VOTE HOW MANY BELIEVE IN A PRE TRIBULATION HOPE/RAPTURE ?

[keras]

Show me one verse that pertains to the Trib, for protection of the Church (all in Christ).

Revelation 12:14....where the faithful Christian peoples will be taken to a place of safety on earth.

However, most of the verses which tell us the Lord will protect His own, are for the next Prophesied event the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster by fire from the sun.

1 Th 1:10 proves the timing of the rapture is pre-Trib. That’s the Bible saying it; not me.

You ARE saying there will be a rapture, You can expect to have to explain to God why you do that.

A 'rapture to heaven' is not stated or implied in that verse. It simply says He will deliver us. NOT remove away from.
AS Psalms 23 says: We will walk thru the valley of the shadow of death, but will fear no harm for the Lord is with us.

 

[Timtofly]

NOW CONCERNING the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our assembling to meet him, we beg you, brethren,
2. not to be quickly shaken in mind or excited, either by spirit or by word, or by letter purporting to be from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come.

The rule of Christ on earth, cannot happen, until all these things. Not the Second Coming, nor the rapture have to wait for these things.

You have to remember that all the redeemed at that time were waiting for the kingdom to come to earth.

Not just be taken away.

We need to always be prepared for great tribulation. Not the great tribulation which is about Jacob, not the church.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Here are 2 Thessalonians 2:3-4, one sentence in the Greek New Testament.

3 μή τις ὑμᾶς ἐξαπατήσῃ κατὰ μηδένα τρόπον · ὅτι ἐὰν μὴ ἔλθῃ ἡ ἀποστασία πρῶτον καὶ ἀποκαλυφθῇ ὁ ἄνθρωπος τῆς ἀνομίας, ὁ υἱὸς τῆς ἀπωλείας,
4 ὁ ἀντικείμενος καὶ ὑπεραιρόμενος ἐπὶ πάντα λεγόμενον θεὸν ἢ σέβασμα, ὥστε αὐτὸν εἰς τὸν ναὸν τοῦ θεοῦ καθίσαι ἀποδεικνύντα ἑαυτὸν ὅτι ἔστιν θεός.

The word ἀποστασία, transliterated in some literature as “apostasia,” simply does not mean “departure” or “disappearance.” According to the (BDAG (p. 121), the only meanings found in the New Testament are, “defiance of established system or authority,” that is “rebellion, abandonment, breach of faith” (BDAG, p. 121). However, your posts clearly tell us that you do not like those meanings. And because you do not like them, you have falsely claimed repeatedly that the word ἀποστασία” means “departure / disappearance” and that it is a reference to the rapture of the Church. There is nothing more important to me than the truth, but your posts show us that your values are quite very different!

I am well aware there was pressure put on Bible publishers to adopt KJV’s invalid change in 2 Th 2:3. There is a cover-up, and it very likely extends from Roman Catholics who were the first to alter 2 Th 2:3 in their Douay–Rheims Bible. Catholics are officially antagonistic to the pre-Trib rapture. The editing out of the “departure” and “departing” in 2 Th 2:3 is a scandal of huge proportions, that will come out in the future.

That KJV wouldn’t answer Greek experts back in 1611, proves there is a scandal. KJV won’t answer even today (I’ve tried).

Who do they think they’re kidding when “our gathering unto Him” in verse 1 means rapture? Paul was correcting his Thessalonian flock for the deception against them. He corrected them by saying in verse 3 (GNV): Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a departing first, and that that man of sin be disclosed, even the son of perdition.

The “departing” will occur before the Trib. With “rapture” as the context in verse 1, “departing” means rapture, in perfect alignment with apostasia’s 2nd definition.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Revelation 12:14....where the faithful Christian peoples will be taken to a place of safety on earth.

However, most of the verses which tell us the Lord will protect His own, are for the next Prophesied event the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster by fire from the sun.

You ARE saying there will be a rapture, You can expect to have to explain to God why you do that.

A 'rapture to heaven' is not stated or implied in that verse. It simply says He will deliver us. NOT remove away from.
AS Psalms 23 says: We will walk thru the valley of the shadow of death, but will fear no harm for the Lord is with us.

Revelation 12:14 is about Israel, not the Church.

Revelation 12:14....where the faithful Christian peoples will be taken to a place of safety on earth.

However, most of the verses which tell us the Lord will protect His own, are for the next Prophesied event the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster by fire from the sun.

You ARE saying there will be a rapture, You can expect to have to explain to God why you do that.

A 'rapture to heaven' is not stated or implied in that verse. It simply says He will deliver us. NOT remove away from.
AS Psalms 23 says: We will walk thru the valley of the shadow of death, but will fear no harm for the Lord is with us.

1 Th 1:10 (ESV): and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come.

You need to understand “delivers us.” "The second usage of deliverance refers to the Acts of God whereby he rescues his people from danger. The key words nasal [l;v"n] ("draw out, snatched away")," --- Source: Baker's Evangelical Dictionary of Biblical Theology.

“Snatched away” is what occurs in the rapture. We are snatched away in 1 Th 4:17 (ESV): Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

 

[keras]

You need to understand “delivers us.”

You need to understand "Protection".

When you walk through fire, I will be with you"

Isaiah 42:9-15 The earlier prophecies have come to pass, now I declare new things.
Sing a new song to the Lord, sing His praises throughout the world, you that sail the seas and you that inhabit the coasts and islands. Let the wilderness settlements rejoice in Kedar and Sela [All of the holy Land]

Long have I restrained Myself and kept silence, but now I cry out like a woman in labour. Now I shall lay waste to the hills and dry up the watercourses. The Lord will go forth as a warrior, He will raise the battle cry and triumph over His enemies.

Isaiah 42:16-24 You that are deaf, hear now, look you blind and see! Who is as blind as the one who has My trust, so deaf as the servant of the Lord? You have seen much but perceived little, your ears are open, but you hear nothing. I shall lead the blind along paths they do not know, making smooth the way, but those who trust in idols will be turned back in shame. It pleased the Lord to further His justice, to make His Law great. Yet, here is a people taken as spoil and plundered, all hidden away in prisons with no hope of rescue. Who will pay heed to this? Who was it that handed Israel over? Who gave up Israel for spoil? It was the Lord, against whom they sinned for they refused obedience to His Laws.

Isaiah 42:25 So, onto Jacob He poured His wrath. The anger and fury of God’s wrath burned him, yet still they did not take it to heart.

Isaiah 43:1-8 But now, Jacob, this is the word of the Lord, of Him who created you: When you pass through waters, I will be with you. When you walk through fire, you will not be scorched. I am the Holy One of Israel, your Deliverer. Because I love you, I will give other peoples as ransom for your life. Have no fear, for I am with you. I shall bring your descendants from the East and West. From the North and South and the ends of the earth, everyone who bears My name, all who I have made for My glory. Lead out those who are blind – a people who have eyes, but cannot see, who have ears, but cannot hear.

Isaiah 43:9 The nations are gathered. Which of them foretold former things? Or can interpret this for us? Let them prove their case, so we can see if it is true.
Isaiah 43:10-13 You are My witnesses, says the Lord. You are My servants, chosen by Me, so that you may understand that I am God alone.
I am the Lord and I alone am your Deliverer. What I do, no one can undo.
Reference: Revised English Bible, some verses abridged

42:10-12 All those who love the Lord, every faithful Christian, throughout the world – get ready to praise Him for their deliverance. John 15:16, 1 Peter 2:9-10

42:13-15 The Lord has restrained Himself, but soon He will act in the world. Psalms 50:1-6

42:16-17 His People, the Christian Israelites, will be led into all of the holy Land. Those judged unrighteous cannot enter. Ezekiel 20:37-38

42:18-20 The Lord’s servants, everyone who bears His Name, are unable to understand prophecy or foresee His plans for them. Jeremiah 6:10

42:22-25 His faithful peoples, are scattered among the nations by the Lord.

