once saved always saved?

Jake76 said:

Are you saying that not even you can choose to jump out of his hands?

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Correct.

Jake76 said:

Are you in support of once saved always saved?

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Yes.

"All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day." ~ John 6:37-39

Christus Discipulus said:

"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. I and the Father are one.” ~ John 10:27-30

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When I was about 5 or 6 years old, my mother had me pray with her the Born Again prayer and since then I've felt God's persence even when I became lost. I had the same question you did in my teens and a pastor told me that I didn't need to keep coming to the front to be saved.

1 Peter 3:18

As for the above quote, it's true in my experience. I had wandered away too far and he beckoned me to come back, and I did.

As with some other issues, I can't say that I have made up my mind one way or the other. Although I follow God whole-heartedly, I am agnostic on some theological issues. By this I mean that I don't see enough evidence one way or the other or that there is too much evidence on both sides of the issue to make up my mind. I would rather just say that I don't know. I don't think any person can have every point of doctrine theologically correct. Some things are just so beyond our experience, reasoning abilities and/or evidence.

So for this issue, I have no idea if we can lose our salvation or not. A good case is made both ways I think. I am just going to throw myself on God's mercy and trust in God's character.

Greetings,

What does 1 Cor. 9:27 teach?

Regards

JimmyK

I know that this subject goes much deeper than this, but regardless of the answer, people seem to come to the same conclusion.

If "once saved always saved", then if anyone falls into habitual sin, then they were never saved in the first place (ie, a so-called "false conversion"), and so, they don't have salvation.

If Christians can lose their salvation, then if anyone falls into habitual sin, then they have lost their salvation, and so, they don't have salvation.

Luke 15 tells us the parable of the shepherd who runs after the one sheep that wandered away and became lost, because its return is more important than the 99 who remain faithful. Jesus does NOT say that the shepherd chuckles and tells the rest of the flock, "Don't worry, that silly one will soon return to me on its own", NOR does Jesus say that the shepherd merely whistles at the end of the day, and all the lost sheep will automatically come running back to him, safe and sound.

As for me, I do not want to follow a shepherd with a cavalier attitude, and I think that we should not have a cavalier attitude of ourselves. Jesus calls us sheep because, after all, we remain stupid sheep that can wander away from his flock and get lost. We do not become different animals once we join his flock ... and I've never heard of a smart sheep.

Dear Brother,
For your question "once saved always saved?"Let me have some fellowship about this.
“be saved,” everyone wishes to be saved by believing in God. we have regarded “being saved” as a simple thing.
Then what is it to “be saved”? What does it mean to be truly “saved”?
As we all know, before Jehovah God had Moses bring the Israelites out of Egypt, they all lived as slaves under the hand of
Pharaoh. They suffered hardships and lived a life without freedom, so much so that their bitter cry reached Jehovah’s ears.
Jehovah God did not have the heart to let them continue to be bound and mistreated by Pharaoh, so he called Moses to bring
them out of Egypt into the good land of Canaan. When the Israelites were delivered by God out of the hand of Pharaoh and
freed from his tyranny, it meant that they were “saved.” But it did not mean that they did not need Jehovah’s further salvation.
Before they entered into Canaan, Jehovah God issued the law through Moses to let them know how they should fear Jehovah
God, how they should serve Jehovah God, what was the righteous behavior he blessed, what was the evil behavior he cursed, how they should get along with each other, how they should live their life, and so on. The work God did in the Age of the Law had gradually enabled them to live normally and no longer live in a chaotic state. God’s law in particular let them
know what sin was. To the Israelites, they were “saved” once again.
By the end of the Age of the Law, people could no longer keep the law. They lost their fear of God and even offered blind and crippled animals as sacrifices on the altar of Jehovah. If they continued like that, they would all be in danger of being condemned and put to death by the law. To save them from the threat of death, God was incarnated on earth and did a new work, the redemptive work, so that they came out of the law, no longer being condemned and put to death by the law, and lived in the grace of God. To these people under the law, they were “saved” once again. As the Scripture says: “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus” (Romans 8:1); “That if you confess with your mouth, ‘Jesus is Lord,’ and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved” (Romans 10:9). Here the words “no condemnation” mean “no condemnation by the law.” The words “confess with your mouth … and believe in your heart…, you will be saved” mean that after we believe in Jesus and accept his salvation of the cross, we will not be put to death by the law for failing to keep it. That is to say, because we believe in Jesus, we will not be condemned and God will not remember our
transgressions, and this means that we are saved. But we should know that though we have been forgiven of our sins, it does not prove that we have no sin. Since all believers still live in the condition of repeatedly committing sins in the day and confessing them at night and no one can be delivered from it, this shows that we have not been completely “saved.” That is to say, through Jesus’ precious blood, we have only been forgiven of our sins, yet because our sinful nature has not been removed by the Lord’s salvation, we have not become truly holy. As the Scripture says: “…without holiness no one will see the Lord”
(Hebrews 12:14); “who through faith are shielded by God’s power until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time” (1 Peter 1:5); and “so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation
to those who are waiting for him” (Hebrews 9:28). From these verses we see that without holiness no one will see the Lord, and that we who through faith are shielded by God’s power still need to accept the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.
Actually, both the biblical prophecies and our actual condition have proved that we have not been completely “saved.” So we must accept “the salvation revealed in the end time” to be completely purified.

