christ’s “fulfillment” of the Law meant the end of those minute legalisms.

119 Ministries would claim that supposedly clear statements in books such as Galatians have been misinterpreted. And yet, that conclusion only results from assuming what one is trying to prove. The catch phrase for 119 Ministries seems to be “test everything,” which underscores the group’s apologetics-flavored approach to promoting their beliefs. Yet, unless a person is pre-determined toward their conclusions, the Hebrew Roots-related information they provide doesn’t withstand scrutiny.

Another problem with 119 Ministries, as with many Hebrew Roots organizations, is the tendency to focus outrageous levels of time and attention on minutiae. For example, the exact day or lunar cycle of a particular festival. Or speculations about blood moons or whether a calendar day should start at sunrise or sunset. Legalistic gnat-straining like this (Titus 3:9) is exactly the kind of bureaucracy we were meant to be freed from. At the same time, that style of convenient legalism is comforting, since it makes our spirituality seem like a matter of obeying a list, rather than having a moment-to-moment, perpetual sense of obeying God’s will in our lives.

Ironically, despite the claim to uphold the entire Old Testament Law as binding on believers today, most Hebrew Roots interpretations allow for behaviors that Old Testament Jews would have considered blatantly in error, such as having a clean-shaven face or wearing clothes of mixed cloth. 119 Ministries is no different, as in one teaching they relegate explicit Torah commands not to cut one’s hair (Leviticus 19:27) as merely references to pagan practices. At the same time, they insist that foods like pork and shellfish are still “unclean,” despite overt statements such as Mark 7:19.

There are many things to test, question, and doubt within the teachings of 119 Ministries. Those involved in the Hebrew Roots movement are generally well-meaning, and their primary message regarding salvation is essentially true. However, their approach to Scripture is extremely prejudiced and can’t really be sustained, except in the minds of those who prefer to believe it to begin with.

Then I got curious about "Hebrew Root" and clicked the link. Here's what it said.

http://www.gotquestions.org/Hebrew-Roots.html

The premise of the Hebrew Roots movement is the belief that the Church has veered far from the true teachings and Hebrew concepts of the Bible. The movement maintains that Christianity has been indoctrinated with the culture and beliefs of Greek and Roman philosophy and that ultimately biblical Christianity, taught in churches today, has been corrupted with a pagan imitation of the New Testament gospels.

Those of the Hebrew Roots belief hold to the teaching that Christ's death on the cross did not end the Mosaic Covenant, but instead renewed it, expanded its message, and wrote it on the hearts of His true followers. They teach that the understanding of the New Testament can only come from a Hebrew perspective and that the teachings of the Apostle Paul are not understood clearly or taught correctly by Christian pastors today. Many affirm the existence of an original Hebrew-language New Testament and, in some cases, denigrate the existing New Testament text written in Greek. This becomes a subtle attack on the reliability of the text of our Bible. If the Greek text is unreliable and has been corrupted, as is charged by some, the Church no longer has a standard of truth.

Although there are many different and diverse Hebrew Roots assemblies with variations in their teachings, they all adhere to a common emphasis on recovering the "original" Jewishness of Christianity. Their assumption is that the Church has lost its Jewish roots and is unaware that Jesus and His disciples were Jews living in obedience to the Torah. For the most part, those involved advocate the need for every believer to walk a Torah-observant life. This means that the ordinances of the Mosaic Covenant must be a central focus in the lifestyle of believers today as it was with the Old Testament Jews of Israel. Keeping the Torah includes keeping the Sabbath on the seventh day of the week (Saturday), celebrating the Jewish feasts and festivals, keeping the dietary laws, avoiding the "paganism" of Christianity (Christmas, Easter, etc.), and learning to understand the Scriptures from a Hebrew mindset. They teach that Gentile Christians have been grafted into Israel, and this is one reason every born-again believer in Jesus the Messiah is to participate in these observances. It is expressed that doing this is not required out of legalistic bondage, but out of a heart of love and obedience. However, they teach that to live a life that pleases God, this Torah-observant walk must be part of that life.

The Hebrew Roots assemblies are often made up of a majority of Gentiles, including Gentile rabbis. Usually they prefer to be identified as "Messianic Christians." Many have come to the conclusion that God has "called" them to be Jewish and have accepted the theological position that the Torah (Old Testament law) is equally binding on Gentiles and Jews alike. They often wear articles of traditional Jewish clothing, practice Davidic dancing, and incorporate Hebrew names and phrases into their writing and conversations. Most reject the use of the name "Jesus" in favor of Yeshua or YHWH, claiming that these are the "true" names that God desires for Himself. In most cases, they elevate the Torah as the foundational teaching for the Church, which brings about the demotion of the New Testament, causing it to become secondary in importance and only to be understood in light of the Old Testament. The idea that the New Testament is faulty and relevant only in light of the Old Testament has also brought the doctrine of the Trinity under attack by many advocates of the Hebrew Roots beliefs.

As opposed to what the Hebrew Roots movement claims, the New Testament teachings of the Apostle Paul are perfectly clear and self-explanatory.Colossians 2:16,17says, "Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day – things which are a shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ."Romans 14:5states, "One person regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind." Scripture clearly indicates that these issues are a matter of personal choice. These verses and many others give clear evidence that the Mosaic Covenant laws and ordinances have ended. Continuing to teach that the Old Covenant is still in effect in spite of what the New Testament teaches, or twisting the New Testament to agree with the Hebrew Roots beliefs, is false teaching.

