THE SHEPHERD OF HERMAS (1st-2nd Cent.) 2 Questions on Praying in Grief & Collective Guilt

The Shepherd of Hermas presents itself as Hermas of Rome's account of his visions of Christ in the form of a shepherd. The Muratorian Fragment (2nd to 3rd century) says that it was written "very recently" under the papacy of Pius I, the brother of Hermas, in 140-155 AD. The Catholic Encyclopedia suggests that the reference to Clement is probably a literary fiction used to portray the document as older than it really is. In the course of reading it, some questions arose for me about it. And since the text was written by a Roman Christian, I would like to please ask a few of them here on the Catholic forum.

Roberts' and Donaldson's translation can be found here: The Shepherd of Hermas (Roberts-Donaldson translation)
K. Lake's translation is here: The Apostolic Fathers
(On a sidenote, I made an earlier post asking whether the Shepherd of Hermas was a long record of real visions or an extended allegory here: What reasons are there to think that the Shepherd of Hermas was a literal vision or was fictional?)

(Question 1) What do you think about the Shepherd's claim that the prayers of sorrowful or mournful people don't go to God?
In Book II, Commandment 10, the Shepherd says that grief is good to the extent that it brings repentance:

...grief enters into the heart of the man who was irritated, and he is grieved at the deed which he did, and repents that he has wrought a wicked deed. This grief, then, appears to be accompanied by salvation, because the man, after having done a wicked deed, repented.

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But then the Shepherd tells the narrator:

Book II, Commandment 10, Chp. 3, Roberts' and Donaldson's translation:

"...every cheerful man does what is good, and minds what is good, and despises grief; but the sorrowful man always acts wickedly. First, he acts wickedly because he grieves the Holy Spirit, which was given to man a cheerful Spirit. Secondly, Grieving the Holy Spirit, he works iniquity, neither entreating the Lord nor confessing to Him. For the entreaty of the sorrowful man has no power to ascend to the altar of God."
"Why," say I, "does not the entreaty of the grieved man ascend to the altar?"
"Because," says he, "grief sits in his heart. Grief, then, mingled with his entreaty, does not permit the entreaty to ascend pure to the altar of God. For as vinegar and wine, when mixed in the same vessel, do not give the same pleasure [as wine alone gives], so grief mixed. with the Holy Spirit does not produce the same entreaty [as would be produced by the Holy Spirit alone]. Cleanse yourself from this wicked grief, and you will live to God; and all will live to God who drive away grief from them, and put on all cheerfulness."

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Lake's translation has:

"Put on, therefore, joyfulness, which always flourish in it; for every joyful man does good deeds, and has good thoughts, and despises grief.
2. But the mournful man always does wickedly. First of all he does wickedly because he grieves the Holy Spirit, which is given to man in joyfulness, and secondly he grieves the Holy Spirit by doing wickedly, not praying nor confessing to the Lord. For the intercession of the mournful man has nowhere power to ascend to the altar of God."
3. "Why," said I, "does not the intercession of the mournful man ascend to the altar ? "
" Because," said he, "grief sits in his heart. Therefore, the grief which is mixed with his intercession does not permit the intercession to ascend in purity to the altar. For just as vinegar mixed with wine has not the same agreeableness, so also grief mixed with the Holy Spirit, has not the same power of intercession.
4. Therefore purify yourself from this wicked grief, and you shall live to God, and all shall live to God who cast away from themselves grief, and put on all joyfulness."

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How about the Messianic prophecy in Isaiah 53:3: "He is despised and rejected of men; a man of maḵ-’ō-ḇō-wṯ (sorrows/griefs/pains), and acquainted with ḥō-lî (affliction/sickness/grief): and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not."
And John 11, on Jesus' mourning over Lazarus, "34. “Where have you laid him?” He asked. “Come and see, Lord,” they answered. 35. Jesus wept. 36. Then the Jews said, “See how He loved him!”
And Luke 19:41, "As Jesus approached Jerusalem and saw the city, He wept over it"?
Doesn't the claim that the sorrowful or mournful man always acts wickedly and that his prayer won't go to God contradict these verses?

