Christ's return Delayed???

[Laureate]

You said that the Father was not going to reveal such information unto the son until we are in heaven, alot of good that will do us then.

 

[Laureate]

I didn't say that I knew.

I said that NO ONE knows but the Father.

That's what the verses say. So are you doubting God's Word on the subject?

Read the verses.


Mark 13:32
32 "But of that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone. 33 "Take heed, keep on the alert; for you do not know when the appointed time will come"

Matthew 24:36
"But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

The testimony of this verse is not what is being questioned here, I quoted it once my self, yet along with other pertinent verses;

I asked for two or three scriptural testimonies to subtantiate your understanding of what the Father spoke through Y'shua;

I didn't ask for two or three witnesses to establish the fact that Y'shua said what he said;

Y'shua himself said that he was one witness, and you presented to disciples quoting him, that's nice, now using scripture (like Y'shua said) establish your understanding using two or three other pertinent reliable scriptural testimonies;

What is being questioned here is your understanding of the verse, and your ability to dismiss other pertinent verses that gramatically (not interpretatively) touch, and bear an affect on the very issue;

I presented an array of pertinent verses, which you say are not pertinent, yet you offer only your opinion where I presented scripture;

When Y'shua was crucified he was not placed in the heart of the earth, he was placed in a tomb above ground, therefore the Sign of Jona does not pertain to his crucifiction and resurrection;

But read the passage again, for he speaks to that wicked & Adulterous generation saying, that the inhabitants of Nineveh, and the queen of Sheba will resurrect with that genereation and condemn it in the day of judgement;

You are not even aware that you suggested that the Sign of Jona has nothing to do with the Ninevites rising to condemn that wicked & adulterous generation in the day of judgement;

Read what was said one more time, because you act like I am dismissing what Elohym said, yet I acknowledge that verse and more, it is you who are not acknowledging all of what was said on the matter.

 

[ToBeLoved]

You said that the Father was not going to reveal such information unto the son until we are in heaven, alot of good that will do us then.

No. I said that ONLY the Father knows the day and time that Jesus will return.

 

[ToBeLoved]

The testimony of this verse is not what is being questioned here, I quoted it once my self, yet along with other pertinent verses;

I asked for two or three scriptural testimonies to subtantiate your understanding of what the Father spoke through Y'shua;

I didn't ask for two or three witnesses to establish the fact that Y'shua said what he said;

Y'shua himself said that he was one witness, and you presented to disciples quoting him, that's nice, now using scripture (like Y'shua said) establish your understanding using two or three other pertinent reliable scriptural testimonies;

What is being questioned here is your understanding of the verse, and your ability to dismiss other pertinent verses that gramatically (not interpretatively) touch, and bear an affect on the very issue;

I presented an array of pertinent verses, which you say are not pertinent, yet you offer only your opinion where I presented scripture;

When Y'shua was crucified he was not placed in the heart of the earth, he was placed in a tomb above ground, therefore the Sign of Jona does not pertain to his crucifiction and resurrection;

But read the passage again, for he speaks to that wicked & Adulterous generation saying, that the inhabitants of Nineveh, and the queen of Sheba will resurrect with that genereation and condemn it in the day of judgement;

You are not even aware that you suggested that the Sign of Jona has nothing to do with the Ninevites rising to condemn that wicked & adulterous generation in the day of judgement;

Read what was said one more time, because you act like I am dismissing what Elohym said, yet I acknowledge that verse and more, it is you who are not acknowledging all of what was said on the matter.

I do not know anything about a Sign of Jona or what the Queen of Sheba or the Ninivites have to do with this conversation.

Now I'm getting confused.

 

[ToBeLoved]

If we know the day and hour that Jesus will return why does He tell us to ALWAYS be ready?

 

[Laureate]

If we know the day and hour that Jesus will return why does He tell us to ALWAYS be ready?

I appologize for the flood of info, it is very intricate, and not easy to follow nor easy to present....personally, I am awed by the patience you have shown towards me thus far, and am humbled by it;

The topic pertains to Christ's Return, which Y'shua happens to touch upon in a few parables, and the sincere Milk that I am about to address pertains to a thief who comes in the night, because you brought up a very good point, and beautiful is it to see the Spirit speak through you;

"Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed are those who Watch, and keeps their garments, or inadvertently they walk naked, and another see their shame." [Revelations 16:15]

There are 24 hours in a day, and there are 8 three hour watches (3X8=24) in a day, 12 hours of light, and 12 hours of darkness, which means there are 4 three hour watches to keep in a night;

As it stands to reason, (individually) we can not watch for his return in all 4 watches in the night, without also going without sleep all night, nevertheless, we are instructed to keep Watch!

How then can one keep a Watch, and prevent a thief from breaking in and stealing his valuables, when (to a servant) the Watch is unknown?

Here in lies the dilemma (lit. two propositions), one either keeps Watch all night, or discovers what the unknown Watch in the night is, and keeps it, otherwise (in this scenario) there is no other way to keep a literal Watch to prevent a literal thief;

It would only be a gamble, and a shame to pick one of the 4 watches to keep, to inadvertently discover later that one has picked the wrong watch to keep;

Thus the 'Ye of little faith' (servants) are (first) supposed to acknowledge they do not know what Watch he shall return, then Ask-Pray, for "....the Sovereign Lord will not do any thing, until he reveals his secret unto his servants the prophets."

"Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and Ea'huah has not done it?

Surely the Sovereign Lord will not do any thing, until he reveals his secret unto his servants the prophets." [Amos 3:6-7]

This is how we know that the Master of the house will not do any thing without first notifying the Prophets;

Before the World was destroyed with a flood, He forewarned Noah, should we not expect the same before the Great and Dreadful day of Ea'huah?