43:1-7 But now, when His people experience trouble, the Lord will protect them. All will be gathered into the holy Land. Isaiah 35:1-10, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26

43:9-13 The other nations are ignorant of the Lord’s plans. The Christian people are His witnesses and servants chosen by Him, so they will know God and spread the gospel of the coming Kingdom of God. Isaiah 66:18b-21, Revelation 14:1-7

 

[keras]

We are snatched away in 1 Th 4:17 (ESV): Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.

You make a fool of yourself. Everyone can read and understand that 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 is a Prophecy about the glorious Return of Jesus, to reign as King for the next thousand years,
King Jesus will be in Jerusalem, Zechariah 14:16-21, you think His peoples, 1 Peter 2:9-10, will be in heaven?

 

[Oseas]

King Jesus will be in Jerusalem, Zechariah 14:16-21, you think His peoples, 1 Peter 2:9-10, will be in heaven?

Interesting question. It seems the people still not know what is the biblical heaven, even being them within the heaven, and not only them but also the red dragon that is among them-Revelation 12:3-4 combined with Job 1:6-9, and 2Corinthians 11:13-15-, and they have not eyes spiritually speaking, to see what heaven they are in, as is revealed and written in Ephesians 1:3-8 and Philippians 3:20-21KJV, among other biblical references, whose heavens were planted in the Earth by GOD-Isaiah 51:15-16.

But now, even now, from now on, the heavens, the heavenly environment, which were planted by GOD (OT & NT) will be burned with everlasting fire - 2 Peter 3:7-10:
7 But the heavens and the earth(the current idolater and esoteric Israel) which are now, by the same Word are kept in store, reserved unto FIRE against this Day of Judgment (seventh Day or seventh millennium) and perdition of ungodly men.

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.(Taake a look, Hebrews 1:1-3)

9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

10 But the Day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens(Ephesians 1:3-8) shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. (Take a look-Isaiah 33:10-14 combined with Hebrews 8:13)

Get ready

.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

You need to understand "Protection".

When you walk through fire, I will be with you"

Isaiah 42:9-15 The earlier prophecies have come to pass, now I declare new things.
Sing a new song to the Lord, sing His praises throughout the world, you that sail the seas and you that inhabit the coasts and islands. Let the wilderness settlements rejoice in Kedar and Sela [All of the holy Land]

Long have I restrained Myself and kept silence, but now I cry out like a woman in labour. Now I shall lay waste to the hills and dry up the watercourses. The Lord will go forth as a warrior, He will raise the battle cry and triumph over His enemies.

Isaiah 42:16-24 You that are deaf, hear now, look you blind and see! Who is as blind as the one who has My trust, so deaf as the servant of the Lord? You have seen much but perceived little, your ears are open, but you hear nothing. I shall lead the blind along paths they do not know, making smooth the way, but those who trust in idols will be turned back in shame. It pleased the Lord to further His justice, to make His Law great. Yet, here is a people taken as spoil and plundered, all hidden away in prisons with no hope of rescue. Who will pay heed to this? Who was it that handed Israel over? Who gave up Israel for spoil? It was the Lord, against whom they sinned for they refused obedience to His Laws.

Isaiah 42:25 So, onto Jacob He poured His wrath. The anger and fury of God’s wrath burned him, yet still they did not take it to heart.

Isaiah 43:1-8 But now, Jacob, this is the word of the Lord, of Him who created you: When you pass through waters, I will be with you. When you walk through fire, you will not be scorched. I am the Holy One of Israel, your Deliverer. Because I love you, I will give other peoples as ransom for your life. Have no fear, for I am with you. I shall bring your descendants from the East and West. From the North and South and the ends of the earth, everyone who bears My name, all who I have made for My glory. Lead out those who are blind – a people who have eyes, but cannot see, who have ears, but cannot hear.