(Question 2) (A) According to the Seventh Similitude (below), a punishing angel afflicted the narrator as head of his household for his household's sins, and not the other way around. (ie, the angel did not punish the narrator's children for his sins, which the Shepherd said were not so great). (B) Next, the Shepherd claims that the fully repentant are not forgiven immediately and must still be afflicted. Do these two statements by the Shepherd sound right?

In Similitude VII, the Shepherd says:

Roberts' and Donaldson's translation:
"Listen," he said: "Your sins are many, but not so great as to require that you be delivered over to this angel; but your household has committed great iniquities and sins, and the glorious angel has been incensed at them on account of their deeds; and for this reason he commanded you to be afflicted for a certain time, that they also might repent, and purify themselves from every desire of this world. When, therefore, they repent and are purified, then the angel of punishment will depart."
I said to him, "Sir, if they have done such things as to incense the glorious angel against them, yet what have I done?"
He replied, "They cannot be afflicted at all, unless you, the head of the house, be afflicted: for when you are afflicted, of necessity they also suffer affliction; but if you are in comfort, they can feel no affliction."

"Well, sir," I said, "they have repented with their whole heart."
"I know, too," he answered, "that they have repented with their whole heart: do you think, however, that the sins of those who repent are remitted? Not altogether, but he who repents must torture his own soul, and be exceedingly humble in all his conduct, and be afflicted with many kinds of affliction; and if he endure the afflictions that come upon him, He who created all things, and endued them with power, will assuredly have compassion, and will heal him; and this will He do when He sees the heart of every penitent pure from every evil thing: and it is profitable for you and for your house to suffer affliction now. But why should I say much to you? You must be afflicted, as that angel of the Lord commanded who delivered you to me. And for this give thanks to the Lord, because He has deemed you worthy of showing you beforehand this affliction, that, knowing it before it comes, you may be able to bear it with courage."
I said to him, "Sir, be thou with me, and I will be able to bear all affliction."
"I will be with you," he said, "and I will ask the angel of punishment to afflict you more lightly; nevertheless, you will be afflicted for a little time, and again you will be re-established in your house. Only continue humble, and serve the Lord in all purity of heart, you and your children, and your house, and walk in my commands which I enjoin upon you, and your repentance will be deep and pure; and if you observe these things with your household, every affliction will depart from you. And affliction," he added, "will depart from all who walk in these my commandments."

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Let's look at this more closely, using K. Lake's translation for comparison. Book III, Similitude VII begins:

1. After a few days I saw him in the same plain, where I had also seen the shepherds, and he said to me: "What more are you seeking?"
"I have come here, Sir,' said I, "in order that you may command the shepherd of punishment to depart from my house, because he afflicts me too much."
"You must be afflicted," said he, "For thus," said he, " the glorious angel enjoined concerning you. For he wishes you to be tried."
"Yes, Sir," said I, "but what have I done so wicked, that I should be handed over to this angel ? "
2. "Listen," said he, "your sins are many, but not so great as that you should be handed over
to this angel; but your family has done great iniquity and sin, and the glorious angel has become enraged at their deeds, and for this reason he commanded you to be afflicted for some time, that they also may repent and purify themselves from every lust of this world. When, therefore, they repent, and have been purified, then the angel of punishment will depart from you."
3. I said to him : "Sir, even if they have done such things that the glorious angel is enraged, what have I done ? "
"They cannot," said he, "be punished in any other way, than if you, the head of the house, be afflicted. For when you are afflicted, they also will necessarily be afflicted, but while you prosper, they cannot suffer any affliction."

