was the creation story necessarily about earth

granpa · Sep 9, 2010

Vatican announcement:

Someone on another forum mentioned that the Vatican declared
that believing in extraterrestrials does not contradict a belief in God.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7399661.stm
http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0802629.htm
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24598508
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/14/world/europe/14iht-vat.4.12885393.html?_r=1
Then I suddenly had a wild idea.
I will probably get burned at the stake for this but here goes.

Creation:

I have studied it and it is my opinion that organic life virtually fills our 10 billion year old galaxy.
(http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/...ing-molecules/page__view__findpost__p__439137)
And since it only took 5 billion years for intelligent life to evolve on earth it follows that
intelligent life is probably abundant.
It would surely be very surprising if the creation story were completly silent about all this other intelligent life.

What if the creation story wasnt about the planet earth at all
but rather about the homeworld of some extraterrestrials that came to earth.
That would explain why it seems to contradict
what we know about the evolution of life on earth.
(small round things→large round things→aquatic animals→fliers→terrestrial animals
makes sense for arthropods but not vertebrates)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_insects#Origin_of_insect_flight

When and why did they come to earth?

Perhaps they came here in the days of Noah.
The ark would then be a spaceship.
If their homeworld were destroyed then
that would explain why the Bible says "all flesh died"
as well as explaining why they left their homeworld in the first place.

someone somewhere asked why a spaceship would be made of wood.
Perhaps because it was 'grown' not built.
some kind of super high tech superstrong material that
can be programmed to grow to any shape wanted.
probably built by nanobots

Adam:

Gen 2
The YHWH Elohim formed the Adam from the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life,
and the Adam became a living being.

This could be interpreted to mean
that Adam was genetically engineered (or even an outright robot).
A sort of super-being.

In any event, this would imply that the religion of YHWH is universal.
Literally.

Its just an idea that occurred to me and I think it might be worth looking into.

Jase · Sep 9, 2010

granpa said:
Someone on another forum mentioned that the Pope declared that believing in extraterrestrials does not contradict a belief in God. Then I suddenly had a wild idea. I will probably get burned at the stake for this but here goes.

What if Noahs ark was in fact a spaceship and Noah an extraterrestrial (possibly a Nephilim). If their homeworld were destroyed then that would explain why the Bible says "all flesh died".

That would mean that the creation story wouldnt be about the planet earth. It would be about the homeworld of the Nephilim.

This could mean that Adam was genetically engineered (or even an outright robot). A sort of super-being.

In any event, it could mean that the religion of YHWH is universal. Literally.

Just an idea.

Well, considering the Biblical authors didn't even know the realities of Earth from a scientific perspective, I seriously doubt they had any idea there were other planets in existence. The statistical odds of their being other life in the universe is quite high. There are billions of galaxies just like ours, with the potential for billions of other Earth-like planets capable of sustaining life.

granpa · Sep 9, 2010

Jase said:
Well, considering the Biblical authors didn't even know the realities of Earth from a scientific perspective, I seriously doubt they had any idea there were other planets in existence.

I dont understand the point you are making.
The idea here is that Gen 1 through 10 or 11 could only have been written by the aliens themselves.

Mallon · Sep 9, 2010

granpa said:
The idea here is that Gen 1 through 10 or 11 could only have been written by the aliens themselves.

Aaaaaand you lost me.

granpa · Sep 9, 2010

Mallon said:
granpa said:

I dont understand the point you are making.
The idea here is that Gen 1 through 10 or 11 could only have been written by the aliens themselves.

Click to expand...

Aaaaaand you lost me.

I dont see how. Its self-explanatory

'here' as in 'in my original post'.

granpa said:
Someone on another forum mentioned that the Pope declared that believing in extraterrestrials does not contradict a belief in God. Then I suddenly had a wild idea. I will probably get burned at the stake for this but here goes.

What if Noahs ark was in fact a spaceship and Noah an extraterrestrial (possibly a Nephilim). If their homeworld were destroyed then that would explain why the Bible says "all flesh died".

That would also mean that the creation story wouldnt be about the planet earth. It would be about the homeworld of the Nephilim.

Gen 2
The YHWH Elohim formed the Adam from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the Adam became a living being.

Click to expand...

This could mean that Adam was genetically engineered (or even an outright robot). A sort of super-being.

In any event, it could mean that the religion of YHWH is universal. Literally.

Just an idea.

Dark_Lite · Sep 9, 2010

granpa said:
Someone on another forum mentioned that the Pope declared that believing in extraterrestrials does not contradict a belief in God.

Rule of thumb: If a headline has any combination of Pope + an action, then the Pope probably had nothing to do with it. <-- Good rule of thumb borrowed from a person on OBOB. It was actually a Vatican astronomer who talked about this, not "the Vatican" as a whole, much less the Pope.

What if Noahs ark was in fact a spaceship and Noah an extraterrestrial (possibly a Nephilim). If their homeworld were destroyed then that would explain why the Bible says "all flesh died".

That's a massive stretch. Is the ark floating through space instead of the ocean now? What is the rain, then? There's no textual (much less historical) evidence to suggest that the ark story is talking about anything more than a human building a boat to save all the animals.

