The original sin

Cabbages · Feb 28, 2006

In the United States, 80% of the population is Christian- down from 90% in 1990. In our courts we swear on a Bible, our currency reads 'In God We Trust' and schoolchildren pledge their allegiance 'under God' every morning.

Italy is 87% Christian, Spain is 94% Christian, and France is estimated to be 88% Christian.

I think these can be considered Christian countries, even though they are not theocracies.

Eudaimonist · Feb 28, 2006

S Walch said:
But coming from England - it is most certainly NOT a Christian Nation.

In what sense? Do you mean culturally? See Cabbages's post above.

LightOfEyes · Feb 28, 2006

Cabbages said:
In the United States, 80% of the population is Christian- down from 90% in 1990. In our courts we swear on a Bible, our currency reads 'In God We Trust' and schoolchildren pledge their allegiance 'under God' every morning.

Italy is 87% Christian, Spain is 94% Christian, and France is estimated to be 88% Christian.

I think these can be considered Christian countries, even though they are not theocracies.

Beside that, what is happening nowadays prove that there are religions conflict. They attack Muslims everywhere, Iraq, Palestine, Afghanistan and recently the offended drawings. And they kill Muslims because they are Muslims.

I heard that one of big countrys leader is religious, may after finish his prayer he will give his command to kill Muslims. And one time he said that God command him to occupy the countries. lol.

Peace.

elijah115 · Feb 28, 2006

I'm struggling to understand how you form your views. If bin laden hadnt attacked the US, the US wouldn't have invaded Afganistian. If Afganistan had kicked out bin laden, the US wouldn't have invaded Afganistan. I could go on. Do you lock yourself in the room, smoke weed and get paranoid about the West? Nobody is plotting against Islam.

S Walch · Feb 28, 2006

Cabbages said:
In the United States, 80% of the population is Christian- down from 90% in 1990. In our courts we swear on a Bible, our currency reads 'In God We Trust' and schoolchildren pledge their allegiance 'under God' every morning.

Italy is 87% Christian, Spain is 94% Christian, and France is estimated to be 88% Christian.

I think these can be considered Christian countries, even though they are not theocracies.

Some fantastic made up statistics there.

Proof?

I also don't see any of those countries locking up people and telling tem they wont be released until they convert back to Christianity, do you?

How do people actually define a "Christian Nation"?

In what sense? Do you mean culturally?

I mean as in, the country promotes Christian values and that yes, the culture is of a "christian" nature.

Which to be honest, England is neither of them things. I see what happens around me every day, and the culture of this country, and the countries government, are hardly Christian in appearance or nature.

As is most, if not all, of Europe.

Eudaimonist · Feb 28, 2006

S Walch said:
Some fantastic made up statistics there.

And the real statistics are... ?

Eudaimonist · Feb 28, 2006

S Walch said:
Some fantastic made up statistics there.

Proof?

Just a little digging gets similar values. Altapedia seems to be an unbiased encyclopedia-like source.

http://www.atlapedia.com/online/countries/italy.htm

Italy is said to be made up of "mostly Christians with 83% of the population Roman Catholic while there are also Protestant minorities."

http://www.atlapedia.com/online/countries/spain.htm

Spain: "Mostly Christians with 97% of the population Roman Catholic while less than 1% are Protestant."

http://www.atlapedia.com/online/countries/france.htm

France: "Mostly Christians with around 76% of the population Roman Catholic while other Christian denominations account for 4% and Muslims account for 3% of the population."

http://www.atlapedia.com/online/countries/unitedst.htm

USA: "Mostly Christians with 53% of the population Protestant while 26% are Roman Catholic and 8% are other denominations. Other religious minorities include Jews which account for 2% and Muslims for 2% of the population."

Cabbages · Feb 28, 2006

I found all my numbers on Wikipedia.

I think a nation can be considered Christian when the majority of the people identify as Christians, and the government and society is heavily influenced by or based on Christianity. I believe this to be true of at least the United States; whenever I sneeze I am met with a round of 'God Bless You's.

yaqovzadeek · Feb 28, 2006

elijah115 said:
I'm struggling to understand how you form your views. If bin laden hadnt attacked the US, the US wouldn't have invaded Afganistian. If Afganistan had kicked out bin laden, the US wouldn't have invaded Afganistan. I could go on. Do you lock yourself in the room, smoke weed and get paranoid about the West? Nobody is plotting against Islam.

Wrong as usual, Long before, September 11, the white house had Planned on attacking Afghanistan and Iraq.So this issue of blaming it all on bin Laden is bull.He did what he did but the born again lunatic who claims GOD Speaks to him had planned the Killing of muslims way before sept 11. His daddy was already doing it In Iraq with the sanctions killing Millions of children.
So you are the one who is paranoid.May be you like the cover up stories that it was all muslims.
You and many others in ther west need to wake up
Peace
Yaqovzadeek
aka James the Just

NOTW · Feb 28, 2006

LightOfEyes said:
Christianity accuses me of being guilty of an alleged sin which I have nothing to do with.. why are we being punished for Adam's sin? After all, he ate the forbidden fruit, we didn't. It's his problem, not ours, especially in

light of Deut. 24:16, which says children shall not be punished for the sins of their fathers.

and It makes God look so helpless and blood thirsty because He could not forgive Adam & Eve and required the torture humiliation of himself to forgive them ??!! in other words He killed himself to please himself!

Emphasis mine.

No! Christianity does not accuse anyone of being guilty of an alleged sin, but you are the one in denial that you are a fallible human being.
Can you tell me right now that you have not committed ONE sin against God/Allah in your whole entire life?
Exactly, the "original sin", although it directly refers to Adam and Eve's mistake, it's refering more to the fact that we, human beings, make mistakes ALL the time.