For Behold, He said, I will send you Elijah....before the Great and Dreadful day;

Thus, before Y'shua began to preach, John was sent to let it be know that there was one among them whom they did not recognize;

As servants, we do not know which Watch in the night to keep, but as friends we do, for we have continued in His Word, and rely on it, and His Spirit (not a man) to guide us through it;

Many over look the importancy of these two crucial witnesses The Word of Elohym & The Spirit of Truth;

Is it because they are unaware that The Word of Elohym is dualistic due to it's inherent Parable nature, with the easy to digest Milk being paralelled with the difficult to digest Meat, and that only the Spirit of Truth can accurately guide us into The Truth of it? I often wonder.

That is why scriptures also refer to the Meat of The Word of Elohym also as 'Spirit' & 'Truth'.

The Meat is a Mystery that is only intended for a mature disciple to comprehend, thus the Parable format of the Scriptures is designed to keep the undisciplined eyes (and ears) of a Babe out;

"Watch therefore: for you know not what hour your Lord does come.

But know this, that IF the goodman of the house had known in what Watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

Therefore be you also ready: for in such an hour as you think not the Son of man comes.

Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord has made ruler over his household, to give them Meat in due season?

Blessed is that servant, whom his lord when he comes shall find so doing.

Honestly I say unto you, That he shall make him ruler over all his goods." [Matthew 24:42-47]

Notice how he says, "if the goodman of the house had known in what Watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up, therefore be you also ready:

IF a "goodman" (Divnely inspired person) did know what Watch the thief would come, he would Watch, and that Servant would be Blessed for keeping Watch when his lord returns.

Here is how we can see that the watch is not readily known, unto just any servant of the lord, yet a faithful and wise servant is expected to act like they do know, and if they do not keep that watch they will be caught off guard like the hypocrites;

Why? Because a faithful servant continues in the Word and relys on what he says, and they are thereby promoted above the mere status of a servant;

They are granted access unto the mysteries of the Kingdom, and they become friends of our lord, and Children of the Kingdom who are liberated from sin, and death;

"But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delays his coming;

And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;

The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looks not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of,

And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." [Matthew 24:48-51]

How can a servant say, my Master delays His coming, if he did not know what time frame to expect Him to come?

And why would the Master forewarn such a one, that He will come at an hour that he is not aware of, unless the servant somehow discovered the Watch and knew the time frame when to expect Him?

"This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:

That you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of Elohym the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of Elohym, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwells righteousness.

Wherefore, beloved, seeing that you look for such things, be diligent that you may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him has written unto you;

As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

You therefore, beloved, seeing you know these things before, beware lest you also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Y'shua H'Meshiyach To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen." [2nd Peter 3:1-18]

Peter says someone is being ignorant willingly, this only occurs when one has a truth, yet either disbelieves, or refuses to acknowledge, and rely on it.

Then Peter says, do not be ignorant, then paraphrases Psalms 90 which pertains to numbering our days, and the coming of the Lord;

 

[Laureate]

If we know the day and hour that Jesus will return why does He tell us to ALWAYS be ready?

"For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night.

But you brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

You are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.

Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.

But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation." [1st Theselonians 5:2, & 4-8]

"Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom." [Matthew 25:1]

While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.

And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom is coming; go you out to meet him.

Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.

And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.

But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go you rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.

And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.

Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.

But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.

Watch therefore, for you know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man comes." [Matthew 25:5-13]

Notice here how even the five foolish, and the five wise do not say unto the Watchman, 'But only the Father knows that day, and hour'.

Again, we are told to Watch, yet it would be unreasonable to do so, unless the same informs us when to keep Watch, and he does in this parable, for midnight is the beginning of the third watch;

Now considered the words of the Chief shepherd, and King....

"At midnight I will rise to give thanks unto you because of your righteous judgments.

I am a companion of all those who revere you, and of those who keep your precepts." [Psalms 119:62-63]

To read these words and not seek to join those who do these things, is to be one who does not hear, or comprehend these words, or they are those who simply do not believe; these words;

"Be watchful, and strengthen those who remain, who are ready to die: for I have not found your works perfect before Elohym.

Remember therefore how you have received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore you will not Watch, I will come on you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I shall come upon you.

You have a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.

Whosoever overcomes the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels." [Revelations 3:2-5]

"....and you will not know what hour I shall come upon you."

The word "...and..." 'n "...then..." are the same word in Hebrew, and this context fully supports either rendering;

Thus, it is only for failing to keep watch at the appointed time, that He Then comes at the appointed time to catch one off gaurd;

"I have set watchmen upon your walls, O Yerusalem, who shall never hold their peace day nor night: you who make זכר(zekar) mention of Ea'huah, keep not silence,

Behold, Ea'huah has proclaimed unto the end of the world, Say you to the daughter of Zion, Behold, your salvation comes; behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.

And they shall call them, The holy people, The redeemed of Ea'huah: and you will be called, Sought out, A city not forsaken." [Isaiah 62:6, & 11-12]

We are informed here that Ea'huah has placed Watchman to (specifically) inform us that our Salvation is Coming;

Also notice how this promise goes unto those who heed the Watchman whom He has placed into position, also note, that it is He that places us, not our selves;

Also remember, Y'shua said, that no one has seen the Father, then said they did see the Father, and when he said, you konw the way, his own disciple proclaimed that he did not, yet the the only difference between those who do, and those who do not in these cases is awareness and belief, as opposed to those who are not aware, or disbelieve;