The No true Scotsman Fallacy

seekingsolace · May 21, 2015

Red Fox said:
My seven year old daughter could understand it, so I don't know why you're having a hard time with it.

I imagine shes more mature as well.

seekingsolace · May 21, 2015

bhsmte said:
Maybe you are missing a bit of the context.

If Hetta agreed with my statement, she agreed with the fact that there will always be a group of Christians out there, that will tell you your belief is wrong.

Now, whether Hetta feels she believes wrongly, would likely be up to Hetta to decide, not those who claim she is wrong.

Would the statement also be true that there will always be a group of non-Christians out there, that will tell you your belief is wrong?

bhsmte · May 21, 2015

seekingsolace said:
Yes, the trinity of Me, Myself & I.

And maybe a billion or so more.

bhsmte · May 21, 2015

seekingsolace said:
Would the statement also be true that there will always be a group of non-Christians out there, that will tell you your belief is wrong?

I am quite certain, there will be Hindus, Muslims, other religions and non believers willing to give an opinion a certain person's belief is wrong, since the mentioned groups believe their belief (or lack of belief) is correct.

With myself, I don't care so much what a person believes, as I have already stated religious beliefs could very well be the right thing for a person. What I am most interested about, is how each person justifies their beliefs and how this impacts their view of the world, how they judge those who disagree with them and how their professed belief matches with the behaviors they display.

Hammster · May 21, 2015

Is it wrong to tell someone that they are wrong?

bhsmte · May 21, 2015

Hammster said:
Hence, my question.

Which I believe she answered.

Do you think a person who has a faith belief, believes in something they know to be wrong?

Hammster · May 21, 2015

bhsmte said:
Which I believe she answered.

Do you think a person who has a faith belief, believes in something they know to be wrong?

I don't think she answered. But okay.

And no.

seekingsolace · May 21, 2015

bhsmte said:
With myself, I don't care so much what a person believes, as I have already stated religious beliefs could very well be the right thing for a person. What I am most interested about, is how each person justifies their beliefs and how this impacts their view of the world, how they judge those who disagree with them and how their professed belief matches with the behaviors they display.

Is this not an individual problem. Asserting I am a vegetarian then eating a rare steak gives questionable doubt. What if I eat packaged foods which contain meat derived ingredients? Is every person not human? Your last statement, is the same used for both sides.

Hetta · May 21, 2015

Hammster said:
Let's me set the context since it seems to be missed.

You agreed that everyone believes wrongly. Do you believe wrongly?

According to others, I do.

Hammster · May 21, 2015

Hetta said:
According to others, I do.

Are they correct?

Hetta · May 21, 2015

seekingsolace said:
Well your faith is 'Christian-seeker'.

As I was told earlier in this thread, all that icon means is that I do not currently have a church, but I am nonetheless a Christian. If they had an icon for "loves-Christ-but-is-leaning-more-towards-other-faiths-that-are-all-inclusive-and-loving-because-of-hatred-towards-others-shown-by-many-Christians" then I would adopt that icon, but sadly there is no such icon.

bhsmte · May 21, 2015

Hammster said:
Is it wrong to tell someone that they are wrong?

Depends on how this is accomplished and in what context.

I have no problem with one religious person telling another they have the wrong faith belief. As long as that person is aware enough to realize, that the other person may indeed feel just as strongly about their belief as you do yours. People get to a point of having a faith belief over time and for a variety of reasons which are specific to their own psyche, They don't just flip a switch and form a belief.

I also think it is quite healthy when people can admit they could be wrong, but you don't see this a lot with people of certain faith beliefs, because acknowledging the same, would create too much inner turmoil and that is not an option they can acknowledge to themselves.

Hetta · May 21, 2015

Hammster said:
Are they correct?

Not in my opinion. But it counts for little.

Woah, that sounds like a pity party - I mean that according to the vast majority of Christians here it counts for little, lol. I really don't break my heart over such things.

bhsmte · May 21, 2015

seekingsolace said:
Is this not an individual problem. Asserting I am a vegetarian then eating a rare steak gives questionable doubt. What if I eat packaged foods which contain meat derived ingredients? Is every person not human? Your last statement, is the same used for both sides.

You seem big on analogies today.

A vegetarian eating a steak is pretty black and white and I do acknowledge, some gravitate towards black and white thinking.

Now, faith beliefs and how they are formed and how they can be objectively verified as correct, are anything but black and white and loaded with personal interpretation and a whole bunch of grey.

Hetta · May 21, 2015

I have to say that from reading and posting here for a few years (2 maybe) I have started to question a lot of things, and that has been good for me.

seekingsolace · May 21, 2015

Hetta said:
As I was told earlier in this thread, all that icon means is that I do not currently have a church, but I am nonetheless a Christian. If they had an icon for "loves-Christ-but-is-leaning-more-towards-other-faiths-that-are-all-inclusive-and-loving-because-of-hatred-towards-others-shown-by-many-Christians" then I would adopt that icon, but sadly there is no such icon.

I'm confused, Christ was the enemy for our sake, why would let individuals deter you from what you feel is truth?
The internet will always be plagued with such things, it's difficult to express an opinion fully in words. Do not let a forum be your estimate to what the true body of Christ is, this is a very personal relationship.

seekingsolace · May 21, 2015

bhsmte said:
You seem big on analogies today.

A vegetarian eating a steak is pretty black and white and I do acknowledge, some gravitate towards black and white thinking.

Now, faith beliefs and how they are formed and how they can be objectively verified as correct, are anything but black and white and loaded with personal interpretation and a whole bunch of grey.

Sometimes it's refreshing to use them. It helps to express that matters really are not simple.

Hetta · May 21, 2015

seekingsolace said:
I'm confused, Christ was the enemy for our sake, why would let individuals deter you from what you feel is truth?
The internet will always be plagued with such things, it's difficult to express an opinion fully in words. Do not let a forum be your estimate to what the true body of Christ is, this is a very personal relationship.

How can the body of Christ be a "personal relationship." A "body" of anything is a multiplicity. I have had similar experiences in many churches. That is why I am no longer a church member.

seekingsolace · May 21, 2015

Hetta said:
How can the body of Christ be a "personal relationship." A "body" of anything is a multiplicity. I have had similar experiences in many churches. That is why I am no longer a church member.

Who places you in that body?

You shouldn't brand all churches the same.

Hetta · May 21, 2015

If I don't respond to posts it's because I have other things to do than post on a forum. It's also fine for people to answer posts addressed to other people. To my knowledge, that's not a rules violation.

The No true Scotsman Fallacy

Bah

Bah

Newbie

Newbie

Carpe Chaos

Newbie

Carpe Chaos

Bah

I'll find my way home

Carpe Chaos

I'll find my way home

Newbie

I'll find my way home

Newbie

I'll find my way home

Bah

Bah

I'll find my way home

Bah

I'll find my way home

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