Isaiah 43:9 The nations are gathered. Which of them foretold former things? Or can interpret this for us? Let them prove their case, so we can see if it is true.
Isaiah 43:10-13 You are My witnesses, says the Lord. You are My servants, chosen by Me, so that you may understand that I am God alone.
I am the Lord and I alone am your Deliverer. What I do, no one can undo.
Reference: Revised English Bible, some verses abridged

42:10-12 All those who love the Lord, every faithful Christian, throughout the world – get ready to praise Him for their deliverance. John 15:16, 1 Peter 2:9-10

42:13-15 The Lord has restrained Himself, but soon He will act in the world. Psalms 50:1-6

42:16-17 His People, the Christian Israelites, will be led into all of the holy Land. Those judged unrighteous cannot enter. Ezekiel 20:37-38

42:18-20 The Lord’s servants, everyone who bears His Name, are unable to understand prophecy or foresee His plans for them. Jeremiah 6:10

42:22-25 His faithful peoples, are scattered among the nations by the Lord.

43:1-7 But now, when His people experience trouble, the Lord will protect them. All will be gathered into the holy Land. Isaiah 35:1-10, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26

43:9-13 The other nations are ignorant of the Lord’s plans. The Christian people are His witnesses and servants chosen by Him, so they will know God and spread the gospel of the coming Kingdom of God. Isaiah 66:18b-21, Revelation 14:1-7

“Delivers us” is in 1 Th 1:10, not “protects us.” You are altering the wording. Therefore, all you posted has no relationship to that verse.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

You make a fool of yourself. Everyone can read and understand that 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 is a Prophecy about the glorious Return of Jesus, to reign as King for the next thousand years,
King Jesus will be in Jerusalem, Zechariah 14:16-21, you think His peoples, 1 Peter 2:9-10, will be in heaven?

That’s impossible. Jesus’ next return is governed 100% by Acts 1:9-11. The 2A fails in every respect to follow Acts 1:9-11. Only 1 Th 4:16-17 precisely fulfill Acts 1:11, and they are rapture verses.

1 Th 1:10 proves the pre-Trib timing of the rapture. “Delivers us” in that verse means we are removed from Earth and taken straight to Heaven, in complete alignment with John 14:3.

The pre-Trib rapture is prophesied to occur as the next return of Jesus Christ.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

You make a fool of yourself. Everyone can read and understand that 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 is a Prophecy about the glorious Return of Jesus, to reign as King for the next thousand years,
King Jesus will be in Jerusalem, Zechariah 14:16-21, you think His peoples, 1 Peter 2:9-10, will be in heaven?

1 Peter 2:9 is about Israelites.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

1 Peter 2:9 is about Israelites.

Please compare Matt 24:30 to 1 Th 4:16-17. First, Jesus descends by Himself in verse 16. In verse 31, He has many angels with Him. Secondly, the two trumpets don’t align. They each have a different purpose, and each is sounded only once.

 

[keras]

Please compare Matt 24:30 to 1 Th 4:16-17. First, Jesus descends by Himself in verse 16. In verse 31, He has many angels with Him. Secondly, the two trumpets don’t align. They each have a different purpose, and each is sounded only once.

Guesswork and wishful thinking.
There is not two Returns of Jesus.

The 'rapture to heaven' belief is a false teaching and those who believe it have been set up to fail. It will take a very strong faith to stand firm as the tremendous things of the Sixth Seal occur.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Guesswork and wishful thinking.
There is not two Returns of Jesus.

The 'rapture to heaven' belief is a false teaching and those who believe it have been set up to fail. It will take a very strong faith to stand firm as the tremendous things of the Sixth Seal occur.

You’re right that there is not two returns of Jesus; there are three or four!

Jesus returned after his ascension to Heaven in John 20:17 (NIV): … ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

Acts 9:3-6 (NIV):
As he neared Damascus on his journey, suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him. 4 He fell to the ground and heard a voicesay to him, “Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?”

5 “Who are you, Lord?” Saul asked.

“I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting,” he replied. 6 “Now get up and go into the city, and you will be told what you must do.”

The pre-Trib rapture is prophesied as the next return of Jesus Christ.

 

[keras]

You’re right that there is not two returns of Jesus; there are three or four!

