Do you think it's Christian to own guns?

[Aldebaran]

Just because you do not like my replies in that i do not compromise my views to appease you ,nor pander to your many rabbit holes inviting me to be led astray off the central point places you as judge over me now ?

If I don't like your replies, it's because your reply is simply to ask the same question repeatedly without even addressing what I just wrote to you. That's an indication that you don't think I have anything valid to say that's worth replying to, while your questions are the only thing that should be considered. And even then, even if I answer you, you continue asking the same question until you get the answer you want rather than what my answer is.

interesting ..perhaps you desire to shoot me ..

Now what's your point in making statements like this? Are you trying to be provocative? It does nothing to further the discussion.

 

[Aldebaran]

i get it .. you love your guns -it upsets you to be challenged on the motives behind your love for them .. get over it. if you remain chrsitian they wil soon be removed from you .

Actually, what gets me is that you can't have a rational discussion about the topic without making presumptions and judgements about people. I attempted to engage you in a discussion, but you continue with this type of behavior.

oh and don't tel me you don't love them until you have wrecked them and tossed them in a river ,then i'd believe you .

See, you say this because YOU don't own a gun and don't want me to either. If I didn't have a car and resented people who do (there are people like that), then I could say that you love your car and can't say otherwise until you get rid of it. If I were a homeless man who resented people who owned a house, I could tell those who do that they "love" their house and they should get rid of it and be like me without a home, or otherwise it's an idol to them and they're not living by God's will. But would that make it a valid statement? A poor man could also say to a rich person that they need to get rid of their money. But God gives to each person according to His will, and it's not up to us to judge others as a result.

I've heard it said that an idol is something that we think we can't live without. If we have such a thing, we should get rid of it. But should I get rid of my home because I don't think I could live without it? There are plenty of homeless people around who don't have homes, and they're surviving. So obviously, I could live without it. But I don't want to give up my home. But that still doesn't make my home an idol.

 

[Alithis]

Actually, what gets me is that you can't have a rational discussion about the topic without making presumptions and judgements about people. I attempted to engage you in a discussion, but you continue with this type of behavior.



See, you say this because YOU don't own a gun and don't want me to either. If I didn't have a car and resented people who do (there are people like that), then I could say that you love your car and can't say otherwise until you get rid of it. If I were a homeless man who resented people who owned a house, I could tell those who do that they "love" their house and they should get rid of it and be like me without a home, or otherwise it's an idol to them and they're not living by God's will. But would that make it a valid statement? A poor man could also say to a rich person that they need to get rid of their money. But God gives to each person according to His will, and it's not up to us to judge others as a result.

I've heard it said that an idol is something that we think we can't live without. If we have such a thing, we should get rid of it. But should I get rid of my home because I don't think I could live without it? There are plenty of homeless people around who don't have homes, and they're surviving. So obviously, I could live without it. But I don't want to give up my home. But that still doesn't make my home an idol.

A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument that was not advanced by that opponent.[1]

The so-called typical "attacking a straw man" argument creates the illusion of having completely refuted or defeated an opponent's proposition by covertly replacing it with a different proposition (i.e. "stand up a straw man") and then to refute or defeat that false argument ("knock down a straw man") instead of the original proposition.[2][3]


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i entered the thread and made a point that motive of the heart and trust in GOD is most important ... from this perspective all the side line issue being introduced are "proverbial straw man ".. so i simply don't engage them .
the fact is .people who really don't care about guns one way or another , have no love of them ,no dependence on them ..simply do not run to thier defense . we defend what we are passionate about what we love the most .i defend that the word of god says "we should trust in the lord with all our heart " .
other rush to defend the "worldly rights" .. we must judge our own hearts in the matter.

in example - you bought up love of a car .. but you'll find i didn't rush to fedn owning a car .. i really don't care one way or the other .also i don't have any intention of running over an intruder with it to kill him .so there is nothing about the motives of owning a car i need to defend .

 

[Aldebaran]

i entered the thread and made a point that motive of the heart and trust in GOD is most important ... from this perspective all the side line issue being introduced are "proverbial straw man ".. so i simply don't engage them .

I don't disagree with the bolded part.

the fact is .people who really don't care about guns one way or another , have no love of them ,no dependence on them ..simply do not run to thier defense . we defend what we are passionate about what we love the most .i defend that the word of god says "we should trust in the lord with all our heart " .
other rush to defend the "worldly rights" .. we must judge our own hearts in the matter.

