Can I be Christian and Not Believe the Bible?

[Givemeareason]

Personally, when I hear such things I simply assume that they are just concerned with my eternal state, and usually try not to hold it against them as long as they are not obnoxious about it. Sometimes people really do mean "Praise the Lord" every time they speak the words. Sometimes I feel that there's a lot of "using the Lord's Name in vain" going on out there. I leave them to our Father. Most of them are my siblings. I can give my opinion to my siblings - and I can tell them what I believe our Father would/does/has say/said about a matter - but I am not in charge of them - that is our Father's job. He's a jealous God. I can and do argue with Him (I sort of call it 'discussion'). But I don't get to be or act like Him.

I once spent several miserable hours hunting on a cold rainy day just because the oldest brother in the family tried to take the place of his dead father and ordered his youngest brother, my friend, NOT to go hunting because it was cold and wet and raining. Hey, we ourselves had just decided the same thing, but then the 'order' came! And my friend turned to me and said (cleaned up a bit): Oh, crap, now we HAVE to go out in this ***.

And by your own words you have revealed you are not a Christian. You better keep hoping there is no God.

 

[justlookinla]

I cannot even obey his second one.

Yet you say you love Him?

 

[Givemeareason]

Good question. It has a number of applications.

Those who put themselves forth as being something special, shall find themselves in a position of humility. Those who wish to lead must serve. Those who lived first are the last to be judged, and the ones who lived last will be the first to be judged.

There are many ways that applies to life. Many years ago (about 35,) a computer genius was explaining to us novices about how computer memory was handled in the system he designed. "First In, First Out" and "Last In, First Out" were just a couple of the ways this is handled.

Not trying to confuse thing, but we need to look at the specific context of that passage of scripture to see what He was saying.

I hope that helps.

I don't remember the context but to me it said, He that would take the long path to heaven would arrive there sooner than the ones taking the short path. It can mean a great deal as you said. And from what I have seen here, if there is a Heaven many of those here will be arriving first. You guys have inspired me and I am touched very deeply. I can not imagine anything besides her faith that kept that woman going. And so I am convinced that Christianity is deeply needed in this world and though I have engaged in atheist negatives as well I feel shamed in having done so.

 

[Avid]

I don't remember the context but to me it said, He that would take the long path to heaven would arrive there sooner than the ones taking the short path. It can mean a great deal as you said. And from what I have seen here, if there is a Heaven many of those here will be arriving first. You guys have inspired me and I am touched very deeply. I can not imagine anything besides her faith that kept that woman going. And so I am convinced that Christianity is deeply needed in this world and though I have engaged in atheist negatives as well I feel shamed in having done so.

You do not need to apologize for honest questions. It is good you are taking honest answers.

The meaning of the passage you asked about is mostly handled in what I said about those who would be important, finding themselves humiliated. This is how all people are brought to understand who they are before the LORD God. His thoughts are far above our thoughts. We cannot understand them. He may give us some light in our hearts, and we may begin to understand things.

If you are serious in your search, there are some things you should understand. First, seek the LORD to tell you in your heart the truth you seek. In other words, Ask God if what I have said to you is true, and let Him impress an understanding upon your heart. If you are honest, and truly seeking Him, He will make Himself known to you in your heart.

 

[Givemeareason]

You do not need to apologize for honest questions. It is good you are taking honest answers.

The meaning of the passage you asked about is mostly handled in what I said about those who would be important, finding themselves humiliated. This is how all people are brought to understand who they are before the LORD God. His thoughts are far above our thoughts. We cannot understand them. He may give us some light in our hearts, and we may begin to understand things.

If you are serious in your search, there are some things you should understand. First, seek the LORD to tell you in your heart the truth you seek. In other words, Ask God if what I have said to you is true, and let Him impress an understanding upon your heart. If you are honest, and truly seeking Him, He will make Himself known to you in your heart.