Jesus returned after his ascension to Heaven in John 20:17 (NIV): … ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

Acts 9:3-6 (NIV):
As he neared Damascus on his journey, suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him. 4 He fell to the ground and heard a voicesay to him, “Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?”

5 “Who are you, Lord?” Saul asked.

“I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting,” he replied. 6 “Now get up and go into the city, and you will be told what you must do.”

The pre-Trib rapture is prophesied as the next return of Jesus Christ.

The depth of your error and deceit, becomes apparent when you have to use scriptures totally unrelated to the belief of a rapture to heaven of the Church.
A little while ago, I posted about the Alternative to a rapture; how many Prophesies say we will live in all of the holy Land, being the people God always wanted there, but has never yet had in all of the area given to Abraham and his descendants. Galatians 3:26-29
Wonderful descriptions of how the Lord will Bless and prosper His people there, it will be like heaven on earth! Ezekiel 34:11-16, Zechariah 8:1-8

I supported this truth with plenty of scripture, but no; you prefer to believe a fable; without any scriptural support.
What earthly use would you be in heaven?

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

The depth of your error and deceit, becomes apparent when you have to use scriptures totally unrelated to the belief of a rapture to heaven of the Church.
A little while ago, I posted about the Alternative to a rapture; how many Prophesies say we will live in all of the holy Land, being the people God always wanted there, but has never yet had in all of the area given to Abraham and his descendants. Galatians 3:26-29
Wonderful descriptions of how the Lord will Bless and prosper His people there, it will be like heaven on earth! Ezekiel 34:11-16, Zechariah 8:1-8

I supported this truth with plenty of scripture, but no; you prefer to believe a fable; without any scriptural support.
What earthly use would you be in heaven?

You are dodging the returns of Jesus. It isn't a total of 2. How many times did He appear in the OT?

Genesis 32:24-30 (NIV):

So Jacob was left alone, and a man wrestled with him till daybreak. 25 When the man saw that he could not overpower him, he touched the socket of Jacob’s hip so that his hip was wrenched as he wrestled with the man. 26 Then the man said, “Let me go, for it is daybreak.”

But Jacob replied, “I will not let you go unless you bless me.”

27 The man asked him, “What is your name?”

“Jacob,” he answered.

28 Then the man said, “Your name will no longer be Jacob, but Israel, because you have struggled with God and with humans and have overcome.”

29 Jacob said, “Please tell me your name.”

But he replied, “Why do you ask my name?” Then he blessed him there.

30 So Jacob called the place Peniel, saying, “It is because I saw God face to face, and yet my life was spared.”

The pre-Trib rapture is the next prophesied return of Jesus.

 

[Oseas]

Speaking of John the Baptist, JESUS said:Luke 7:27 - This is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.

And now? Who will be sent before JESUS's coming? Now is sent Michael-Daniel 12:1-3 combined with 1 Thessalonians 4:16 and Revelation 12.

And what is the current mission of Michael in this world of Devil?

Now, now, don't you know?

He will do the same he did in Sodom and Gomorrah, of the same manner as he revealed it to Lot: Remember: He asked to Lot: Has you here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place: For we will DESTROY this place(NOW WILL DESTROY THE WORLD AS A WHOLE), because the cry of them is waxen great before the face of the Lord; and the Lord has sent us to DESTROY it.
And Lot went out, and spake unto his sons in law, which married his daughters, and said, Up, GET YOU OUT OF THIS PLACE; for the Lord will DESTROY this city (NOW WILL DESTROY THE WORLD AS A WHOLE). But he seemed as one that mocked unto his sons in law.

Revelation 11:15-18. Take a look.

Be careful or else get ready

 

[keras]

You are dodging the returns of Jesus. It isn't a total of 2. How many times did He appear in the OT?

Spiritually Jesus was always here and He has never left us. Matthew 28:20
But what is Prophesied is a physical Return in power and glory, seen by everyone.
He does not need to come in your rapture fable. As you do not know the way....you have to have Him provide a bus service.
Even on His terrible Day of fiery wrath, He will not be seen. Isaiah 66:15-17, Psalms 11:4-6

The pre-Trib rapture is the next prophesied return of Jesus.

It was Goebbels who said: If you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it.
I assure you; it doesn't work that way with me. But the poor saps in dipsy congregations have the rapture rammed down their throats.

Tell us; have you ever heard any alternative to the rapture preached? Would you consider a Biblically supported alternative? If not, why not?

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Spiritually Jesus was always here and He has never left us. Matthew 28:20
But what is Prophesied is a physical Return in power and glory, seen by everyone.
He does not need to come in your rapture fable. As you do not know the way....you have to have Him provide a bus service.
Even on His terrible Day of fiery wrath, He will not be seen. Isaiah 66:15-17, Psalms 11:4-6

It was Goebbels who said: If you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it.
I assure you; it doesn't work that way with me. But the poor saps in dipsy congregations have the rapture rammed down their throats.

Tell us; have you ever heard any alternative to the rapture preached? Would you consider a Biblically supported alternative? If not, why not?

Jesus carried out an all-night wrestling match with Jacob. Jesus was physically there (Genesis 32:22-32); Jesus was physically with Mary Magdalene at the tomb. He ascended into Heaven (John 20:11-18) and He returned for His 40 days of being on Earth after His resurrection. Jesus is not bound by any limitations of His number of returns, and, His returns can be private.

Acts 1:11 will be perfectly fulfilled only by 1 Th 4:16-17. Those are rapture verses because (1) they hide Jesus from the view of unbelievers; (2) we are changed into our glorified bodies (1 Th 4:17 and 1 Cor 15:52); and (3) we are taken up into heavenly clouds where we meet Jesus in the air (1 Th 4:17).

John 14:3 (NIV) says: And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. Jesus descending (1 Th 4:16) is the first step of John 14:3 ("I will come back"); our being taken up into heavenly clouds to meet Jesus in the air are the fulfillment of John 14:3's ("take you to be with me"). John 14:3 continues with "that you ALSO (emphasis added) may be where I am" (where is Jesus now?). We are taken to Heaven (where Jesus is NOW).

Per Acts 1:11, the pre-Trib rapture is the next prophesied event in the Bible to occur.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Spiritually Jesus was always here and He has never left us. Matthew 28:20
But what is Prophesied is a physical Return in power and glory, seen by everyone.
He does not need to come in your rapture fable. As you do not know the way....you have to have Him provide a bus service.
Even on His terrible Day of fiery wrath, He will not be seen. Isaiah 66:15-17, Psalms 11:4-6

It was Goebbels who said: If you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it.
I assure you; it doesn't work that way with me. But the poor saps in dipsy congregations have the rapture rammed down their throats.

Tell us; have you ever heard any alternative to the rapture preached? Would you consider a Biblically supported alternative? If not, why not?

Here is what you do. You find verses (such as Isaiah 66:15–17) that use certain words, then you try to pass those off as referring to the Trib. Those verses have no relationship to the Trib. You lack credibility when you cite verses because you repeatedly cite verses that don't pertain to the Trib.

 

[keras]

Per Acts 1:11, the pre-Trib rapture is the next prophesied event in the Bible to occur.

What pretentious nonsense.
The glorious Return is fully described in Revelation 19:11-16
No human leaves the earth then, or at anytime later.

Here is what you do. You find verses (such as Isaiah 66:15–17) that use certain words, then you try to pass those off as referring to the Trib. Those verses have no relationship to the Trib. You lack credibility when you cite verses because you repeatedly cite verses that don't pertain to the Trib.

Isaiah 66:15-17 refers to the Sixth Seal, the Lords Day of fiery wrath. The worldwide disaster that will commence all the end times events.
The Great Tribulation of the 7 Trumpets and the 7 Bowls will occur during the final 3 1/2 years before Jesus Returns.

What I do; is the refute the foolish and unscriptural idea that people will be raptured to heaven. Before any Judgment: simply not possible.