The Rho Chi

BT · Dec 9, 2004

Hi OBOB'ers

A few months back there was a question in the Baptist Forums about the Rho-Chi ... you know the P-X thing....

Well a couple of weeks ago I was driving around and I saw a sign outside of a church that said something to the effect of "We're not X-tians".. which (between you and I, I find that quite hilarious... considering that the "X" is the representative of "Kristos" aka "Christ"... so they're really proclaiming, in a way, "We're not Christians".. rofl)... Anyway I'm doing a little talk during the Christmas season on "Traditions,Symbology,Christmas past-present-future" kinda thing and I'll like to do a little bit of an illustration on this.. but what I'm hoping you folks can help me with is the actual background of the "P-X"... so that I don't have to do too much homework on it... yes,yes.. I = lazy.

So is there a history buff around that can give me the quick and easy on Rho-Chi?

Plz and thanks

Michelina · Dec 9, 2004

Hi, BT!

It's called the Chi-Rho.

It's the first two letters of the word Christos, X = chi, P = rho.

BT · Dec 9, 2004

Ah right Chi-Rho.. I had it backwards. Thanks! Any idea where it came from (I mean to be used.... etc.). When they started using it... for what.. etc?

bigsierra · Dec 9, 2004

Hi BT Welcome to OBOB

Hmmm, It must have been that Chi-Rho discussion I read. I never knew what it was till then. I had seen it in huge letters on the outside of a Presbyterian church here.

bigsierra · Dec 9, 2004

BT said:
Ah right Chi-Rho.. I had it backwards. Thanks! Any idea where it came from (I mean to be used.... etc.). When they started using it... for what.. etc?

I bet you could find a Mod that would be willing to swap it around for you, in the title.

Michelina · Dec 9, 2004

BT said:
Ah right Chi-Rho.. I had it backwards. Thanks! Any idea where it came from (I mean to be used.... etc.). When they started using it... for what.. etc?

Here ya go, BT:

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08717c.htm

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05248a.htm

This is a great source of info:

http://www.newadvent.org/

Michelina · Dec 9, 2004

bigsierra said:
I bet you could find a Mod that would be willing to swap it around for you, in the title.

I was going to offer, Scott, but then I remembered that BT is a Moderator.

bigsierra · Dec 9, 2004

I had you in mind when I posted that. After posting saw that he was a mod and thought it was funny that he didn't even have to go as far as I had initially presumed.

faerieevaH · Dec 10, 2004

BTW... Chiro (comming from Chi Rho) is the name of the biggest youthmovement in Belgium. It started out as the Catholic alternative to the Scouts. Unfortunately by now therer's nothing Catholic and only a vague faraway idea of christianity somewhere involved in the 'morals', but at the time of my parents, the group was one of the greatest forming helps for Catholic Youth. Many good Catholic marriages were made when once every so often girl groups and boy groups had an activity together, but most of it the group used to be about preparing youth for a good, catholic life.

ps139 · Dec 10, 2004

Just because I've never been much of a "link follower"

<H1>Labarum (Chi-Rho)

Click to expand...

Labarum is the name by which the military standard adopted by Constantine the Great after his celebrated vision (Lactantius, "De mortibus persecutorum", 44), was known in antiquity. The original labarum, designed under the emperor's direction on the day subsequent to the appearance of the "cross of light", is described by Eusebius (Vita Constant., I:26) as "a long spear, overlaid with gold", which with a transverse bar formed the figure of a cross. "On the top of the whole was fixed a wreath of gold and precious stones, and within this the symbol of the Saviour's name, two letters indicating the name of Christ by means of the initial letters, the letter X intersection P at the centre." These two letters formed what is known as the monogram of Constantine, so called -- not because it was the invention of this emperor, for it had been a familiar Christian symbol prior to his conversion -- but because of the great popularity it enjoyed from the date of its appearance on the imperial standards.

