Controlling

[Bristecom]

Well, I think you're reading your own bias into the scripture. The meaning of inappropriate contentea as it is used in the Matthean exception is a subject of debate, and sorry but your word doesn't pass as God's law.

LOL... why do you people keep saying it's my word? I quoted you from the original Greek manuscripts and the KJV verses. Since when is that "just my opinion?" Whatever.... Obviously people are getting offended by this because they want to excuse their sinful lifestyles so they desperately look for provisions. I'm sorry that Biblical teaching is offending people on a Christian forum. Although somehow I'm not surprised.

 

[blackribbon]

He did move eventually. And she stayed. She took the initiative on the divorce and getting majority claim on the property and children. She refused to follow him and that left him in a very confused state for a while.

I say "a man" would have done whatever it took to support his family....no "eventually". Did he move to the job or did he move out because she was divorcing him? Is it her fault for "not letting him" or his for not manning up?

 

[Bristecom]

No, the church and our Christian community completed deserted her and encouraged her to return to him. They never asked him what he did wrong or ask that he behave as a Christian husband should. They just assumed because he put on a good "front". I mean he came home every night and brought home his paycheck...what else should he be required to do?

And WOW! she is living in sin for choosing a life where she was not being sexually and physically abused? WOW again. Do you also believe that it was okay for that "Christian" family to have beaten their one son to death and put the other one in critical medical condition ... I mean, doesn't the Bible say "Children obey your parents?". Doesn't that mean that parents are right no matter what? Don't worry. She is safely divorced from this "godly" man. And believe it or not, God has blessed her for following Him.

Again, sounds like you have a problem with the Bible. Take it up with God. You do what many people who try to find fault with God's Word do, and you take examples to extremes or out of context. I've already sufficiently explained what we are to do from a Biblical perspective when family violence occurs. The Bible certainly does not condone it but it also does not say, "If there is any strife or violence in your family, then divorce and remarry."

 

[Bristecom]

I say "a man" would have done whatever it took to support his family....no "eventually". Did he move to the job or did he move out because she was divorcing him? Is it her fault for "not letting him" or his for not manning up?

I already explained that he had a plan that was best for the family but she very selfishly wanted to stay in Florida because she liked the weather more and refused to have the family move so made a plan to get a job herself and start getting with all the guys at work to find a replacement so she could stay there with her family. So sure, I'm not saying that he couldn't have done something but he is young and didn't know better and the legal system highly favors the women now so it seems like he had no chance. She is wrong. And she is an evil, lying harlot. Truly a Jezebel spirit if I've ever seen one.

 

[MarkSB]

If anyone is interested in the various translations of the Matthean exception, here is an excellent paper which discusses the topic:

http://digitalcommons.liberty.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1072&context=honors

 

[blackribbon]

Out of curiousity, which marriage is the one that is blessed by God.... for example which of King David's wives was the one he was obligated to keep...or was it all of them? Are they all sanctioned and godly because he actually had a marriage contract? And when did his relationship with Bathsheba become "okay" in God's eyes. (Do you see how your version of what is Biblical is clouded by your looking at it through today's standards and traditions?)

 

[blackribbon]

I already explained that he had a plan that was best for the family but she very selfishly wanted to stay in Florida because she liked the weather more and refused to have the family move so made a plan to get a job herself and start getting with all the guys at work to find a replacement so she could stay there with her family. So sure, I'm not saying that he couldn't have done something but he is young and didn't know better and the legal system highly favors the women now so it seems like he had no chance. She is wrong. And she is an evil, lying harlot. Truly a Jezebel spirit if I've ever seen one.

Again, I am clueless on why he didn't do the plan that he thought was best for his family? Why did she make the decisions for the family and he just meekly sat there and was "victimized"? How did she find a job and he didn't? They don't hire men in Florida?

 

[Bristecom]

Out of curiousity, which marriage is the one that is blessed by God.... for example which of King David's wives was the one he was obligated to keep...or was it all of them? Are they all sanctioned and godly because he actually had a marriage contract? And when did his relationship with Bathsheba become "okay" in God's eyes. (Do you see how your version of what is Biblical is clouded by your looking at it through today's standards and traditions?)

It sounds like you're just constantly trying to find fault with God.

"The Pharisees also came unto him (Jesus), tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder." - Matthew 19:3-6

It has always been God's intention that one man and one woman come and stay together but it is the fault of fallen man that this is not always the case and God never likes it - even if He doesn't always "curse" them for it.

 

[Bristecom]

Again, I am clueless on why he didn't do the plan that he thought was best for his family? Why did she make the decisions for the family and he just meekly sat there and was "victimized"? How did she find a job and he didn't? They don't hire men in Florida?

As I said before, they already had a paid off home up north, he had a nice Job opportunity up there, and all of their extended family were up there. But she refused so he didn't know what to do. So yeah, maybe he should have just taken the kids and left her down there or something but it sounds like she immediately got the law on her side so he probably didn't have that option anymore. I don't know all of the details but the point is, the wife decided to selfishly take charge and disobey her husband so that's what started all of this. And yeah, the most hilarious part is that she claims to be Christian.