No, I am not able to do that. I cannot trust myself in my judgment to be able to do that. If I did manage to do that, it would not last. I would relegate it to having been a delusional experience and having fooled myself. I know how I am and I cannot change that. If there is a personal god he would have to find me. This is not my unwillingness to humble myself. It is merely my rational mind. I am resigned to my end and feel no need to be saved. I will experience life until then.

 

[katerinah1947]

No, I am not able to do that. I cannot trust myself in my judgment to be able to do that. If I did manage to do that, it would not last. I would relegate it to having been a delusional experience and having fooled myself. I know how I am and I cannot change that. If there is a personal god he would have to find me. This is not my unwillingness to humble myself. It is merely my rational mind. I am resigned to my end and feel no need to be saved. I will experience life until then.

Hi,
There is a woman who is, but I will talk as though she is not. One day, in her long long journey to her, she no longer belived in God. She had the proof. About fifteen years later, God who has had numerous and sundry encounters with this woman, who is much like you in many ways, the way you are now, she gave God up her free will.
Years passed, one day she cannot do what she needs to do, in the next moment. She can't because her belief in what she is to do next, is just too great. She looks though at this strange piece of paper. She knows it should not be there. Eventually she bends down and picks it up. She opens it. She reads it.
OhMy. It was her written contract to God, giving up her free will to Him. Somehow, it had come out of the tucked away place in her wallet, and was now on the floor. She then was able to do what she was supposed to do, for God next, as her belief was increased.
I imagine, if this woman were to tell her story again, and how it relates to your statement of "No, I am not able to do that. I cannot trust myself in my judgement to be able to do that" it is this for her on trusting herself. I know of her. I have known her for awhile, now. She has amazing stories but is presently a hermit of sorts, preferring God to all else. I have access to her, but I don't know for how long.
She says that one day she read, even after knowing God is real, that all of us have thoughts that are rather bad. She says it says that in the Bible. One day before she had the proof of God, she hears a program on the radio. It is Protestant. In those days, while searching for God, she looked everywhere and the Protestants gave her a lot of information. She listened. She understood. She decided to do this. She knew she did not have to. And she told no one ever. She also knew there was precisely no reason to expect this would work, or would do anything, or result in anything. She knew it was free will. She chose to do it and tell no one.
The radio person said this. "Do this or do not do this. Write on a piece of paper, 'From today on, I do the Will of God everywhere always and in everything' " And for some reason she says, she wrote this on clean room paper. Clean room paper makes no particles. That will not be important later on, in fifteen years or so. What will be important is clean room paper does not decompose like regular paper. It lasts, and lasts and lasts.
She later says, because she cannot trust doing her own will as The Bible says she has bad thoughts from morning till night, she hoped God would take her will and somehow make her innocent by Him now owning her will and not her anymore. She knew that if she does her own will, then some of the time, it will be to act on one of those bad thoughts, some of the time. She then was trying to be perfect with God, in the Christian way.
She says that is the paper that she had forgotten about ever writing. That is the paper she found on the office floor. She was at work. She was doing her job. Yet, this other task was asked of her while she was still at work. Instantly she put it back deep into an almost hidden pocket in her wallet where she remembered she put it years and years ago. Then she did that thing, knowing or suspecting God had actually taken her up, on her written words.
You sound like her is some ways. You say you cannot trust yourself. However, I will now give you something from my life. It will be on believing in God, if God so chooses to do that to you.
I am gnostic theist. That was not always so. Also being gnostic is really reaally really rough at first, and then some. It took me to last year to stop all accusations, or for God really to stop all accusations about my sanity, or about my Christianity. I have known of God, by proof since the year 2000. I was 52 years old then. Yes, I am 67 right now.
(It was last year that the fourth or fifth or sixth mental health professional accidentally told me that I was sane. I work in a field that required me to submit to two full psychiatric exams. I was surprised by the first one. I was stunned by last years results. All of my mental health items, were brought about by accusations of people like embezzelers. To make sure I would submit myself to their accusations, mentally. Soon I found out that is merely a tool they use. I have paperwork last year to protect me from those types. The Ph.D. (a requirment) Psychologist made sure, I walke out of her office with that, as I was too vulnerable without it.
She made me accept my sanity. I was even beginning to doubt that. Within that sanity with no Patholgies what so ever, she is going to be the one to convince me of somethings. One is I a real mystic. She calls it a medical mystic. It means when someone is in trouble, somehow the answers are fed to me, to help them.)
So, one day I get to see God. One day I get to have Jesus, The Christ come into me, and revealing in visions with content, feelings with content, and words with content, what His core personality is all about. There is more, but this will do for now.
You are so right about not trusting yourself for lots of things. However, if and when God reveals Himself to you by any method including just feelings that He is Real or The Bible is Real or anything, accompanying that, will be other things to make you certain.
It is those other things, that every Christian is encouraging you to just read and relax, and let God do the rest, that will happen, if and when God wants it to happen to you.
Another way of saying this is, if and when God is your information source, you will know it, and for you, you will probably be given that logically.
God does say to test all things. You are already doing that. Read the Bible, in the Good News format. It is like the Bible for Dummies and I am one. Have also other Bibles like KJV, and I can't really recommend any to you, as the years are past me when I spent my life in there. I did that in the learning and testing phase. So, have what I call a tougher Bible, but also have a Good News Bible as that gets ideas across faster, but with only and occasional error from time to time. So, use both always.
As you read it, see what happens, but do it in private. Treat it as a prayer.
I am too tired right now. I will stop here.
LOVE,
...Mary., .... .

