It is still NOT okay to eat pork.

[Going Merry]

I will provide bible verses, but I would first like to see people's reaction to this and their biblical knowledge of the matter.

"To the pure all things are pure."
So in this I disagree.
I believe the Lord blotted out filthiness, but if in your own heart you believe it is wrong then refrain from pork your self. Don't defile your conscience over food.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by tzadik
4 quick ways you are wrong.

Truth:
1. Messiah IS the Word of God
2. God's Word/Law is perfect.
3. God's Word IS God.
4. God said that His Word is not difficult.

They say that the most deceptive untruths are the ones that are mostly truth. And, here we go with one subtle "/", you seem to elevate the law to the status of deity. With that one notable exception, everything you say is accurate, but the law is not God, and when you say it is, you are violating one of its core precepts: "you shall not worship idols."

Idol worshipping......repent!

http://www.christianforums.com/t7587833/
Did the Jews worship idols?

Exodus 20:4 Not thou shall make unto thyself an idol/eidwlon #1497, any representation which in heavens from above, and which in land from beneath, and which in waters from beneath to land.

1 John 5:21 Little children, keep yeselves from the idols/eidwlwn <1497>! Amen.

Reve 9:20 and the rests of the men who not were killed in these blows not repent out of the works of the hands of them, that no they should be worshipping the demons and the idols/eidwla <1497> of the gold and the silver and the brass/copper and the stone and the wood,
which neither to be seeing are able, nor to be hearing nor to be walking
[Exodus 20:4/1 John 5:21]

 

[tzadik]

They say that the most deceptive untruths are the ones that are mostly truth. And, here we go with one subtle "/", you seem to elevate the law to the status of deity. With that one notable exception, everything you say is accurate, but the law is not God, and when you say it is, you are violating one of its core precepts: "you shall not worship idols."

So you don't believe that God's Law is His Word?

 

[JimB]

So you don't believe that God's Law is His Word?

I believe scripture teaches that the Law was a Covenant between God and the nation of Israel. ~Jim




`

 

[tzadik]

I believe scripture teaches that the Law was a Covenant between God and the nation of Israel. ~Jim




`

Oh brother. Not the Law/Covenant substitution again.
The Law of God is NOT the Agreement between God and Israel.
It's PART of the agreement.

 

[Frogster]

So you don't believe that God's Law is His Word?

an expired past part..the tutor is gone now, gal 3...we are not children, we are mature sons, read gal 4.


do u believe God's word? the law aroused sin, read rom 7;5.

try to understand salvation history.

 

[Frogster]

Oh brother. Not the Law/Covenant substitution again.
The Law of God is NOT the Agreement between God and Israel.
It's PART of the agreement.

lol..take away the law, and the temple, then whatcha got?

Psalm 147:19 He declares his word to Jacob,his statutes and rules to Israel.20 He has not dealt thus with any other nation;
they do not know his rules. Praise the LORD!

 

[tzadik]

an expired past part..the tutor is gone now, gal 3...we are not children, we are mature sons, read gal 4.


do u believe God's word? the law aroused sin, read rom 7;5.

try to understand salvation history.

You can continue to strive to live by half of God's Word.
And I'll continue to strive to live according to ALL of God's Word.

You believe His Word expires.
I don't.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

You can continue to strive to live by half of God's Word.
And I'll continue to strive to live according to ALL of God's Word.

You believe His Word expires.
I don't.

Who implied His Word expires?

Hebrew 12:18 For not ye have come toward to being handled a mountain, and to having been kindled to fire and to murkiness and to darkness and to tempest.
19 and of a trumpet blaring and to sound of declarations, of which the ones hearing refused no to be added to them a Word.
&#12288;
Reve 8:8 And the second Messenger trumpets and as-like a mountain, great to fire burning, was cast into the Sea and became the third of the Sea blood
[Matthew 21:21/Galatian 4:24, 25/Hebrew 12:18]

 

[tzadik]

Who implied His Word expires?

an expired past part..the tutor is gone now, gal 3...we are not children, we are mature sons, read gal 4.

He did. Actually anyone who believes that the Law of God has expired...

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

He did. Actually anyone who believes that the Law of God has expired...

Originally Posted by Frogster an expired past part..the tutor is gone now, gal 3...we are not children, we are mature sons, read gal 4.

I would say Frogster explained it quite well on this other thread...but then again, maybe not

http://www.christianforums.com/t7576552/
Jesus vs Paul, law abolishment. A simple answer, from a frog.

The abolishment question is easily answered. The Jesus vs Paul argument.

Jesus: Matt 5:17 &#8220;Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

The law will always stand for the unsaved. Paul still used it in Romans to condemn all. Not for the justified, but for the unsaved, 1 Tim 1, same list of creatures found in Rom 1.

