Two Questions For Gays

CaptainYesterday said:

For my own part I sincerely wish that I could stop being attracted to women at all and be totally homosexual in my orientation. But I can't, because it's not a choice. I would be much happier if I could be, bisexual isn't all that fun lol.

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Bisexual people are actually held in contempt by many homosexual people.

Imana said:

1. If you adopted a child and he/she asks both of you why he/she has two moms or two dads, what would you say to that child?

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I'd be nonplussed for a moment, then say something like "You have two dads because both your parents are male. Your cousin Xena () has a daddy and a mummy because one parent is male, the other female. "

Imana said:

2. Last week on my job, I was talking with a bisexual man and he said to me that he choose to be that way and that homosexuality is a choice. So if it's a choice, then how come some gays say that they are born that way???

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Because some gays believe that they are born that way. Some gays (and, evidently, bis) believe that they chose to be that way. The scientific consensus, however, is that it is as much a choice as one's accent, or hair-colour: both your genetics and your environment play a part. I knew I was gay when someone told me what the word actually meant. For as long as I can remember, boys float my boat.

Brieuse said:

Bisexual people are actually held in contempt by many homosexual people.

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Source ?

Wiccan_Child said:

Source ?

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From informal conversation with my gay friends. I have two bisexual friends, and I feel and suspect they are in a bigger emotional battle to "decide". From conversations I've had with my gay friends, I pick up that that indecision is what turns them off having a relationship with a bisexual person.

Wiccan_Child said:

Source ?

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As Brieuse replied, it's anecdotal. But I don't necessarily disagree with the claim.

Far too often i've found that straight people will label me as 'gay' while gay people will label me as 'horny' lol. There is actually a good deal of pressure to, as they see it, "get off the fence". Which, as I stated (for myself, anyway), is impossible.

But not everyone is like that. I don't even think the majority think that way. But the sentiment does exist.

Brieuse said:

From informal conversation with my gay friends. I have two bisexual friends, and I feel and suspect they are in a bigger emotional battle to "decide". From conversations I've had with my gay friends, I pick up that that indecision is what turns them off having a relationship with a bisexual person.

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CaptainYesterday said:

As Brieuse replied, it's anecdotal. But I don't necessarily disagree with the claim.

Far too often i've found that straight people will label me as 'gay' while gay people will label me as 'horny' lol. There is actually a good deal of pressure to, as they see it, "get off the fence". Which, as I stated (for myself, anyway), is impossible.

But not everyone is like that. I don't even think the majority think that way. But the sentiment does exist.

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Huh. I've never encountered this prejudice (though I'm 'just' gay ).

Imana said:

1. If you adopted a child and he/she asks both of you why he/she has two moms or two dads, what would you say to that child?

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I would probably say something similar to HaloHope. Families come in different types and sizes, but that doesn't mean anything is wrong and doesn't make the children or any member of that family less important than someone from a different family.

2. Last week on my job, I was talking with a bisexual man and he said to me that he choose to be that way and that homosexuality is a choice. So if it's a choice, then how come some gays say that they are born that way???

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Personally, for me it was never something that I chose. I truthfully have dated guys before, but never loved them or could get close to them. When I met my current partner, I just fell in love with her - and could not see that it was even happening until looking back now.
I do know of people who have chosen to be homosexual though.. From what I know, and I think someone said before, it seems to be a combination of both.. and the scientific/psychology side of research on homosexuality seems to support that.

Im starting to contemplate whether a sexuality even needs a tag of "Homo", "Hetro" or "bi", it should be a non-issue.

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I would have to agree completely! Unfortunately most people are too stuck on their own beliefs and ideas of what is 'right' to accept that other people can be different to them AND STILL HAPPY!

1. depending on the age of the child, I may explain a bit of what sexual orientation is. If very young, I would just say that people fall in love in different ways. His friend's mommy fell in love with a man, and they created him. I fell in love with a woman, and we chose to adopt him. (I like expressing the idea of adoption as something like "out of every kid we saw, we chose you.)

