We Don't Need Any Handouts

eldermike · May 13, 2008

Jetgirl said:
What I haven't yet seen anyone do in this thread is define "rich."

Is it someone who makes more than a million dollars a year, someone who makes less but has over a million in assets, someone who makes more than a hundred thousand a year, someone who makes more than 70K?

This is an important distinction, since many times when the politicians talk about the "rich" and "paying their fair share," we all assume the ultra-wealthy are being discussed when for all intents and purposes great swaths of the middle class are also included.

For instance: In most parts of the country my husband and I would be considered "rich." However, in the area (area being the county, not the neighborhood) we live we can't afford to own a home, we barely afford rent, and we're delaying having children indefinitely because of financial constraints.

On the other hand, we are taxed in the highest bracket, along with those making multi-millions. When anyone starts talking about the "rich," effectively you're talking about us too, even though to see our bank accounts and lifestyle you most likely would never lump us in with "rich."

Everyone needs to keep in mind that these things need to be defined and agreed upon before a rational conversation about exactly what the "rich" should do can even be started.

I think rich is having all you need and the ability to gain some of your wants even if they are in your future plans.

I started out life in a middle class home but that did not last nor did it shape my future life. As a very young boy I found myself in a boys home, from there I was passed around to a few families, started working at 14, in the military at 18. I went to college on the GI bill and became an engineer, later went to seminary and became a preacher/engineer/musician. My wife of 33 years now and I are doing very well, but it has not always been so.
My experiences have taught me to run from government aid, not to curse my current circumstances and save money. I learned the value of saving at 14, praise God. I have never earned a huge salary but over 35 years the 10 to 20% I did not spend gave me and my wife power over our circumstances.

The government will not empower people, it takes power and keeps it for itself. Power comes from hard work and good planning over a long period of time.

Grizzly · May 13, 2008

ParsonJefferson said:
.

Probably the most informative post in the thread.

Billnew · May 13, 2008

To far into discussion to catch up.

I would have prefered to remain clear of racial stereotypes. Just remain neutril.
Minoritys and people of the majority make good and bad decisions. I have no problem offering assistance to improve(like GED or job training) themselves, but just throwing money at people that don't want to improve, is not the way to do it.

I don't mind anyone wanting their own peice of pie, I just don't want to make it from scratch and then serve it to them on a silver platter, in thier comfortable chair, and hearing them complain because it isn't big enough.

$10 is not an allowance, Its a workable wage. Above minimum wage, but not good enough to support a family on, a good thing people get raises if they stick to a job or
learn more skills to be worth more to thier employer.

CrazyPerson · May 13, 2008

I believe you are right, at the same time I believe that the Lord does want us to help the poor. Quite frankly, i think that the scariest things in the world are government bureaucracy, and that inst the solution.

Churches need to step there rear ends up to help the poor, not by handouts but by teaching them to help themselves. I'm not interested in giving someone free healthcare for life, im interested in getting them trained so that they can afford such a thing. Id much rather teach a man to fish then give him one of the ones i spent a day working for.

reverend B said:
if you think that the op was the greatest post you have ever read, you are fighting a battle without an enemy. if you want to discuss whether the wealthy have a greater right to the available health care in this country than the poor do, then let's talk. that would indicate that wealthy people have more value than the poor, as there are other ways to distribute that resource that does not discriminate against those that are more challenged economically

Healthcare what other ways are there to distribute the limited amount we have? Those doctors go to school for half an eternity, they expect to be paid back... somehow it needs to be paid for.

flicka said:
That wouldn't work either. Different people, different situations.

I hope thats sarcasm... that is a great way to cause hyperinflation. Supply and demand my friend, the more money people have the more they are willing to spend.

The more they are willing to spend, the more prices go up because businesses want more money.

the more prices go up, the lower the value of the money really is... if we all made 100,000 but a gallon of mil cost 1,000, a dozen eggs 900.

Ok i didn't check my numbers so maybe we are, but you get my point.

Billnew · May 15, 2008

eldermike said:
I think rich is having all you need and the ability to gain some of your wants even if they are in your future plans.

That to me is middle class. Rich is having all you need and most of what you want.

The government will not empower people, it takes power and keeps it for itself. Power comes from hard work and good planning over a long period of time.

And limiting the goverments ability to take your power from you.

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