yes once saved always saved, when we come to Christ we are a new creation the old has passed the new has come,

“Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭5:17‬ ‭ESV‬‬

We can't undo ourselves and go back to the old man who has passed away, anyone who does backslide either was not saved to start with, or the one who is truly in the faith will be disciplined by God and bought back to repentance.

There is the case of apostasy,

“For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt. For land that has drunk the rain that often falls on it, and produces a crop useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from God. But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed, and its end is to be burned.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭6:4-8‬ ‭ESV‬‬

But even those who commit apostasy where not saved to start with these are like the parable of the sower.

My belief is that if a person is truly saved, then the Lord will not allow them to wander totally off. He will use chastisement to bring them back in line just as an earthly father does.

Matthew 7:22-23

I'm also reminded of the parable where the master goes off to a distant land, and will return when least expected. Lucky is the servant who is doing what he should be when the master comes, however, the unfaithful servant will be severely beaten.


I think it is important to be faithful until the end.

If you are to say 'well I'm saved so I can do whatever I want, grace covers all my sin' etc.. I fear you are not saved.

I would tell once chosen always saved but only God knows who are the chosen and we don't, cause only Jesus is the shepherded who recognize the sheep which God gave him and only God foreknew them.
So also if some of us believe to be chosen and they follow the commandments without sinning, then they can feel in harmony with the feeling of to be saved, but Paul said to not feel like to be safe cause in that same moment you could fall. Saints have a huge perseverance and faith, they don't truly have time to think to be saved or not saved, they just do what God says to do.

1 Corinthians 10:1-12
1 Moreover, brethren, I would not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers were under the cloud, and all passed through the sea;
2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat;
4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
5 But with many of them God was not well pleased: for they were overthrown in the wilderness.
6 Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.
7 Neither be ye idolaters, as were some of them; as it is written, The people sat down to eat and drink, and rose up to play.
8 Neither let us commit fornication, as some of them committed, and fell in one day three and twenty thousand.
9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
10 Neither murmur ye, as some of them also murmured, and were destroyed of the destroyer.
11 Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.
12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

ETERNAL Life, not PROBATIONARY Life.

Once saved always saved.
What I've learned is this... If you are saved (proven by a regeneration) then you will always be saved because the HS will provide all to enable you to maintain salvation.

If you've been saved, you've been saved... You cannot escape Jesus. You may stumble, but you will not fall. The question that begs answering is: were you actually saved?

If you 'lose' it, you never had it to begin with.

My belief.

Hi Jake, St. Paul said, "I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus." ~Phil 1:6

And Heb 7:25 tells us that "Jesus is able to save forever those who draw near to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them."

Martin Luther called the Lord the, "Hound of Heaven", for a very good reason, because He keeps coming after us and will not lose us (John 6:39 ). He loves His children so much that He chose to die for us rather than live without us. Surely He will see us through to Glory, just like He promised us He would (Romans 8:28-30).

So it's clear that God will see that true Christians persevere in their faith. The question that needs to be answered by those of us who claim to be Christians is this, did we ever really become Christians to begin with? (which has already been mentioned in this thread). Do we "know" Him (John 17:3) .. and does He "know" us? (Matthew 7:23) It is, in fact, a command for us to make certain that we are in Christ .. see 2 Corinthians 13:5.

So the final question is, "how do we know if we are truly saved or not"?

Yours and His,
David