And that's why we needed salvation, not by anyone, but by the one and only who is without any sin erase our sins, and He did.

NOTW · Feb 28, 2006

yaqovzadeek said:
Wrong as usual, Long before, September 11, the white house had Planned on attacking Afghanistan and Iraq.So this issue of blaming it all on bin Laden is bull.He did what he did but the born again lunatic who claims GOD Speaks to him had oplanned thew Killing of muslims way before.

yaqovzadeek said:
So you are the one who is paranoid.May be you like the cover up stories that it was all muslims.
You and many others in ther west need to wake up
Peace
Yaqovzadeek
aka James the Just

Before 9/11, White House had planned on invading Iraq and Afghanistan?

Guess who's wrong as usual?
Bush never mentioned Iraq in one speach before the 9/11 incident. Right after the incident, he claimed that the terrorists who were involved in the hijacking of the 3 commercial planes, and 1 private jet, (especially Muhammed Atta) were related to Taliban & somewhat had a connection with the Iraqi government.
And then, Bush, with the false information by the intelligence agencies, claimed that Iraq had WMD and threatened Saddam Hussein that if he didn't give up these weapons, he would get an approval from the UN to invade Iraq and remove him from his power, and obviously that's what had happened.

As for Afghanistan, it's been controlled by US forces just because that is where Taliban is located.

Nice story though, I liked how the White House pre-planned the whole Iraqi invasion before 9/11 (someone needs to read more newspapers!)

LightOfEyes · Mar 1, 2006

NOTW said:
Guess who's wrong as usual?
Bush never mentioned Iraq in one speach before the 9/11 incident.

This is not true. Iraq mentioned since 1991, and before that, because its power growing up they were worried about Israel from Iraq.

Peace.

yaqovzadeek · Mar 1, 2006

NOTW said:
Before 9/11, White House had planned on invading Iraq and Afghanistan?

Guess who's wrong as usual?
Bush never mentioned Iraq in one speach before the 9/11 incident. Right after the incident, he claimed that the terrorists who were involved in the hijacking of the 3 commercial planes, and 1 private jet, (especially Muhammed Atta) were related to Taliban & somewhat had a connection with the Iraqi government.
And then, Bush, with the false information by the intelligence agencies, claimed that Iraq had WMD and threatened Saddam Hussein that if he didn't give up these weapons, he would get an approval from the UN to invade Iraq and remove him from his power, and obviously that's what had happened.

As for Afghanistan, it's been controlled by US forces just because that is where Taliban is located.

Nice story though, I liked how the White House pre-planned the whole Iraqi invasion before 9/11 (someone needs to read more newspapers!)

Not because he did not publicly mention it that mean he did not have it on his mind.Those who worked with him have said on film that he planned Iraq and Afghanistan way before 911.I myself have watched interviews of Ex whitehouse staff who have spoken out.Now for you to beleive that will be Anti American, anti patriotic no matter how true it is.Your national TV will never show these truths now will they.
Peace
Yaqovzadeek
aka James the Just

yaqovzadeek · Mar 1, 2006

NOTW said:
Before 9/11, White House had planned on invading Iraq and Afghanistan?

Guess who's wrong as usual?
Bush never mentioned Iraq in one speach before the 9/11 incident. Right after the incident, he claimed that the terrorists who were involved in the hijacking of the 3 commercial planes, and 1 private jet, (especially Muhammed Atta) were related to Taliban & somewhat had a connection with the Iraqi government.
And then, Bush, with the false information by the intelligence agencies, claimed that Iraq had WMD and threatened Saddam Hussein that if he didn't give up these weapons, he would get an approval from the UN to invade Iraq and remove him from his power, and obviously that's what had happened.

As for Afghanistan, it's been controlled by US forces just because that is where Taliban is located.

Nice story though, I liked how the White House pre-planned the whole Iraqi invasion before 9/11 (someone needs to read more newspapers!)

On June 26, 2001, News Insight/India Reacts, an Indian public affairs magazine, wrote:

"India and Iran will "facilitate" US and Russian plans for "limited military action" against the Taliban if the contemplated tough new economic sanctions don't bend Afghanistan's fundamentalist regime. Indian officials say that India and Iran will only play the role of "facilitator" while the US and Russia will combat the Taliban from the front with the help of two Central Asian countries, Tajikistan and Uzbekistan, to push Taliban lines back to the 1998 position 50 km away from Mazar-e-Sharief city in northern Afghanistan. Military action will be the last option though it now seems scarcely avoidable with the UN banned from Taliban-controlled areas

So as you can see plans were made way in advance , shame the American people do not know that ormay be they do not want to know it.They want to carry on blaming Muslims for everything.
peace
Yaqovzadeek
aka James the Just

Fares · Mar 1, 2006

Never mind . lol

Exegete12 · Mar 1, 2006

What's the OP here?
I thought it was original sin. Guys settle down and stay on topic. Bro Fares, stop being baited.

And who cares about original sin. Let's focus on Jesus who was without sin. No miracle of Christ equals the miracle of His sinless life.

To be holy in all thought and feeling; never to fail in duty to others, never to transgress the law of perfect love to God or man, never to exceed or to come short – this outstrips the power of imagination and almost of belief.

With sin came death. It is becaue Jesus the Man has risen from the grave and passed to a transcendent life with God that we too may triumph in prospect over death.

Christian's faith is blessed on the integrity of Jesus Christ and the immortality that HE has won for us.

We believe Jesus died and rose again. On that we rest our faith.

Fares · Mar 1, 2006

OldShepherd · Mar 1, 2006

[SIZE=+1]*Mod Hat

On!*

Thread closed for review. Personal attacks and flaming. Making accusations against governments, heads of state, and religions without verifiable evidence.

"I saw it on the telly." or "I heard it on the radio." is NOT evidence.
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