 

[Catherineanne]

Praying to/alongside dead people still creeps me out and as a fellow Anglican it disturbs me.I come from a strong Anglican family and never have I heard any of my family members consider such a thing.
I can see why praying to/with Mary would appeal to Christian women -especially mothers-but I still think it is wrong.

Reading how brothers and sisters disparage other people's conscientious Christian beliefs in public is what creeps me out.

Meanwhile, your disapproval notwithstanding, I will carry on following my Lord. His mother prayed alongside him on the way to Calvary, and on the cross, and she does the same for me. It is an honour to have her prayers join with ours.

 

[Catherineanne]

Do you keep His commandments?

Why don't you answer the question?

Is this really the way to address a young Christian who is new to the faith?

I really despair of people sometimes.

 

[Catherineanne]

And by your own words you have revealed ..... You better keep hoping there is no God.

I would advise you to amend that post; it is not appropriate on this forum to make such a statement of anyone else. I know many have come close to saying it of you, but they were wrong to do so.

I wish you well.

 

[Catherineanne]

Yet you say you love Him?

Do you think it is appropriate to question a young Christian in this way?

Do you want to drive him away from the faith before he has even begun? You do realise what the end result of that will be?

 

[Catherineanne]

Aw, Giveme - this is what those of us who have been around the block for a while have come to realize as "navel gazing". It's like you're a compass with no North Pole to point towards. Your needle can only swivel on it's axis, and it does swivel in any and all directions. It can only circle around and around - pointing nowhere and going nowhere. Some believe this condition to be enlightened reasoning. It is not. It is only blind ignorance. I can only pray that you are led out of it by the only true God - no compass is capable of using other compasses as a substitute North Pole - and that no one else follows you during your current time of blindness: and I only mean that in the kindness of ways, not as any harsh judgment of you.

Once again, is this the way to speak to someone who is very new indeed to our faith?

Really, think. This is like putting a tiny seedling into the full heat of the noonday sun. If anyone had done this to us in a similar situation few would have survived.