There are aspects of the Hebrew Roots teachings that certainly can be beneficial. Seeking to explore the Jewish culture and perspective, within which most of the Bible was written, opens and enriches our understanding of the Scriptures, adding insight and depth to many of the passages, parables and idioms. There is nothing wrong with Gentiles and Jews joining together in celebrating the feasts and enjoying a Messianic style of worship. Taking part in these events and learning the way in which the Jews understood the teachings of our Lord can be a tool, giving us greater effectiveness in reaching the unbelieving Jew with the gospel. It is good for Gentiles, in the body of the Messiah, to identify in our fellowship with Israel. However, to identify with Israel is different from identifying "as" Israel.

Gentile believers are not grafted into the Judaism of the Mosaic Covenant; they are grafted into the seed and faith of Abraham, which preceded the Law and Jewish customs. They are fellow citizens with the saints (Ephesians 2:19), but they are not Jews. Paul explains this clearly when he tells those who were circumcised (the Jews) "not to seek to be uncircumcised" and those who were uncircumcised (the Gentiles) "not to become circumcised" (1 Corinthians 7:18). There is no need for either group to feel they must become what they are not. Instead, God has made Jews and Gentiles into "one new man" in Christ Jesus (Ephesians 2:15). This "new man" is referring to the Church, the body of Christ, which is made up of neither Jew nor Gentile (Galatians 3:27-29). It's important for Jews and Gentiles to remain authentic in their own identity. In this way a clear picture of the unity of the body of Christ can be seen as Jews and Gentiles are united by one Lord, one faith, one baptism. If Gentiles are grafted into Israel, becoming Jews, the purpose and picture of both Jew and Gentile, coming together as one new man, is lost. God never intended Gentiles to become one in Israel, but one in Christ.

The influence of this movement is working its way into our churches and seminaries. It's dangerous in its implication that keeping the Old Covenant law is walking a "higher path" and is the only way to please God and receive His blessings. Nowhere in the Bible do we find Gentile believers being instructed to follow Levitical laws or Jewish customs; in fact, the opposite is taught.Romans 7:6says, "But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code." Christ, in keeping perfectly every ordinance of the Mosaic Law, completely fulfilled it. Just as making the final payment on a home fulfills that contract and ends one’s obligation to it, so also Christ has made the final payment and has fulfilled the law, bringing it to an end for us all.

It is God Himself who has created a world of people with different cultures, languages and traditions. God is glorified when we accept one another in love and come together in unity as "one" in Christ Jesus. It's important to understand that there is no superiority in being born Jewish or Gentile. We who are followers of Christ, comprised of many different cultures and lifestyles, are all of value and greatly loved because we've entered into the family of God.

Then I decided to check their website to see if any of claims against Psalms 119 Ministries were true?

http://119ministries.com/

In the middle of the page it said:

New to Hebrew Roots? Click Here to check out our Hebrew Roots Primer Page!

So I clicked the link and watched their video. I found out that Christ committed a sin. Not that I believed it but that's what their video said.

http://119ministries.com/new-to-119

Under the Media / Video Teachings, I also watched a few interesting videos.

The Error of Dispensationalism: http://119ministries.com/the-error-of-dispensationalism

The End of Days: Confirming the Covenant: http://119ministries.com/end-of-days-series-confirming-the-covenant

And after exploring their website, it didn't take me very long to realize everything said was true.

Lori, are you aware of all this about 119 Ministries and the Hebrew Roots Movement? If not, google Hebrew Roots Movement and see what everyone else are saying about them.

I'm not debating with you on this matter. I'm actually helping you, trying to give you sound advice. It's not real Christianity they're teaching. At least stay away from their videos. Plus I wasn't trying to hurt your feelings. I was pointing out the misleading information in that video.
 
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Matthew Twentyfour

Take up your cross daily, and follow Me. Luke 9:23
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Read and follow the bible. There are many false websites that claim to be teaching grace. This is one of the sign of the end times. Many different false movements and teachings, all claiming to teach grace.

Matthew 24:4-5 New Living Translation
Jesus told them, "Don't let anyone mislead you, for many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am the Messiah.' They will deceive many.
 
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LoricaLady

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Matthew 24:5 I suggest you watch the entire vid if you have not done so already. I don't think you are understanding what they are trying to say. One way or another, I don't believe in any Pretrib rapture. It is a Jesuit creation. The only way you can find it in the Bible is to read between the lines and then say reams of things, as in your posts above, that boil down to "This verse means....that verse means....and interpretation of these verses show...."

When 9-11 happened I searched the Bible for pretrib rapture. It wasn't there!

Now, again, this is not supposed to be a debate forum and I don't want to be breaking that rule myself. I believe we should both drop this before one or both of us gets reported for violating the rules here.

This is my last post to you as I can see you are determined to debate pretrib with all your might and keyboard. We will both do well to remember, though, that we are told sternly in Scriptures not to add or subtract anything from them.

Blessings and bye.
 
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riesie

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Just google endtimes or end times. Remember that as a Christian you won't be here.
Thanks so much for this resolute comment! I´m so afraid I will be still here by then. Thinking I´m not worthy and all.....
 
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