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So in the passage above, the Shepherd is telling the narrator that he punished the narrator, not because of the narrator's sins, but in order to punish his household, which had greatly sinned, and thereby to bring them to repent and to purify them. The Shepherd claims that this is the only way to punish the narrator's household, because, he claims, "when you are afflicted, of necessity they also suffer affliction; but if you are in comfort, they can feel no affliction." Does this sound right?

I guess that there could be some special, extremely rare features of the narrator and his family that would make such a situation true in their case. Like maybe the narrator is the only thing in the world that his family cares about. But it seems like in a lot of families the parents could be afflicted (eg. grieve or feel more burdened) if their children are afflicted (eg. get sick). Job would be a case of this alternative situation, since God afflicted him by hurting his family.

The chapter continues:

4. " But see, Sir," said I, "they have repented with all their heart."
"I know," said he, " myself also, that they have repented with all their heart; do you then think
that the sins of those who repent are immediately forgiven? By no means; but he who repents must torture his own soul, and be humble in all his deeds and be afflicted with many divers afflictions. And if he endure the afflictions which come upon him he who 'created all things' and gave them power will have compassion in all ways upon him, and will give
him some measure of healing; 5. and this in every case when he sees that the heart of the penitent is clean from every evil deed. But it is good for you and for your house, to suffer affliction now. But why do I say much to you? you must be afflicted, even as that angel of the Lord, who handed you over to me, ordained. And give the Lord thanks for this, because he deemed you worthy to show you the affliction beforehand, that in your foreknowledge you may endure it with strength."
6. I said to him : " Sir, do you be with me, and I shall be able to endure every affliction."
"Yes," said he, "I will be with you, and I will also ask the angel of punishment to afflict you more lightly. But you shall be afflicted a little time and you shall be restored again to your house. Only continue humble and serving the Lord with a pure heart, both your children and your household, and walk in my commandments which I give you, and your repentance shall be able to be strong and pure.
7. And if you keep these commandments with your family all affliction shall depart from you. Yes," said he, "and affliction shall depart from all
who walk in these my commandments."

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So the Shepherd (Christ) knows that the family repented with all their heart, but the Shepherd (Christ) still says "you must be afflicted". And he says that those who repent are not forgiven immediately, but still must different suffer afflictions.
Does this sound right?

Lords Man said:

The Shepherd of Hermas, which I have read, is non-canonical for very good reasons. Check this out.

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Lord's Man,
Thank you for replying. One of the best reasons that it is non-canonical is that it was not written by an apostle. I don't think that even the Hermas whom Paul mentions in Romans is an apostle. I think that the text has alot of challenges, and that the article that you pointed to did a good job addressing the easy misreading of the text about Christ's own holy Spirit. Some people misread the text as Adoptionist because they think that it's referring to The Holy Spirit (third person of the Trinity) going into Christ. Let me tell you my guess in the next message about how one could answer Question 1.

Regarding Question 1 above (about the prayers of the mournful not reaching the altar in Book II, Commandment 10), the author of the Shepherd is certainly drawing from James 1 about joy while under tribulation and from Revelation 8:3 about the angel who delivers prayers from the saints to God's altar.
A reader could interpret the passage in Book II, Commandment 10 this way:
Sorrow is good when it causes a bad person to repent. A person who repents can become joyful. But the prayers of a sorrowful person do not go to the altar of God, and therefore, the person is always acting badly in two ways: his affliction afflicts the Spirit and his prayers are weak and are not received at the altar of God. At the same time, the author does not deny that God hears the prayers, or that He can respond to them.

The main weakness that I see in this passage is that the author does not reveal the basis for his assertion that the prayers of the sorrowful are not received at the altar. Like I said, I think that the author is basing his assertions on James 1, but even James does not declare these conclusions. Have a look at Psalm 51:17 (KJV): "The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit: a broken and a contrite heart, O God, thou wilt not despise." With this kind of wording, calling the broken spirit a "sacrifice", the language in the Psalm is certainly using images associated with the altar.