 

[Andrew1234]

Dear Jennae, I will reply by PM if they exist? or can tag you in a new post about music What instruments/ styles do you like? We can perhaps jam sometime on skype or whatever. I play all styles as it's my job, and also I love it. My instruments are mostly piano, violin, keyboards, and I give live performances. I can also play guitar which is a hobby, but I'm good enough to put some guitar into people's songs. I also made the 'mistake' of building a 2 room studio which took a year and lots of money. Now people can make music 24/7 without disturbing my neighbours

What instrument do you play? I never tire of reading music or playing. I'm pretty much addicted and driven to excel...sometimes drive myself too hard but it's my passion to succeed

 

[single eye]

I know my observations to be true when I can tie them to what I have experienced before. And if you become frustrated it is only because your expectations were too high. I have come to realize this is why my Baptism was so disappointing for me.

No, my expectations were NOT too high. I was not asking the right questions. E.g. the "why am I here question". When asking that question does not produce a satisfying answer, we can chose to give up and stop looking, or we can ask better questions that will produce that satisfying answer.

 

[Givemeareason]

Hi,
There is a woman who is, but I will talk as though she is not. One day, in her long long journey to her, she no longer belived in God. She had the proof. About fifteen years later, God who has had numerous and sundry encounters with this woman, who is much like you in many ways, the way you are now, she gave God up her free will.
Years passed, one day she cannot do what she needs to do, in the next moment. She can't because her belief in what she is to do next, is just too great. She looks though at this strange piece of paper. She knows it should not be there. Eventually she bends down and picks it up. She opens it. She reads it.
OhMy. It was her written contract to God, giving up her free will to Him. Somehow, it had come out of the tucked away place in her wallet, and was now on the floor. She then was able to do what she was supposed to do, for God next, as her belief was increased.
I imagine, if this woman were to tell her story again, and how it relates to your statement of "No, I am not able to do that. I cannot trust myself in my judgement to be able to do that" it is this for her on trusting herself. I know of her. I have known her for awhile, now. She has amazing stories but is presently a hermit of sorts, preferring God to all else. I have access to her, but I don't know for how long.
She says that one day she read, even after knowing God is real, that all of us have thoughts that are rather bad. She says it says that in the Bible. One day before she had the proof of God, she hears a program on the radio. It is Protestant. In those days, while searching for God, she looked everywhere and the Protestants gave her a lot of information. She listened. She understood. She decided to do this. She knew she did not have to. And she told no one ever. She also knew there was precisely no reason to expect this would work, or would do anything, or result in anything. She knew it was free will. She chose to do it and tell no one.
The radio person said this. "Do this or do not do this. Write on a piece of paper, 'From today on, I do the Will of God everywhere always and in everything' " And for some reason she says, she wrote this on clean room paper. Clean room paper makes no particles. That will not be important later on, in fifteen years or so. What will be important is clean room paper does not decompose like regular paper. It lasts, and lasts and lasts.
She later says, because she cannot trust doing her own will as The Bible says she has bad thoughts from morning till night, she hoped God would take her will and somehow make her innocent by Him now owning her will and not her anymore. She knew that if she does her own will, then some of the time, it will be to act on one of those bad thoughts, some of the time. She then was trying to be perfect with God, in the Christian way.
She says that is the paper that she had forgotten about ever writing. That is the paper she found on the office floor. She was at work. She was doing her job. Yet, this other task was asked of her while she was still at work. Instantly she put it back deep into an almost hidden pocket in her wallet where she remembered she put it years and years ago. Then she did that thing, knowing or suspecting God had actually taken her up, on her written words.
You sound like her is some ways. You say you cannot trust yourself. However, I will now give you something from my life. It will be on believing in God, if God so chooses to do that to you.
I am gnostic theist. That was not always so. Also being gnostic is really reaally really rough at first, and then some. It took me to last year to stop all accusations, or for God really to stop all accusations about my sanity, or about my Christianity. I have known of God, by proof since the year 2000. I was 52 years old then. Yes, I am 67 right now.
(It was last year that the fourth or fifth or sixth mental health professional accidentally told me that I was sane. I work in a field that required me to submit to two full psychiatric exams. I was surprised by the first one. I was stunned by last years results. All of my mental health items, were brought about by accusations of people like embezzelers. To make sure I would submit myself to their accusations, mentally. Soon I found out that is merely a tool they use. I have paperwork last year to protect me from those types. The Ph.D. (a requirment) Psychologist made sure, I walke out of her office with that, as I was too vulnerable without it.
She made me accept my sanity. I was even beginning to doubt that. Within that sanity with no Patholgies what so ever, she is going to be the one to convince me of somethings. One is I a real mystic. She calls it a medical mystic. It means when someone is in trouble, somehow the answers are fed to me, to help them.)
So, one day I get to see God. One day I get to have Jesus, The Christ come into me, and revealing in visions with content, feelings with content, and words with content, what His core personality is all about. There is more, but this will do for now.
You are so right about not trusting yourself for lots of things. However, if and when God reveals Himself to you by any method including just feelings that He is Real or The Bible is Real or anything, accompanying that, will be other things to make you certain.
It is those other things, that every Christian is encouraging you to just read and relax, and let God do the rest, that will happen, if and when God wants it to happen to you.
Another way of saying this is, if and when God is your information source, you will know it, and for you, you will probably be given that logically.
God does say to test all things. You are already doing that. Read the Bible, in the Good News format. It is like the Bible for Dummies and I am one. Have also other Bibles like KJV, and I can't really recommend any to you, as the years are past me when I spent my life in there. I did that in the learning and testing phase. So, have what I call a tougher Bible, but also have a Good News Bible as that gets ideas across faster, but with only and occasional error from time to time. So, use both always.
As you read it, see what happens, but do it in private. Treat it as a prayer.
I am too tired right now. I will stop here.
LOVE,
...Mary., .... .