 

[Jack of Spades]

Abuse just isn't physical though

Of course. But with physical violence, it's much easier to tell when it starts. That's why drawing a zero-tolerance line with it is possible. With emotional abuse, there is not as clear line, because it's so invisible.

Also, physical violence can kill a person instantly. There doesn't even need to be intention to kill, unlucky punch can do that. Any other form of abuse can't really end ones life so quickly. That's why I think physical violence shouldn't be tolerated at all if there is a chance to get out.

 

[redblue22]

They will know we are Christians by our . . . judgments and accusations?

 

[TheGirlOnFire]

Of course. But with physical violence, it's much easier to tell when it starts. That's why drawing a zero-tolerance line with it is possible. With emotional abuse, there is not as clear line, because it's so invisible.

Also, physical violence can kill a person instantly. There doesn't even need to be intention to kill, unlucky punch can do that. Any other form of abuse can't really end ones life so quickly. That's why I think physical violence shouldn't be tolerated at all if there is a chance to get out.

Actually research shows that violence is the last thing to come in a abusive relationship. So by the time that the partner uses violence they are all ready controlling many things

Finance - causing lack of money to leave, dependent on partner

Abuse - brainwashing , scream, threats ( like I will take the children if you leave, no one will believe you ), mocking, humiliating.

Friends and family - only allowed out with partner, cuts you off from friends and family, isolates you.


Also note that the most dangerous time for women is when they leave their partner, and afterwards. This is when a lot of the deaths takes places. Of course that is not exclusive and can happen anytime.

Note my abuse never was psychical, but a week before I left, he was going to "push" me down the stairs but my little one appeared and stopped him.. I was challenging his power.


Also it takes a women 7 times to leave a abusive partner. It is very hard and complex situation, we should never judge anyone in that situation.


They do say their is warning signs when dating someone, slightly warning signs that unless you were aware of them you would notice.

 

[Jack of Spades]

Also it takes a women 7 times to leave a abusive partner. It is very hard and complex situation, we should never judge anyone in that situation.

I get it, I didn't mean to sound insensitive. I was rather pointing my stuff for the people who are advicing (or rather, commanding) someone to stay in abusive relationship. Among other things that are wrong with it, it literally means putting the persons life in danger.

Also note that the most dangerous time for women is when they leave their partner, and afterwards. This is when a lot of the deaths takes places. Of course that is not exclusive and can happen anytime.

Yeah. But I think it's worth to note that if someone leaves and gets killed, most likely it would have happened anyways even if they stayed. It's a messed up situation, no doubt. And in any real life tragic situation, easy solutions are of short supply.

 

[TheGirlOnFire]

I get it, I didn't mean to sound insensitive. I was rather pointing my stuff for the people who are advicing (or rather, commanding) someone to stay in abusive relationship. Among other things that are wrong with it, it literally means putting the persons life in danger.





Yeah. But I think it's worth to note that if someone leaves and gets killed, most likely it would have happened anyways even if they stayed. It's a messed up situation, no doubt. And in any real life tragic situation, easy solutions are of short supply.

Not necessarily but all the partner wants to do is control and have power. Also the threat of violence is still violence, also when violence is involved they mostly mark the body that you can hide. Though the violence gets more worse and more frequently over a long period of time. To say solely that they would get murdered anyway so should take the chance is not that simple, fear can hold you fast. Plus not that abuse isn't everyday it goes in a cycle with underlying control at the same time.

So for example:

Partner explodes in abuse/volience control

Partner then say they are sorry/it's your fault/they doing it because you care

Partner then become nice and loving

Partner then starts to pick again, build up of tension

Partner then explodes

And so it on goes.

Of course this is for everyone, everyone situation is different and control is always on going even if people don't realise it or just don't say anything because they are in the "happy phase" also the gaps between the cycle can and usually does get shorter.

 

[TheGirlOnFire]

There is a great book on this

Why does he do that ? Lundy bancroft


Domestic violence expert who works as a therapist to abusive and controlling men. Il

 

[TheGirlOnFire]

https://www.goodreads.com/work/quot...inside-the-minds-of-angry-and-controlling-men

 

[Jack of Spades]

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[TheGirlOnFire]

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[TheGirlOnFire]

Violence is used in all sort of setting, the male on male violence is prolific in our society, which needs to be addressed and also male in female violence too - not in a relationship sense, many Women are murder and most huge media serial killers are men who kill women.

Since 92% of prisoners are males, you can see the treaded...


I think men should start tackling the issues of male on male violence...

Also the fact are if there was no domestic violence, then things like rape, sexual assault, harassment would be non insistence, because they are so interlinked.

I personally refuse now to take public transport due to the fact I seem too get harassment on them, I don't want to whistled at, or spoke too in disgusting terms, or men invading my personal space etc.

A other fact is, a number of men who follow women in the street, won't actual harm them but likes the feeling of fear they are putting them in again power and control... Have you ever been followed ?

 

[Jack of Spades]

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