2. There *is* an element of choice to it, but I cannot believe that the core of a person's sexuality is chosen. A person who has the ability to be attracted to both sexes may feel as if that is perfectly natural, and he is choosing not to reject any option. He may simply not understand how uncomfortable straight and gay people are at the idea of being with (in any sense) the "wrong" sex, having never experienced the feeling that broadly.

That said, what makes a person "bisexual?" If it only entails some degree of attraction to both sexes, then most people are bisexual, and nearly all women (I believe...if you don't agree, feel free to disregard that statement. Female erotic plasticity is not the subject of this thread). But I do think that what a person *values* in their attractions is, if not an actual choice, almost certainly a result of experience and very subject to personal interpretation.
So, assume that my best friend and I have *exactly* the same core sexuality. When we look at or interact with the same person, we feel exactly the same thing. Well, I identify as gay, but I still do feel *some* attraction to certain men. I just do not attach much value to the attraction that I feel. I can't imagine ever living with a man, or even maintaining an ongoing relationship. The physical act of ....well *certain* sex acts with men do seem appealing, and some men are nice to look at. As I can't imagine *actually* having sex with somebody I wasn't in a relationship with, that superficial attraction means very little to me, so I put that all together into "not really interested in men, beyond the physical. Interested in all aspects of relationships with women. That means I'm gay."
It's entirely possible that my best friend, feeling the same thing, but being more open to the idea of causal sex, would see it as, "Like to go to bed with men sometimes, but prefer women. That means I'm bi, but lean toward women."

Brieuse said:

Bisexual people are actually held in contempt by many homosexual people.

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Lol....
I have sooo many jokes running through my head right now....

CaptainYesterday said:

Far too often i've found that straight people will label me as 'gay' while gay people will label me as 'horny' lol.

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That is just too funny!

I think the "I was born gay" concept will become a thing of the past.
Youth today just view sex different. It's becoming a matter of just being sexual with whomever you chose. Certainly many girls play with the concept, maybe more to get attention from guys. I'm older and bar days are over, but did go to a dance bar while on vacation. There were many girls dancing with each other, making out, ect..but it seemed to be to get male attention.

Once they get past the orientation debate and that is accepted and put aside, choice will become the next debate. In the next hundred years I think many people will just call themselves sexual and there will be no bounds to the sexual limits, whatever mutual adults decide will be OK.

I can see gay marriage legal soon. That will bring many constitutional debates and they will have to allow polygamy. Eventually, they will allow multiple same gender marriages, such as say..2 women and 5 men. There will be no bounds to sex in the future.

Armistead said:

I can see gay marriage legal soon. That will bring many constitutional debates and they will have to allow polygamy. Eventually, they will allow multiple same gender marriages, such as say..2 women and 5 men. There will be no bounds to sex in the future.

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I'm always amused by the statement that once same-sex marriage is allowed, *anything* else will just be inevitable.

Well, domestic partnerships and same-sex marriage have been around for almost 20 years now. Denmark was the first to allow it, in 1989.

Where is the push for legalized polygamy and all the rest?

The only country that allows both same-sex domestic partnerships and any other kind of marriage that is considered distasteful is Sweden, and there, the incestuous marriages came *first*.

Why assume that what has happened nowhere else, and what there doesn't seem to be any push for in America either, will be inevitable?

Armistead said:

Eventually, they will allow multiple same gender marriages, such as say..2 women and 5 men.

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In some cases that would be appropriate as in Robert H. Rimmer's concept of "horizontal families" (as opposed to "vertical families", those stemming from parenthood and childhood, hence, vertical as in a family tree; in horinzontal families you pick your family members from among friends and lovers). Whether it will be "marriage" or not remains to be seen. Legally, marriage is primarily concerned with disposition of property and healthcare decisions, so one could theoretically have more than one individual so designated.

There will be no bounds to sex in the future.

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There's none now among consenting adults.