Mary,
You are truly profound... at least to me. Not all and I would guess very few experience what you have. I cannot see this in most people, Christians or otherwise. I do not understand why you only identify with the Bible. And I can clearly see you are not deluded and I cannot understand why anyone would question your sanity. Only a sociopath would do that. You are evidently in the business of exposing the truth. Are you saying that Christianity is not about being saved?

 

[Givemeareason]

Is this really the way to address a young Christian who is new to the faith?

I really despair of people sometimes.

I am not a Christian and I have already seen she was testing me.

 

[Givemeareason]

I would advise you to amend that post; it is not appropriate on this forum to make such a statement of anyone else. I know many have come close to saying it of you, but they were wrong to do so.

I wish you well.

I would agree except that I have come to know that person. It is my feeling that he needs to experience rebuke in order to grow. Empathy for others can only come from experiencing what others experience.

 

[Givemeareason]

Do you think it is appropriate to question a young Christian in this way?

Do you want to drive him away from the faith before he has even begun? You do realise what the end result of that will be?

I cannot be driven away. I can only lose interest. But such things as what you just said should often be said.

 

[Givemeareason]

Do Christians sometimes wonder if we collectively are God?

 

[Colter]

Do Christians sometimes wonder if we collectively are God?

Not God absolute, but we are already children of God LITERALLY! potentially divine, .....and, as we do Gods will we are contributing to the emerging Supreme Being in time and space.

 

[com7fy8]

Hi, Give Me A Reason Jesus used the early scriptures. We can see this, in Mark 12:28-34, for one example.

Here we see that someone asked Jesus which commandment is the greatest. He said to love God with all we've got, but there is the Second Love Commandment, also, to love our neighbor as ourselves. So, He was not stingy, limiting Himself to the question, but added more.

Then the one asking Him improved on His answer, I see, and Jesus was pleased with this; He did not cut a snotty attitude and say, who are you to teach Me or add to what I said?

So, Jesus is not conceited, though He is God's own Son. He is pleased to communicate personally and to share.