I think this is where we have a misunderstanding. We can love and trust God as Christians, but it doesn't mean that we don't have interests in other things, or see a need for those other things, or see a need to defend those other things when they are being discussed in a way that implies that those things are somehow to be shunned. As Christians, we can have discussions about topics other than God, but it doesn't mean we love those things above God. Now, before you tell me to prove it by throwing all my guns in the river, you should also understand that God and everything else are not exclusive of one another.

in example - you bought up love of a car .. but you'll find i didn't rush to fedn owning a car .. i really don't care one way or the other .also i don't have any intention of running over an intruder with it to kill him .so there is nothing about the motives of owning a car i need to defend .

But realize this: People can have arguments against you for the fact that you own a car, and could say to you, "Get rid of that thing! It makes you lazy and it pollutes the earth! There are poor people who you could benefit by selling your car and giving them the money! You're selfish if you don't do that!" So then you'd have to rationalize why you should be able to keep it. Can you do that? Does doing so mean you don't love God because you decided your own convenience and desire to own a car is more important to you than helping the poor?

What I'm trying to do here show you your argument from a different perspective. It's not an attempt to sidetrack, or derail the discussion.

 

[Alithis]

I don't disagree with the bolded part.



I think this is where we have a misunderstanding. We can love and trust God as Christians, but it doesn't mean that we don't have interests in other things, or see a need for those other things, or see a need to defend those other things when they are being discussed in a way that implies that those things are somehow to be shunned. As Christians, we can have discussions about topics other than God, but it doesn't mean we love those things above God. Now, before you tell me to prove it by throwing all my guns in the river, you should also understand that God and everything else are not exclusive of one another.



But realize this: People can have arguments against you for the fact that you own a car, and could say to you, "Get rid of that thing! It makes you lazy and it pollutes the earth! There are poor people who you could benefit by selling your car and giving them the money! You're selfish if you don't do that!" So then you'd have to rationalize why you should be able to keep it. Can you do that? Does doing so mean you don't love God because you decided your own convenience and desire to own a car is more important to you than helping the poor?

What I'm trying to do here show you your argument from a different perspective. It's not an attempt to sidetrack, or derail the discussion.

But nahh- i dont have rationalize why i should keep it at all .. i need not reply to them at all ..if God told you to go buy a gun ..what is that to me ? your obeying him .
but i think iv met two peole now who have said they did what they did becaseu they inquired of the lord and th lord told them to do so .. but i think one of them was being dishonest becaseu after saying so.they then got extremely angry at me ..

 

[Aldebaran]

But nahh- i dont have rationalize why i should keep it at all .. i need not reply to them at all ..if God told you to go buy a gun ..what is that to me ? your obeying him .
but i think iv met two peole now who have said they did what they did becaseu they inquired of the lord and th lord told them to do so .. but i think one of them was being dishonest becaseu after saying so.they then got extremely angry at me ..

Well, do you think I need to rationalize ANYthing to you? Are YOU the ultimate judge of what is right or wrong? And your telling someone that they are dishonest about being told by God that they can buy a gun is certainly something a person might get upset with you about. I can understand that because it sounds like you were as presumptuous with him as you have been with me.

But now that I've answered the questions you insisted I answer, how about addressing at least one question I've asked you? We'll start with one, because I doubt you'll answer any more than that. I have little confidence in you answering even one, so it will save me some time....

Do you believe all things a person does wrong is caused by a demon that can be cast out? That seems to be your solution to every situation I've presented you with so far. I ask you this because I can read events that happened in the bible where many people did many bad things, and only a tiny minority of them were handled by casting out a demon in the name of Jesus.

 

[Alithis]

Well, do you think I need to rationalize ANYthing to you? Are YOU the ultimate judge of what is right or wrong? And your telling someone that they are dishonest about being told by God that they can buy a gun is certainly something a person might get upset with you about. I can understand that because it sounds like you were as presumptuous with him as you have been with me.

But now that I've answered the questions you insisted I answer, how about addressing at least one question I've asked you? We'll start with one, because I doubt you'll answer any more than that. I have little confidence in you answering even one, so it will save me some time....

Do you believe all things a person does wrong is caused by a demon that can be cast out? That seems to be your solution to every situation I've presented you with so far. I ask you this because I can read events that happened in the bible where many people did many bad things, and only a tiny minority of them were handled by casting out a demon in the name of Jesus.

i think .."you" felt the need to rationalize owning a gun ..so you began to and still are . no one asked you too.
so why did you do you think ?

 

[EinsteinsGirl]

Actually, what gets me is that you can't have a rational discussion about the topic without making presumptions and judgements about people. I attempted to engage you in a discussion, but you continue with this type of behavior.

See, you say this because YOU don't own a gun and don't want me to either. If I didn't have a car and resented people who do (there are people like that), then I could say that you love your car and can't say otherwise until you get rid of it. If I were a homeless man who resented people who owned a house, I could tell those who do that they "love" their house and they should get rid of it and be like me without a home, or otherwise it's an idol to them and they're not living by God's will. But would that make it a valid statement? A poor man could also say to a rich person that they need to get rid of their money. But God gives to each person according to His will, and it's not up to us to judge others as a result.

I've heard it said that an idol is something that we think we can't live without. If we have such a thing, we should get rid of it. But should I get rid of my home because I don't think I could live without it? There are plenty of homeless people around who don't have homes, and they're surviving. So obviously, I could live without it. But I don't want to give up my home. But that still doesn't make my home an idol.

Really good points, and yeah I've noticed the same as you -- so have others, which is why we don't bother discussing. It's not a discussion when all the opponent does is SHOOT harsh words. Meh. They'll never get it. No reasoning skills.

 

[EinsteinsGirl]

Well, do you think I need to rationalize ANYthing to you? Are YOU the ultimate judge of what is right or wrong? And your telling someone that they are dishonest about being told by God that they can buy a gun is certainly something a person might get upset with you about. I can understand that because it sounds like you were as presumptuous with him as you have been with me.

But now that I've answered the questions you insisted I answer, how about addressing at least one question I've asked you? We'll start with one, because I doubt you'll answer any more than that. I have little confidence in you answering even one, so it will save me some time....

Do you believe all things a person does wrong is caused by a demon that can be cast out? That seems to be your solution to every situation I've presented you with so far. I ask you this because I can read events that happened in the bible where many people did many bad things, and only a tiny minority of them were handled by casting out a demon in the name of Jesus.

Lol.
I just noticed your post (quoted above) was #666. That probably means you need to have a demon cast out

 

[Alithis]

mockery is a sign of the end times its what scoffers do .

since it is agreed that motive plays a large part in all we do ..it is therefore a matter of whose "will" we are desiring to do ..ours or Gods .

we pray .. "thy will be done " .. but if we then Go and do "my" will we display our prayer as a falsehood and a pretence .

 

[EinsteinsGirl]

Well you're right about one thing, I'm definitely scoffing at your opinions on the topic of guns and the religious bondage you want others to come under. God instructs me to not allow myself to be put in bondage to any person's religious rules.

So you can keep your bondage to the man made religious-rule you've fabricated regarding guns. I for one will not come under the religious rule you've invented.
Be right blessed!

 

[Aldebaran]

Lol.
I just noticed your post (quoted above) was #666. That probably means you need to have a demon cast out

Oh no!

 

[Aldebaran]

i think .."you" felt the need to rationalize owning a gun ..so you began to and still are . no one asked you too.
so why did you do you think ?

You still didn't answer my question. So again: Do you believe all things a person does wrong is caused by a demon that can be cast out? That seems to be your solution to every situation I've presented you with so far. I ask you this because I can read events that happened in the bible where many people did many bad things, and only a tiny minority of them were handled by casting out a demon in the name of Jesus, which is what you suggest I do if a person breaks into my house or attacks me.

 

[Alithis]

Well you're right about one thing, I'm definitely scoffing at your opinions on the topic of guns and the religious bondage you want others to come under. God instructs me to not allow myself to be put in bondage to any person's religious rules.

So you can keep your bondage to the man made religious-rule you've fabricated regarding guns. I for one will not come under the religious rule you've invented.
Be right blessed!

what an odd thing to say

i have not imposed any rules - but i did point out that we are to do GODS wil
not our own ..
is that the part your in rebellion to ?

 

[Alithis]

You still didn't answer my question. So again: Do you believe all things a person does wrong is caused by a demon that can be cast out? That seems to be your solution to every situation I've presented you with so far. I ask you this because I can read events that happened in the bible where many people did many bad things, and only a tiny minority of them were handled by casting out a demon in the name of Jesus, which is what you suggest I do if a person breaks into my house or attacks me.

start a thread on it -its a whole other topic

 

[Aldebaran]

start a thread on it -its a whole other topic

Don't use evasion tactics. It's something you yourself brought up. You said that if someone breaks into your home and tries to kill you, you would cast out his demon in the name of Jesus. So do you believe that a demon is always what's behind every evil act anyone commits? Yes or no.