From the cross-bar of the spear, was suspended a purple banner with the Greek inscription TOUTO NIKA -- i. e. conquer by this (sign), usually rendered in Latin "In hoc signo vinces" (in this sign thou shalt conquer). This banner, square in form, covered with a rich embroidery of precious stones, and "being also richly interlaced with gold, presented an indescribable degree of beauty to the beholder". The part of the staff immediately above the embroidered banner was adorned with medallions of the emperor and his children. Fifty soldiers of the imperial guard, distinguished for bravery and piety, were entrusted with the care and defense of the new sacred standard (Vita Constant., II:8).

Standards, similar to the original labarum in its essential features were supplied to all the legions, and the monogram was also engraved on the soldiers' shields. An idea of some of the deviations in form of the standards furnished to different divisions of the army may be obtained from several coins of Constantine's reign still preserved. On one coin, for instance, the portrait of the emperor and his sons are represented on the banner instead of on the staff; on a second the banner is inscribed with the monogram and surmounted by the equal-armed cross, while the royal portraits, though on the shaft, are below instead of above the banner. In form, the labarum of Constantine was an adaptation of the already existing cavalry standard of the Roman army; the pagan emblems were merely replaced by Christian symbols. The term labarum, which is of uncertain derivation, was probably familiar in the Roman army from the reign of Hadrian.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08717c.htm</H1>

BT · Dec 10, 2004

Thanks for printing that out ps139. I followed the links, there is a lot of information in there.

Particularily this portion caught my attention, "it had been a familiar Christian symbol prior to his conversion -- " This may after all be one of those things whose origin is lost in the ages. I mean if it was familiar prior to Constantine...who used it first.. where did it come from.. why was it used.. etc?

As another question in the conversation how's about "XMAS"... anyone know the history of this term (which is really what I'm digging for). When did people start to use "XMAS" as opposed to "Christmas" and why... this seems to be a fascinating trail to follow..

ps139 · Dec 10, 2004

BT said:
Thanks for printing that out ps139. I followed the links, there is a lot of information in there.

No problem BT! Yes there is TONS of info there!

Particularily this portion caught my attention, "it had been a familiar Christian symbol prior to his conversion -- " This may after all be one of those things whose origin is lost in the ages. I mean if it was familiar prior to Constantine...who used it first.. where did it come from.. why was it used.. etc?

Well, mind you, this is just a guess, but I suspect it comes from the times when the Church was persecuted. We know that when Christians would meet, they would draw the symbol of a fish - thats how they could recognize each other. It seems that there was probably more than one recognizable Christian symbol, and the "XP", being the first two letters of "Christos" in Greek, seems like a strong candidate for another symbol among Christians.

As another question in the conversation how's about "XMAS"... anyone know the history of this term (which is really what I'm digging for). When did people start to use "XMAS" as opposed to "Christmas" and why... this seems to be a fascinating trail to follow..

I think this is probably a more recent development. The word "Christmas" is not derived from the Latin word, but like the word "Easter," its probably Germanic in origin, meaning that it probably originated after the Germanic tribes were converted, which would be a few hundred years after the persecutions.

The abbreviation "Xmas" I suspect is relatively recent, and probably secular in nature. For people who have a hard time saying the word "Jesus," they might also not like to write the word "Christ," and perhaps the "X" is prounounced sort of like "cross" which sounds like 'Christ.'? This is just a guess.
But I think it probably developed in writing rather than in speech.

The Rho Chi

BT

Fanatic

More options

Michelina

.

More options

BT

Fanatic

More options

bigsierra

Contributor

More options

bigsierra

Contributor

More options

Michelina

.

More options

Michelina

.

More options

bigsierra

Contributor

More options

faerieevaH

lucky wife

More options

ps139

Ab omni malo, libera nos, Domine!

More options

BT

Fanatic

More options

ps139

Ab omni malo, libera nos, Domine!

More options

Similar threads

The Rho Chi

Fanatic

.

Fanatic

Contributor

Contributor

.

.

Contributor

lucky wife

Ab omni malo, libera nos, Domine!

Fanatic

Ab omni malo, libera nos, Domine!

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency