Whats the difference...

Salvation is a person .... Jesus , the way , the truth , the light , the narrow door , the narrow path .... John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

the church and the sacraments direct our footsteps in this Journey of " sanctification" growing up in the faith ; starting with baptism for the cleansing from original sin and confirmation to empower us to serve ... which fulfills what Jesus spoke to Nicodemus of :
John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

Simply knowing of Jesus , as a concept .... or living a good life , apart from the church , the word of God , and the fellowship of Christians is not sufficent to fulfill our obligation , nor provide the fellowship , discipline , or understanding required ...

Well first things first: Catholics are Christians



Protestants are Christians that left the Catholic Church

The Catholic Church definitely follows the 10 commandments:





I am going to suggest three things to read then if you have any more specific questions we can go from there:

1: Pillar of Fire, Pillar of Truth

http://www.catholic.com/library/Pillar.asp



2: Catholic teaching: Justification and Works

http://www.christianforums.com/t80333



3: Non-Catholic eternal life?

http://www.christianforums.com/t90377

Patdoggydogg said:

Hello all, I am new to this site, and so i posted a topic similar to this one in a different form. but sence this is a catholic form, maybe you guys can help. Ok so i am a "confused" christian, I belive that if someone is good, they will get into Heaven, like a Catholic right? But i also believe people should follow the 10 commandments, like a Prodastant right? Do catholics ALSO follow the 10 commandments? Yet Prodastants think that ONLY being a good person will not get you into Heaven, that what you do on Earth( good deeds) is insignifficant to what God does. If anyone has knowlege on this, then PLEASE let me know..help me figure this out.....this is really confusing =/

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Oh boy. To make it real simple, we are saved by grace, not by being good. We certainly believe in upholding the 10 commandments and to willfully break them and not be repentful can land you in hell. But it is all because of grace, we need grace to repent, grace to accept Christ. If we didn’t have grace we wouldn’t do any good anyway. It is responding to grace, doing what God asks of us until the end is what we believe gets us into heaven and it is rejecting grace and mercy that lands us in hell. It is our choice to go there, not God’s.

Hello Patdoggydogg,

I am glad that you have joined us over here, to ask your questions. You would not have gotten correct answers at the website, that is not to be named.

There are varying things that Protestants believe about this issue, so if you ask Protestants this question you will get different answers.

Catholicism teaches the following.

Jesus died for us on the cross so that we may have eternal life. From this act of redemption flows grace, that we may accept or reject. If our life is a life that accepts this grace then we will be saved. If we reject this grace, then we reject God and what he did for us, and thus we choose hell. It is all a matter of grace. If a person accepts the grace that God freely gives to them then they will follow the ten commandments and the two commandments that Jesus gave us.

There are many ways that one can receive this grace. The most profound way one can receive this grace is through the sacraments that Jesus established. The sacraments are Baptism, Confession, Eucharist, Confirmation, Matrimony, Holy Orders, and Annointing of the Sick. These are sources of Sanctifying grace.

There are other times where the Holy Spirit may inspire you to do something. For instance, the fact that you are trying to learn about christianity, is you responding to grace. I think that this is called Actual grace. Although others here, may correct me, if I am not understanding Sanctifying and Actual grace correctly.

So, to put it simply, there is nothing we can do that will merit our salvation. Jesus' redeeming act on the cross, is all that was needed. However, it is a matter of us accepting his act of redemption or rejecting it. If we accept it by continuously accepting the grace that flows from it, then we are on the right track. If we reject it, then we reject Christ, and we choose hell.

I hope that clears things up a bit.

Catholicism teaches that Salvation is a two stage process.

There is Justification, which is offered by God's Free Grace, and our free response.

Catechism of the Catholic Church:
1997 Grace is a participation in the life of God. It introduces us into the intimacy of Trinitarian life: by Baptism the Christian participates in the grace of Christ, the Head of his Body. As an "adopted son" he can henceforth call God "Father," in union with the only Son. He receives the life of the Spirit who breathes charity into him and who forms the Church.

Then comes Sanctification, which is our continuing walk with God, and our formation into true disscipleship and following of Christ. This means that works are necessary to salvation, for we have to try to do what Jesus has asked us to do. But we gain help for this through sanctifying grace, which also comes from God through prayer, the sacraments of the Church, and by other means. So the glory is all God's.

2008 The merit of man before God in the Christian life arises from the fact that God has freely chosen to associate man with the work of his grace. The fatherly action of God is first on his own initiative, and then follows man's free acting through his collaboration, so that the merit of good works is to be attributed in the first place to the grace of God, then to the faithful. Man's merit, moreover, itself is due to God, for his good actions proceed in Christ, from the predispositions and assistance given by the Holy Spirit.

2010 Since the initiative belongs to God in the order of grace, no one can merit the initial grace of forgiveness and justification, at the beginning of conversion. Moved by the Holy Spirit and by charity, we can then merit for ourselves and for others the graces needed for our sanctification, for the increase of grace and charity, and for the attainment of eternal life.

2011 The charity of Christ is the source in us of all our merits before God. Grace, by uniting us to Christ in active love, ensures the supernatural quality of our acts and consequently their merit before God and before men. The saints have always had a lively awareness that their merits were pure grace. Catechism of the Catholic Church

Patdoggydogg said:

I never heard of these two, what are they? (Thank you so much proud, really am thankful for it

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Matthew 22:34-40
But the Pharisees, hearing that he had silenced the Sadducees, came together.
And one of them, a doctor of the law, asked him, tempting him:

Master, which is the great commandment in the law?

Jesus said to him: Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with thy whole heart and with thy whole soul and with thy whole mind.
This is the greatest and the first commandment.

And the second is like to this: Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

On these two commandments dependeth the whole law and the prophets.

Indeed these two commandments sum up all the others, as Jesus said.

If you love Jesus, certainly you will do good works. If you do not do good works, how much do you really love Jesus then? (James 2:14-26)

And it is not hard, for "For my yoke is easy and my burden is light." (Matt. 11:30) -- He gives us the grace and strength to perform these works, in spite of our weakness, for He is our rock and salvation. (cf. Matt. 15:4-9)

Welcome to CF, my brother Patdoggydog, and God bless you!

And the key difference is that Catholics don't believe good works follow automatically from faith, as the Protestants believe. We say they flow from a freewill cooperation with grace.

Defens0rFidei said:

And the key difference is that Catholics don't believe good works follow automatically from faith, as the Protestants believe. We say they flow from a freewill cooperation with grace.

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Yea, because even an atheist can have good works, they are cooperating with grace unbeknown to them. Jesus said if the evil can give good gifts to their children and even the evil know how to love their own.

Patdoggydogg said:

Hello all, I am new to this site, and so i posted a topic similar to this one in a different form. but sence this is a catholic form, maybe you guys can help. Ok so i am a "confused" christian, I belive that if someone is good, they will get into Heaven, like a Catholic right? But i also believe people should follow the 10 commandments, like a Prodastant right? Do catholics ALSO follow the 10 commandments? Yet Prodastants think that ONLY being a good person will not get you into Heaven, that what you do on Earth( good deeds) is insignifficant to what God does. If anyone has knowlege on this, then PLEASE let me know..help me figure this out.....this is really confusing =/

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Hi Patdoggydogg!

Welcome to CF and to OBOB! I agree with what Proud2bCatholic said about the site not to be named. . . I once spent much time there too . . it is better to be here at CF in many ways!


Regarding the 10 commandments, the Catholic Church sees them as VERY important - and they serve to instruct us and guide us regarding God's moral law . .

But they are expressions of God's moral law . . and the 2 that Jesus gave . . to, briefly, to love God with everything you have inside of you, and to love your neighbor as yourself go farther than the 10 commandments, and surpass them . .

For instance . . the 10 commandments say, Do not commit adultery . . but the moral law upon which they are based goes much further than that, and the new commandment, to Love your Neighbor as yourself makes it wrong to even lust in your heart after another man's wife . .

The same with Murder . . Thou shalt not Murder (kill) . . . the moral law upon which this Commandment of the origianl 10 was based goes much deeper than this . .

Jesus said, if you are angry at a brother without cause, that you are guilty . . . so now, the physical act of murder gives way to something deeper, more emcompassing, more fundamental in the moral law . .

Love of neighbor

Love of neighbor has been devided into to "RULES" the GOLDEN RULE which states : Do unto others what you would have them do to you

And the SILVER RULE which says: Do not do to others what you don't want them to do to you . .

The New Commandments go deeper and further than ever the 10 commandments did . . but we can use the 10 commandments as a jumping off point, so to speak, to talk about and understand the deeper moral law from which they came . .


Does this help in understanding how important the 10 commandments really are and how they help us as Christians?


As far as faith and good works go . . Think of it this way . .

To have life, you have to be able to breath . . and to breath you have to be able to breath in air (inspriation) and breath out air (expiration) . .

If you have breath in, but don't breath out, or breath out, but don't breath in, you will stop breathing and die . .

In our spiritual lives, if we have faith without works, or works without faith, we will also die . .

We must have both . .. and both faith and good works are our hearts' response to God's GRACE, His infused LIFE into our souls . . .


Does this help?


Peace in Him!