Danie'ls 70th week from gracethrufaith.com

[iamlamad]

No one saw God the Father before Jesus ascended to heaven.

The OT saints were preserved alive in Abrahams Bosom.
JLB

Isa 6
6 In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple.
2 Above it stood the seraphims: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, and with twain he covered his feet, and with twain he did fly.
3 And one cried unto another, and said, Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord of hosts: the whole earth is full of his glory.
4 And the posts of the door moved at the voice of him that cried, and the house was filled with smoke.
5 Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts.


So WHO did Isaiah see?


Eze. 1


26 And above the firmament that was over their heads was the likeness of a throne, as the appearance of a sapphire stone: and upon the likeness of the throne was the likeness as the appearance of a man above upon it.
27 And I saw as the colour of amber, as the appearance of fire round about within it, from the appearance of his loins even upward, and from the appearance of his loins even downward, I saw as it were the appearance of fire, and it had brightness round about.
28 As the appearance of the bow that is in the cloud in the day of rain, so was the appearance of the brightness round about. This was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the Lord. And when I saw it, I fell upon my face, and I heard a voice of one that spake.


Who did Ezekiel see?


Exo 24


9 Then went up Moses, and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel:
10 And they saw the God of Israel: and there was under his feet as it were a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in his clearness.
11 And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw God, and did eat and drink.


Who did Moses and the others see?


REv 4


2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald.


Who did John see on the throne?

 

[Interplanner]

Yes, JLB, all those happened in the old covenant, which was 'weak and miserable' anyway. "In these last days, God has spoken by his Son, who is the exact representation of his being..." Heb 1 says. Heb 1-2 has already answered all these questions. The previous bits of revelation through direct visions and the old covenant are very much a thing of the past and inferior by comparison.

 

[JLB777]

Isa 6
6 In the year that king Uzziah died I saw also the Lord sitting upon a throne, high and lifted up, and his train filled the temple.
2 Above it stood the seraphims: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, and with twain he covered his feet, and with twain he did fly.
3 And one cried unto another, and said, Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord of hosts: the whole earth is full of his glory.
4 And the posts of the door moved at the voice of him that cried, and the house was filled with smoke.
5 Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the Lord of hosts.


So WHO did Isaiah see?


Eze. 1


26 And above the firmament that was over their heads was the likeness of a throne, as the appearance of a sapphire stone: and upon the likeness of the throne was the likeness as the appearance of a man above upon it.
27 And I saw as the colour of amber, as the appearance of fire round about within it, from the appearance of his loins even upward, and from the appearance of his loins even downward, I saw as it were the appearance of fire, and it had brightness round about.
28 As the appearance of the bow that is in the cloud in the day of rain, so was the appearance of the brightness round about. This was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the Lord. And when I saw it, I fell upon my face, and I heard a voice of one that spake.


Who did Ezekiel see?


Exo 24


9 Then went up Moses, and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel:
10 And they saw the God of Israel: and there was under his feet as it were a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in his clearness.
11 And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw God, and did eat and drink.


Who did Moses and the others see?


REv 4


2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald.


Who did John see on the throne?

As I said before, all the OT saints saw The Lord God Almighty, YHWH who is also called The Angel of The Lord, The Lord, or God.

He is Jesus, The Son of God. YHWH.


Revelation 4 is after Jesus ascended to heaven and took the OT saints out of Abraham's Bosom into heaven, John saw God the Father.


18 No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. John 1:18

And again -

13 No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven. John 3:13

And again -

46 Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father. John 6:46


JLB

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[iamlamad]

Yes, JLB, all those happened in the old covenant, which was 'weak and miserable' anyway. "In these last days, God has spoken by his Son, who is the exact representation of his being..." Heb 1 says. Heb 1-2 has already answered all these questions. The previous bits of revelation through direct visions and the old covenant are very much a thing of the past and inferior by comparison.

Ha Ha Ha! You must be joking.

Malachi 3:6 “For I am the Lord, I do not change; Therefore you are not consumed, O sons of Jacob.

Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever.

Did Paul see God? Jesus said He appeared to Paul. Did Stephen see God? Certainly He did. Did John see God? Certainly He did. Who did they see on the mount of transfiguration?

Lamad

 

[iamlamad]

As I said before, all the OT saints saw The Lord God Almighty, YHWH who is also called The Angel of The Lord, The Lord, or God.

He is Jesus, The Son of God. YHWH.


Revelation 4 is after Jesus ascended to heaven and took the OT saints out of Abraham's Bosom into heaven, John saw God the Father.


18 No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him. John 1:18

And again -

13 No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven. John 3:13

And again -

46 Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He who is from God; He has seen the Father. John 6:46


JLB

We almost agree. I think for Isaiah and Ezekiel, it was in vision form. I think they DID see the Almighty God in vision form. However, at that time, it very well could have been all three parts of God merged, they saw ALL of God.
I will agree, Abraham saw the preincarnate WORD, being the body part of God.

Today Jesus can be at the right hand of the Father, or He can walk into the Father and the two become one. After all, they are the body and soul of ONE GOD.

Now, how do you explain what Stephen saw? He had to see BOTH of them.
Do you think this is an eternal law, and WE will never get to see the Father?

So did John, for Jesus appeared suddenly as the Lamb having been slain. Did whoever was on the throne disappear? Hardly, for Jesus walked over and took the scroll out of the Father's hands.

Recently MANY people testify of being in heaven and seeing Jesus at the right hand of the Father, and seeing the FORM of the Father on the throne. They also testify He is far to bright to see. A 4 1/2 year old girl said there was like a rainbow on the throne and Jesus also had a rainbow, and when they came together, it was like fireworks.

Lamad

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[HannibalFlavius]

The two witnesses rise at what hour?
They rise at the same hour as a great earthquake.

What happens in the 6th seal?

The earthquake is the third woe - as in the 7th trumpet plague.

Rev. 7 should not be linked with the end of Rev. 6.
Rev. 7 starts a new vision - that will involve chapter 12.
How can we find John referring to the seven angels in Rev. 8 -unless John had seen them in a prior vision time?

Revelation 10:11 And he said to me, '' You must Prophecy AGAIN about many peoples, nations tongues, and Kings....Rev 11.......Then I was given a reed like a measuring Rod.


What just happened?

He is going back to Revelation 7.

He measured the Temple of God and it sealed them.

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[HannibalFlavius]

The seven angels seal the 144,000.

Four hold the winds, another ascends from the east, and one is speaking to John, what is the other doing as the one from the east comes shouting?

They seal.'


I don't get your point.

John is just counting people in the east.

 

[zeke37]

for years she's been building a timeline based on tenses of certain words.

 

[iamlamad]

for years she's been building a timeline based on tenses of certain words.

Wow! Is that even possible?

Lamad

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[vinsight4u]

/.

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[iamlamad]

John did not say that he saw an angel ascending from the east.
John tells us that he saw another - .

So more than one angel came from the east to seal the 144,000.

Study in Rev. the places where John introduces his subjects to the reader.
You could start with Rev. 12:1.
What did John see?
How about in verse 3?

Watch for where John sees another of the same action taking place.
How did he describe it?

Rev. 10:1 - another
Rev. 18:1 =another
Rev. 5 - a strong angel

Look where angels fly.
How did John word seeing the very first time that one did that?

Sorry, you cannot count angels where John DID NOT.

Four angels hold back the four winds while ANOTHER angel (another besides these 4 who are busy) comes from the east. John did not see where these four came from. If you are hinting they also came from the east, you are adding what John did not write. That is not wise.

The seven angels who sound the 7 trumpets may well be the same 7 angels of the 7 churches. But if they are, SO WHAT? What is more important, the sounding of a trumpet or the angel who sounds it?

WHERE exactly do you read that the angel who sealed went back and reported? This is a myth.

It is a myth that Ezek 9 says ANYTHING about the number sealed.

When John writes "another" angel, he is only telling us it is NOT an angel he has mentioned before.

Please don't keep us in suspense: tell us where you are going here.

Lamad

 

[Interplanner]

don't forget the OP has a faulty premise