Mr Dave · Sep 9, 2010

DL, your avatar may suggest a belief in the idea

granpa · Sep 9, 2010

Dark_Lite said:
Rule of thumb: If a headline has any combination of Pope + an action, then the Pope probably had nothing to do with it. <-- Good rule of thumb borrowed from a person on OBOB. It was actually a Vatican astronomer who talked about this, not "the Vatican" as a whole, much less the Pope.

thats my fault. they did say vatican. i just assumed 'pope'.

Dark_Lite said:
That's a massive stretch. Is the ark floating through space instead of the ocean now? What is the rain, then? There's no textual (much less historical) evidence to suggest that the ark story is talking about anything more than a human building a boat to save all the animals.

I wouldnt expect there to be any. It might have been written by aliens but it would have been written to humans who had never heard of any such things.

it 'rains' other things besides water you know. Like cats and dogs and meteorites and things.

Dark_Lite · Sep 9, 2010

granpa said:
thats my fault. they did say vatican. i just assumed 'pope'.

Same rule of thumb goes for any headline that has "the Vatican" + an action or opinion. Chances are it's not "the Vatican" as a whole expressing that opinion, but rather an individual within the Vatican. Generally if you read the article they will have more specific information.

I wouldnt expect there to be any. It may have been written by aliens but it was written to humans who had never heard of any such things.

Ok, so if there's no evidence, then why would we believe it was written by aliens? Just because it seems like it's a good idea?

granpa · Sep 9, 2010

because it fits nicely and would explain a few things.
because there is bound to be life elsewhere in the universe so one would naturally expect the creation story to tell us something about it.

Greg1234 · Sep 9, 2010

granpa said:
I dont see how. Its self-explanatory.

Say it again, and again, and again, and again and again.

granpa · Sep 9, 2010

I cant answer a question that I dont understand

Dark_Lite · Sep 9, 2010

granpa said:
because it fits nicely and would explain a few things.
because there is bound to be life elsewhere in the universe so one would naturally expect the creation story to tell us something about it.

But there are better explanations that have actual evidence backing them up. So, invoking Occam's Razor, we can rule out aliens as having written Genesis. Also, how do you go from "there is bound to be life elsewhere in the universe so one would naturally expect the creation story to tell us something about it" to "aliens wrote Genesis?" Those are two very different ideas.

granpa · Sep 9, 2010

OK. I get it. You dont believe it. Fine.

Dark_Lite · Sep 9, 2010

granpa said:
OK. I get it. You dont believe it. Fine.

I don't, but I'm asking you why you believe it. Thus far, your justification has basically boiled down to "because it sounds cool." Just because it "explains a few things nicely" doesn't mean it's correct, especially when there's no evidence (which you have admitted even!) backing it up.

granpa · Sep 9, 2010

Who said that I believe it?
I believe that its a possibility worth looking into.
And I've already offered sufficient reason for that.

gluadys · Sep 10, 2010

Jase said:
Well, considering the Biblical authors didn't even know the realities of Earth from a scientific perspective, I seriously doubt they had any idea there were other planets in existence. The statistical odds of their being other life in the universe is quite high. There are billions of galaxies just like ours, with the potential for billions of other Earth-like planets capable of sustaining life.

From ancient times up to the invention of the telescope the term "planet" referred to a sub-set of stars. No one thought of planets being earth-like until the telescope revealed they were not stars.

The planets were originally conceived to be stars without a fixed place in a constellation. Hence it was thought there were two kinds of stars: planets (='wanderers') and fixed stars.

This is an important point to keep in mind when reading any reference to planets prior to the development of modern cosmology. Also in the ancient frame of reference, there could be only one earth as there can be only one centre of the universe and everything around it is heaven.

hamashiachagape · Sep 11, 2010

granpa said:
Someone on another forum mentioned that the Pope declared that believing in extraterrestrials does not contradict a belief in God. Then I suddenly had a wild idea. I will probably get burned at the stake for this but here goes.

What if Noahs ark was in fact a spaceship and Noah an extraterrestrial (possibly a Nephilim). If their homeworld were destroyed then that would explain why the Bible says "all flesh died".

That would also mean that the creation story wouldnt be about the planet earth. It would be about the homeworld of the Nephilim.

This could mean that Adam was genetically engineered (or even an outright robot). A sort of super-being.

In any event, it could mean that the religion of YHWH is universal. Literally.

Just an idea.

If Noah was an extraterrestrial, we would not have known about him . You should have seen the math utilized by Dr. Sarfati to prove that a space shuttle could not have made it to Earth from even Alpha Centauri.

granpa · Sep 12, 2010

that only proves that the ark wasnt a space shuttle.
who knows what technology we will have in a billion years.

SkyWriting · Sep 14, 2010

Jase said:
Well, considering the Biblical authors didn't even know the realities of Earth from a scientific perspective, I seriously doubt they had any idea there were other planets in existence. The statistical odds of there being other life in the universe is quite high. There are billions of galaxies just like ours, with the potential for billions of other Earth-like planets capable of sustaining life.

Scientifically speaking, all the data gathered shows that there is no other life out there.

The only hope for a positive result rests on statisticians shoulders who will never see any such results.
Just dreaming on. Pure faith plus math.
SETI Institute - Support the work of the SETI Institute

was the creation story necessarily about earth

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