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Because Universe were not a point-size Big Bang, then its temperature was finite and limited. Therefore, there was some fine tuned structure and distribution of matter in the Beginning. Therefore the Beginning can occur around 7000 years ago. The God is not fan of the lifeless rocks!Nobody but you says it was "infinitely hot."
I believe people in general when it comes to examining the visible evidence opt in the same manner as those opposed to Copernicus. They have their worldview flatly revolving around their own head.In 1543 Copernicus published his theory of a heliocentric solar system. Although he was a Catholic priest, his theory met with strong opposition from the established Church. In 1600 Giordano Bruno, who endorsed Copernicus' theory, was burned alive at the stake in Rome for his stubborn heretical beliefs, among which was the heliocentric solar system!
Quasar92
Many Christians today believe as an article of faith that the Bible teaches the earth was created 6,000 years ago
This is a topic I think is best answered with a little video.
In this you will see science being used to point to the young age of the earth. It is about an hour long, and holds some eye opening facts.
Before God (the Son, actually) created light, there was no "nature." Light was the first thing He created in the physical universe. Says so in Genesis.
I'm automatically skeptical of a video like this that has comments disabled.
Did you post the book? Just playing lol ..praise GOD.. awesome. And I always think I write to much. This is one of those areas were we can take a HUGE dive in to speculation. Its just not written. There are things that God just did not share for .. it would have no effect what so ever on us now. There are some verses from 1-2 that seem to have a gap..something seem to have happen between those two verses
We can say.. man is 6000 years old. We can also say the earth has been here much longeryet.. some of this dating how old things are.. can be really far off. For me.. be it 6k or 6million.. ok..
Infinitely hot thing can not cool off.
Many Christians today believe as an article of faith that the Bible teaches the earth was created 6,000 years ago. They dispute all the evidence of geology, paleontology and radiometric dating techniques. They argue that such evidence is invalid, grossly misunderstood, and misinterpreted. Some Neo-Creationists claim that all the earth's strata was due to the Noachian deluge, or the original process of Creation. They claim all Creation took place during a six day period approximately 6,000 years ago. What is the truth?
The Bible is a reliable historical witness. However, the Bible nowhere says Creation occurred 6,000 years ago. Nor does it teach that the earth is flat, although Medieval theologians often assumed so and threatened anyone who would teach otherwise with excommunication and torture. The Middle Ages were a sad time in theological history. The supposedly enlightened Church pressured scientists such as Bruno and Galileo with the threat of bodily harm if they chose to believe the earth revolved around the sun.
Biologist George Simpson was right when he observed, "As a matter of fact, most of the dogmatic religions have exhibited a perverse talent for taking the WRONG SIDE on the most important concepts of the material universe" (George Gaylord Simpson, This View of Life, p. 214).
Irrational Theology
Catholic theologians made a great mistake in the Middle Ages. They assumed the Scriptures taught things about the material universe which were, in fact, false interpretations or assumptions. Perhaps for the masses, it was enough to listen to and believe dogmas with the stamped sanction of "Church authority." But for THINKING men, "Renaissance Man," for scientists who wished us to "prove all things," as the Scriptures themselves tell us to do (I Thessalonians 5:21), mere recitation of Church authority or tradition was not enough.
One author characterizes the problem this way: "The emotionally precious view of earth's centrality in a fixed, unchanging universe was crystallized by Ptolemy in the second century A.D., and then taken over by the Christian (i.e., Catholic) Church. What had been ancient pagan punishments for contradicting pagan theology became orthodox Christian punishments for questioning orthodox Christian dogma. Despite man's continued secret probing, fourteen centuries brought no serious challenger" (Robert Gorney, The Human Agenda, p. 27).
In 1543 Copernicus published his theory of a heliocentric solar system. Although he was a Catholic priest, his theory met with strong opposition from the established Church. In 1600 Giordano Bruno, who endorsed Copernicus' theory, was burned alive at the stake in Rome for his stubborn heretical beliefs, among which was the heliocentric solar system!
Galileo Galilei observed in 1604 that Copernicus had been right. Through the telescope, he observed that the earth and other planets DO revolve around the sun.
But the clerics of that day did not agree. Martin Luther lambasted the heliocentric or sun-centered solar system. He reasoned that since Joshua had commanded the sun to stand still, it must have been the sun which was moving around the earth. One archbishop of the Catholic Church lampooned the followers of Galileo with a Scriptural pun: "Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into the heavens?" he asked, quoting Acts 1:11 in the New Testament.
During the Inquisition, the Catholic Church resisted the pressures of rational thinking men with the pronouncement: "If earth is a planet, and only one among several planets, it cannot be that any such great things have been done specially for it as Christian doctrine teaches. If there are other planets, since God makes nothing in vain, they must be inhabited; but how can their inhabitants be descended from Adam? How can they trace their origin to Noah's ark? How can they have been redeemed by the Saviour?" (Ibid., p. 28).
Galileo's theory was branded by the Church as "of all heresies the most abominable, the most pernicious, the most scandalous."
During the Middle Ages when ecclesiastical authority reigned supreme, the science of geology was attacked as "a dark art," as "infernal artillery," and as "calculated to tear up in the public mind every remaining attachment to Christianity" (P. 53). When scientists accumulated data to show the earth is far older than Archbishop Ussher's date of 4004 B.C., they were vigorously assailed as "infidels," as "atheists," and "heretics."
Archbishop Ussher had concluded from his studies of the Bible that Creation must have been October 23, 4004 B.C. When fossil evidence was unearthed to indicate the earth was far older than that, the fossils were dismissed by some Church leaders as deliberate deceptions of the devil!
Unfortunately, some of this Medieval thinking still exists, today. Galileo, Copernicus, Kepler, Newton -- these men were willing to challenge the dogmas of their day. They were called buffoons, they were labeled heretics, they were held up to shame and contempt by ecclesiastical authorities. But they advanced the cause of TRUTH.
Today, too, we must at times take up shield and sword of the mind and spirit and CHALLENGE the Goliaths of modern dogma and conventional orthodoxy.
We must remember the impassioned words of Oliver Cromwell, ruler of England centuries ago, when he said: "I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be mistaken."
Blinders On Their Eyes
Why is it that people sometimes insist upon wearing blinders upon their eyes? Why won't they READ, STUDY, LEARN, COMPARE, CHALLENGE, and "PROVE ALL THINGS," holding in abeyance things which they cannot prove one way or another? Why do people insist upon dogmas? The attitudes of many people is like the nervous captain of a ship lowering the anchor down to twenty feet, and then assuming that it must have reached bottom, because that's all the line left on the anchor!
In 1832 citizens of Lancaster, Pennsylvania refused to allow their schoolhouse to be used for a discussion about railroads. They said: "Railroads are impossible and a great infidelity. If God had intended that his intelligent creatures should travel at the frightful speed of 17 miles an hour by steam he would have foretold it in the Holy Prophets. Such things as railroads are devices of Satan to lead immortal souls down to hell."
Some religious people, today, still ascribe the entire geologic record to the Flood of Noah's time. Theologians used to turn to the Flood to explain the effects of erosion, mountain building, volcanism, and fossil remains. In the infancy of geological science, such a tendency could be well understood, and even pardoned. But, today, after TONS of geologic evidence, it seems strange that some religious folk still cling to the out-dated, antiquarian notions of the pre-scientific age. In order to rigorously cling to their notions of the Flood and a shortened chronology of the earth, they reject almost all the evidence of 150 years of geological investigation!
But we should not condemn them too strongly, because on the other side of the fence we have the Neo-Darwinian evolutionists and the school of anti-catastrophism -- those MUDDLE-HEADED GEOLOGISTS and PALEONTOLOGISTS who have been BRAINWASHED to the exact opposite conclusion. That is, they stand on "uniformitarian" geology, and will not admit to any earthshaking, global catastrophes in the past. They discount ALL human testimony, all traditions, all legends from around the world; they IGNORE or attempt to explain away all evidence of a geological nature which supports any kind of catastrophism. Uniformitarian theory has, for all practical purposes, become to them ANOTHER RELIGION.
What we see, then, is dogmatic individuals with BLINDERS on clinging to two opposing viewpoints, neither of which is right, neither of which is supported by the facts. Both unwilling to compromise, adamant in their authority, staunch in their belief. BOTH interpreting the evidence to fit their own theory.
I take issue with both the neo-Creationists who REFUSE to accept the evidence of an earth which has existed for millions of years, and also with the neo-Darwinists who REFUSE to admit the striking geological evidence for Creation.
Why does it seem so difficult for people to obtain a balance? Why do we humans become so emotionally involved with a particular belief, afraid, nervous, fearful and glandular? Emotional attachment to a false world concept, or fable, is a DANGEROUS thing. It is a little like falling in love with the wrong person -- it hurts.
Infatuation with a false belief or theory can hurt just as bad as romantic infatuation. After the honeymoon, the young couple have to deal with reality. If they were hasty, and rushed into marriage with the wrong person, the trauma and life long pain and regret can be considerable. Even so, if you have clung to out-moded beliefs, or concepts which are not really in the Scriptures, unlearning that false "knowledge" can be difficult and painful at times. It is much more difficult to unlearn false beliefs than to learn something right the first time!
So it is with geology and the existence of the world before Adam's time.
Overwhelming Evidence
All the geological and paleontological evidence PROVES beyond the slightest scintilla of a doubt that THERE WAS A WORLD BEFORE ADAM. Most of the dating techniques of scientists -- uranium-argon, potassium-thorium, racemization and thermaluminescence -- as well as observation and logic conclusively show that the rocks under our feet, the bones of ancient animals, and even the charcoal campfires of Paleo-Indians, Neanderthal man, and other ancient hominid remains, are MUCH OLDER than 6,000 years. There was a world before Adam. In fact, there were MANY ages before Adam, and these ages can be carefully distinguished through the study of paleontology, paleo-ecology, and related scientific disciplines.
The evidence is INDISPUTABLE. Many independent dating techniques demonstrate that various hominid creatures lived about 500,000 years ago. More primitive types lived as long ago as 1-2,000,000 years. Those creatures, in some cases, were FAMILIAR with fire, used crude chipped stone tools such as hand axes, notched and saw-toothed implements, scrapers, engravers. They were PRE-ADAMIC CREATURES living in a PRE-ADAMIC WORLD. A world which ended in a great catastrophe.
And before their time, OTHER worlds existed. The world of the dinosaurs ended about 70,000,000 years ago. That world, too, ended in a cosmic catastrophe.
The pre-Adamic world was a world of growth, change, and progress. It was a world where new life forms were introduced from time to time.
The fact that this world has been in existence for many millions of years is no longer a matter for debate. It is academic. Any serious author, today, must face squarely the many indications of time found in the geological record.
Neo-Creationists believe we must choose either the Bible or science, particularly scientific dating methods. One typical Neo-Creationist argues:
"The Bible-believing scientist must face squarely the question, In the area of natural science which shall supersede, the clear assertions of God's inspired Book, or modern man's interpretation of what he thinks he sees in nature?"
This particular author continues: "According to Bible chronology only a few thousand years have passed since the creation of the ancestors of our modern plants and animals...Contrariwise, if one accepts the assumption that the inorganic radioisotope clocks were reset wherever they became associated with fossil-bearing material, then apparently at least 600 million years have passed since plants and animals first appeared successively from that time over a duration of some 600 million years" (Frank Lewis Marsh, Life, Man and Time, pp. 67-68).
The truth is, there is NO CONTRADICTION between the Biblical record and scientific knowledge of the earth's past. Those who wish to uphold the Bible in the face of new evidence regarding early hominids, homo erectus, homo habilis, or other discoveries of Primitive Man-like creatures, need not worry. There is NO EVIDENCE that such creatures evolved into Modern man. Rather, they lived long ago in a world BEFORE ADAM WAS CREATED -- another world -- another age -- another time.
Such discoveries tell us much about the ancient history of the earth. They tell us nothing, one way or the other, about the Scriptures.
Creation and Recreation
In the pages of Genesis, as it relates to the original creation of the universe, we read the simple, matter-of-fact statement: "In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth" (Genesis 1:1, King James Version). The Amplified Bible renders this verse: "In the beginning God (prepared, formed, fashioned,) and created the heavens and the earth." The Good News Bible states: "In the beginning, when God created the universe..." The Moffatt Translation: "When God began to form the universe..." The Goodspeed Translation: "When God began to create the heavens and the earth..."
What exactly does the book of Genesis tell us? That YEHOVAH God created the universe -- the heavens and the earth -- in a period of time called, simply, "the beginning." How long ago that primeval creation occurred we are not told anywhere in the Scripture. To determine that, YEHOVAH God has given us brains and intellect!
That time of beginning could well have been six to ten billion years ago. Astronomers calculate that a "Big Bang" took place at that time, out of which the entire cosmos was created.
Verse two of Genesis, chapter one, continues:
"And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep" (King James Version).
Is this verse describing the ORIGINAL creation as being formless and void? If so, it would seem a contradiction. Verse one tells us YEHOVAH created the heavens and the earth. When YEHOVAH creates something, it is beautiful, grand, and majestic. In the 38th chapter of the book of Job, we read:
"Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof? When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?" (vs. 4-7).
If the original earth had been created a chaotic ruin, formless and void, the angels would not have "sang together" or have "shouted for joy."
Isaiah 45:18 adds more light on this enigmatic passage. The prophet declares: "For thus saith the Lord that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the Lord; and there is none else" (King James Version).
The Hebrew word translated "vain" here is tohu and means "to lie waste," "a desolation," "a desert." It can also be translated "confusion," "empty place," "without form," "nothing," "wilderness." It is the very same word used in Genesis 1:2, where we read the earth "was without form."
One place says YEHOVAH God created the earth and it "was without form"; in another place we read YEHOVAH did not create the earth "without form." Is this a contradiction? Not at all!
The KEY to understanding this apparently complex problem lies in the little word "was." It can also be translated "BECAME." In fact, in Genesis 19:16 it is translated "became." We read: "And Lot's wife became a pillar of salt."
What happened, then, is this: When YEHOVAH God originally created the earth, it was indeed a lovely place. He created it with no waste, no wilderness, no desolation. It was inhabited. The angels leaped for joy, and shouted with admiration and enthusiasm when they beheld the primeval earth.
But then something happened. It became "tohu" -- that is, waste, a ruin, a desolation. The original earth suffered a great cataclysm -- a cosmic catastrophe. The Hebrew words translated "without form and void" in Genesis 1:2 literally mean a desolation, a wilderness, an empty, uninhabited ruin. These words, tohu and bohu are very strong words and denote CATASTROPHE. They strongly suggest that some sort of primeval cataclysm, or several such cataclysms, occurred.
Destruction!
Paroxysm!
Chaos!
Scripture gives no data for determining HOW LONG AGO the universe was created. And in the first chapter of Genesis, it only records THREE creative acts: 1) the heavens and the earth (verse 1); 2) new animal life (verses 20-21); and 3) human life, Adam and Eve (verses 26-27). The first creative act referred to the DATELESS PAST. The creation of NEW forms of animal life, and Adam and Eve, occurred approximately 6,000 YEARS AGO. Obviously, then, the first chapter of Genesis is not describing the original creation of the heavens and earth as occurring in seven consecutive days.
After the chaos and destruction which occurred, in verse two of Genesis one, YEHOVAH God began a process of re-creation, reconstruction, if you please, which lasted for seven days. Verse 16 of Genesis one does NOT describe the sun and moon and stars being created on the fourth day. How could light have been created on the first day, but the sun and stars which IMPART LIGHT not till the fourth day? The original Hebrew for "made" in verse 16 actually means "made to appear, made visible." The sun and moon were created "in the beginning." The light came from the sun, of course, but the VAPOR in the earth's atmosphere diffused the light. After the great cataclysm, the earth was cut off from the light of the sun, moon and stars. Darkness prevailed everywhere. As verse two says: "And the earth was (BECAME) without form and void (TOHU and BOHU); and DARKNESS was upon the face of the deep. And the spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters."
What do we see then? An earth destroyed, in pitch darkness, covered by water, the continents submerged, due to some great cataclysm.
During the process of RECONSTRUCTION or RE-CREATION, YEHOVAH God first caused the light from the sun to penetrate the atmosphere once again, in a DIFFUSED manner (Genesis 1:3-5), allowing day and night to become discernible. He created order in the atmosphere (verses 6-8). He caused the dry land to appear once again (verse 10). He caused the earth to once again bring forth life, plants, vegetation, of all kinds. As the turgid clouds and atmospheric disturbances cleared away, He caused the sun, moon and stars to once again become visible from the earth's surface (verses 14-18).
Then, having REFASHIONED the surface of the earth, and having prepared it, YEHOVAH created NEW living creatures -- NEW animal life of all kinds, from great whales to small fish, from elephants to rodents, from flying birds to flying fish and insects -- to REPOPULATE the earth, and to REPLENISH it (verses 20-25).
Something had happened to the Pre-Adamic earth. It had been overwhelmed in a MIGHTY CATASTROPHE, or a long series of catastrophes, which is briefly described in verse 2 of Genesis chapter 1.
But what happened?
The world before Adam came to an ABRUPT, screeching end. It was cut short by flooding and upheaval, stroke upon stroke of catastrophe. This one short enigmatic, much misunderstood verse of the Bible, contains within its cryptic message a story that will amaze you. This one little verse may hold a CLUE as to what happened to the earth, after the original time when it was created, beautiful, and to be "inhabited," and before the time of Adam and Eve, when it had to be refashioned, reshaped, refurbished, and rebuilt.
This one verse, in essence, may cover a time span of MILLIONS of years. If YEHOVAH God originally created the earth six to ten billion years ago, and over millions of years created VARIOUS and sundry life forms, causing them to become buried in massive burials to form deposits of coal, peat, and oil and natural gas; if He spent millions of years preparing the world for the eventual time when He would create Man IN HIS OWN IMAGE [not some amorphous BLOB]; who are we to complain?
Vast Periods of Time?
Vast periods of time, and many successive ecological niches, had to exist in the earth, for algal reefs of hundreds of feet to grow in place. Much time was required for vast quantities of vegetation to live, grow, and die, and to become entombed, to create vast deposits of coal in Kansas, Oklahoma, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, West Virginia and Pennsylvania.
This vast period of time YAHWAH put to good use.
As Robert Macdonald shows, in a paper entitled Geology:
"The fossil record contains hundreds of zones, each with its own particular faunal assemblage. What is the chance that such an invariant worldwide sequence of life forms could be built up if they all lived CONTEMPORANEOUSLY, and the sequence in which they are found were only a burial order? How could a burial order based not on water sorting, but on environments do the job?...
"Suppose that in a worldwide catastrophe, one group of organisms were brought in from one area and deposited, then another assemblage from another area were deposited on top of that, and so on. A local sequence of life forms would be built up. But the chances would be against the deposition of fossils in the same order in a local sequence in another area. Consider the chance that the same order would occur in all sequences worldwide. It would be NIL!
"There is NO WAY to account for the sequence in faunal succession by ONE catastrophe. Nor is there any way to account for this sequence by a SERIES of catastrophes, or by a LONG DRAWN-OUT catastrophe. If all these Paleozoic and Mesozoic organisms were contemporaneous, there would inevitably have been some mixing of early and late forms.
"The ONLY explanation is that each geologic horizon does indeed represent a DIFFERENT time in the past during which a unique assemblage of life forms was living and being deposited in many parts of the world. Slow or incremental deposition is therefore essential to give time for worldwide changes in populations of fauna whose remains preserved as fossils vary from one stratum to another."
During the geologic ages of the earth's past, life went on in a normal fashion for millions of years. Fossil reefs obviously grew in the place in which they are found. Standing trees, with their roots in place, tracks and trails both on land and on the sea bottoms, layer upon layer containing burrows and borings made by animals just as they do in the sea-bottoms today, all show that most of the geologic column was created OVER MILLIONS OF YEARS, not in the Flood of Noah's time, or some other isolated catastrophe.
Although the record in the earth's strata clearly shows that great catastrophes did take place, in the earth's past, the record also shows that there were periods of millions of years in which no violent cataclysms occurred. During these calm, relatively nonviolent periods, great CREATIVE PROCESSES were going on. Cyclothems of coal were formed. As Macdonald points out, coal is commonly found in a sequence of beds called a cyclothem -- a cycle of beds repeated over and over again, perhaps dozens of times. Much time would be needed for such deposits to be made, one on top of another.
For the rest of this article, go to: http://hope-of-israel.org/lifeadam.htm
Originally edited by: John D. Keyser.
Hope of Israel Ministries -- Preparing the Way for the Return of YEHOVAH God and His Messiah!
This material is from: Hope of Israel Ministries
P.O. Box 2186
Temple City, CA 91780, U.S.A.
www.hope-of-israel.org
See also: http://www.kjvbible.org/satan.html
Quasar92
My sense is that most
Christians do not believe in a young earth, but have (all to easily) accepted theistic evolution in some sense. This is in part cultural and due to group pressure.
This simple truth doesn't seem evident in Genesis. The flood seems quite real. And there's no indication that Adam and Eve incarnate from another world, other than the one we inhabit.You are correct, the Israelites creation story, culled from Mesipotamian lore while in the Babylonian captivity, is a very young story. They assumed Adam was first, but failed to remove the narrative of Cain's concerns of tribes out in the world away from his family. The flood is an exaggerated fiction because they were unable to trace their bloodlines back to Adam.
The simple truth is that Adam and Eve incarnate from another world. They were to be the worlds new, visible spiritual rulers after the fall of the former administration.
Death was already on the earth, it's normal. The earth would get very crowded without it. The confusion came because Adam and Eve lost their immortality status when they fell.
I've not seen that. Evidence has little bearing, outside of those with a science background.But mosly it is due to evidence on a massive scale.
Because there is no transition between infinity and finity, according to math.
There is actually a lot of evidence. Two full grown, educated adults "suddenly appear" on earth. They spoke the same language as the "crafty beast" who was already evil, already working against Gods plan which he already knew.This simple truth doesn't seem evident in Genesis. The flood seems quite real. And there's no indication that Adam and Eve incarnate from another world, other than the one we inhabit.
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