I read a book once from the "Conservative Book Club" (which advertised in the National Review) which was a manifesto of sorts, detailing all these things conservatives (fiscal, social, and foreign policy) should implement should they take over. One the writer advocated was imprisoning (heterosexual) couples who cohabit without a legal marriage, i.e., "shack-up-ers, POSSLQs (a census term, "persons of opposite or same sex sharing living quarters"-see CBS News' Charles Osgood's Valentine poem "POSSLQ"----"and I'd live with you/if you would be my POSSLQ" etc. for a hilarious read). Anyhow, I read that proposal in about 1989 and decided, "well, the concept conservatives are realistic and liberals are fanciful advocates of eternal sunshine is forever debunked". The proposal was clearly a no-go. Now, the Ku Klux Klan used to beat up and tar and feather shack-up-ers but they're a shadow of their former self, essentially like civil war reenactors they reenact the racist terror of the 1865-1965 years and commit hate crimes while doing that but they have no popular support like the Klan of the 1890s and 1920s did. The idea just isn't going to happen. People can POSSLQ all they like.

Imana said:

1. If you adopted a child and he/she asks both of you why he/she has two moms or two dads, what would you say to that child?

2. Last week on my job, I was talking with a bisexual man and he said to me that he choose to be that way and that homosexuality is a choice. So if it's a choice, then how come some gays say that they are born that way???

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1. I think one of the best forms of adoption is Open Adoption. The birth mother chooses the adopted parents and part of their contract is continued presence (if the birth mother wishes, technically, she's free to disappear). I would want the birth mother involved. I would want my child to know where they come from if possible. How does a heterosexual couple explain their relationship to their children? They don't really... not until the 'what is sex' conversation comes up. Children grow up just accepting that their parents relationship is what it is... two people, sharing a bed, taking care of a family.

2. I suppose if you are truly attracted to both sexes (bisexual), then it is kind of a choice. (If you were attracted to both sexes, I imagine you HAVE to choose, since finding someone with BOTH sets of parts is pretty hard!)
I, on the other hand, was never really attracted to women. I think I convinced myself that I was in an attempt to be normal (much like one might convince oneself that he thinks NASCAR is awesome cuz all the guys his age love it). It was sham though. It was such a relief to accept that I was gay. I could stop pretending and stop torturing myself. You just know... in the same way that heterosexuals know they are attracted to the opposite sex and desire to/intend on getting intimate, both physically and emotionally.

jamielindas said:

1. I think one of the best forms of adoption is Open Adoption. The birth mother chooses the adopted parents and part of their contract is continued presence (if the birth mother wishes, technically, she's free to disappear). I would want the birth mother involved. I would want my child to know where they come from if possible. How does a heterosexual couple explain their relationship to their children? They don't really... not until the 'what is sex' conversation comes up. Children grow up just accepting that their parents relationship is what it is... two people, sharing a bed, taking care of a family.

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These days most adoptions are open adoptions and rightfully so.

I would highly recoomend Dan Savage's The Kid: How My Boyfriend and I Decided to Get Pregnant about the adoption of their son not only to LGBTs considering adoption but also to heterosexuals because he explains the process so well and those of you who are dead set against LGBTs adoption can see how wrong you are.

Imana said:

1. If you adopted a child and he/she asks both of you why he/she has two moms or two dads, what would you say to that child?

2. Last week on my job, I was talking with a bisexual man and he said to me that he choose to be that way and that homosexuality is a choice. So if it's a choice, then how come some gays say that they are born that way???

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THAT ONE PERSON YOU SUPPOSEDLY KNOW, WELL GEE THAT MUST MAKE EVERY OTHER PERSON LIKE THAT. TOO MANY GENERALIZATIONS . GAY PEOPLE ARE GAY, BLACK PEOPLE ARE BLACK, WHY IS THIS SUCH AN ISSUE. WHY DON'T WE PUT SOME ENERGY IN TO SOMETHING USEFUL LIKE FIGURING WHY THE HELL WE ARE FIGHTING WARS WHERE WE DON'T BELONG. PAYING 4.29 FOR GAS.

enzane1 said:

WHY DON'T WE PUT SOME ENERGY IN TO SOMETHING USEFUL LIKE FIGURING WHY THE HELL WE ARE FIGHTING WARS WHERE WE DON'T BELONG. PAYING 4.29 FOR GAS.

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That was great. The gay and abortion issues have been successfully used by the plutocrats and militarists to trick people into voting against themselves for a generation; now people are waking up, thinking things like that which you just said.