So, the question is where, and for whom is it abolished?

Paul: Eph 2:15 by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,

Where is it ended, Rom 10:4?

Simple, the cross, for the Christians, where they died to law, to be raised up out of sin, law and flesh. Law ended on the cross, in his body, for the Christian, not for the unsaved, where it will always stand, the way Paul used it in Romans, to kill.

Look where it was abolished. His body, the cross.

Eph 2:14 For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility
Eph 2:16 16 and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility.


"Brothers", he was talking to saved people, not unsaved. The Christians died to law, the body...

Rom 7:4 Likewise, my brothers, you also have died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you may belong to another, to him who has been raised from the dead, in order that we may bear fruit for God.


More..died to law, the cross, that would be the same as the body.


Gal 2:19 For through the law I died to the law, so that I might live to God. 20 I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.


More, the cross...

Col 2:14 by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross.

There we go, abolished for the Christian, no longer under law, but under grace, where sin, law, and flesh, have no dominion, Rom 5:21. Sin does however, have dominion under law, Rom 6:14, because the law is in accordance with the flesh. Sin lived in the Adamic creation, which was brought to full fruition, under law, aroused by law, Rom 7:5, 7:13, but then it was crucified with Christ, Rom 6:6. Then we are raised up like Christ, in a new creation, as Christ is. Christ also died to law, that which he was born under, Gal 4:4.

Tadaaaaaa

 

[Frogster]

He did. Actually anyone who believes that the Law of God has expired...

by the way, peter antedated the law experience in a historical manner, as far as law life was concerned.

he went way back....in time..experientially...all way before the council meeting..huh?


acts 15;10 Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?

 

[Frogster]

I would say Frogster explained it quite well on this other thread...but then again, maybe not

http://www.christianforums.com/t7576552/
Jesus vs Paul, law abolishment. A simple answer, from a frog.

maybe not?!

u r going to catch a whoopins!

 

[tzadik]

by the way, peter antedated the law experience in a historical manner, as far as law life was concerned.

he went way back....in time..experientially...all way before the council meeting..huh?


acts 15;10 Now, therefore, why are you putting God to the test by placing a yoke on the neck of the disciples that neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear?

rehash. rehash. rehash.
To call God's Law a burden that no one could bear is to call God a liar in Deuteronomy 30:11-14.
Next.

 

[Frogster]

rehash. rehash. rehash.
To call God's Law a burden that no one could bear is to call God a liar in Deuteronomy 30:11-14.
Next.

isn't that a vivid description peter gave? The poor fathers were under a yoke, they could not bear it..really kinda sad....


amazing...

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

rehash. rehash. rehash.
To call God's Law a burden that no one could bear is to call God a liar in Deuteronomy 30:11-14.
Next.

If it wasn't a burden, then why are the Jews missing their Temple and Sanctuary today?

 

[tzadik]

I would say Frogster explained it quite well on this other thread...but then again, maybe not

http://www.christianforums.com/t7576552/
Jesus vs Paul, law abolishment. A simple answer, from a frog.

The simple fact that he is limiting God's Holy Law as applicable ONLY to the wicked and unsaved...is grounds enough for my disagreement.

The Law of God is 100% NOT only for unbelievers.
In fact the things of God are foolishness to the wicked.

 

[Ishraqiyun]

Christians aren't bound by an earthly external observance of the dietary laws. All things are clean to us. Christians are instead to find the true esoteric meaning behind the earthly symbols used in the law. Physically refraining from eating literal pork is totally irrelevant save maybe as a fasting discipline.

Early Fathers such as St. Clement of Rome, St. Irenaeus, and Tertullian continued to use this method of interpretation which is found in the Epistle of Barnabas. Chapter 9 of the latter contends that in the dietary laws Moses expounded moral principles in a spiritual manner, but the Jews, being carnal, misunderstood them to refer literally to foods. Moses forbade eating pork in order to discourage associations with swinish people; that is, people who remember the Lord only when they are in need, are just like the pig which does not pay attention to its master while it is greedily feeding at the trough but squeals incessantly when it is hungry.​

 

[Ishraqiyun]

I think the part about THE Jews not understanding it isn't accurate though. There were also Jews who understood the allegorical import of the food symbolism.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

The simple fact that he is limiting God's Holy Law as applicable ONLY to the wicked and unsaved...is grounds enough for my disagreement.

The Law of God is 100% NOT only for unbelievers.
In fact the things of God are foolishness to the wicked.

Can't there be wicked believers?
Such as the corrupt, murderous and hypocritacl Judean rulers?

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary