The New and Improved No-Straw-Man Challenge

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
Yes, after God said

“Behold, all that he has is in your power, only do not put forth your hand on him.”

No.....

Order of events with Revelation from Job 2 in mind...

Satan tells God... "“From roaming through the earth,” Satan answered Him, “and walking around on it.”

God Responds... (God knows that Satan is looking to rend Job) Have you seen Blameless Job

Satan gave a falsified legal case to God, via his position of Authority.

Job 2 Verifies this.

Question Time... What does God say about people that plot against the innocent?

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
Yes, after God said

“Behold, all that he has is in your power, only do not put forth your hand on him.”

Proverbs 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

Satan isn't God's hand puppet, demonstrating God's power. God isn't selling Job out. God is reading Satan's heart. He knows that Satan is ticking all of these check boxes, from above.

God GAVE HIS POWER to a Creation. Look again. This proves that God does not Constantly apply Power.

Job was innocent. God is Testing Satan, NOT Job.

In fact, we could make this a legal case. God gives authority to Satan, to act on Satan's indictment of Job. When God says; " even though you incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause." .... This means by the idea that Job, WHO God declared Blameless, being attacked... was An act of Satan, apart from God's Will.

Hebrew word for Hate isn't actually "Hate"... It is Sane, Click to link to explanation

Hammster · May 15, 2024

Grip Docility said:
No.....

Order of events with Revelation from Job 2 in mind...

Satan tells God... "“From roaming through the earth,” Satan answered Him, “and walking around on it.”

God Responds... (God knows that Satan is looking to rend Job) Have you seen Blameless Job

Satan gave a falsified legal case to God, via his position of Authority.

Job 2 Verifies this.

Question Time... What does God say about people that plot against the innocent?

That’s one war to twist it. I’ll stick with the plain reading.

Hammster · May 15, 2024

Grip Docility said:
Genesis 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

Satan isn't God's hand puppet, demonstrating God's power. God isn't selling Job out. God is reading Satan's heart. He knows that Satan is ticking all of these check boxes, from above.

God GAVE HIS POWER to a Creation. Look again. This proves that God does not CONSTANTLY apply POWER.

Job was innocent. God is TESTING SATAN, NOT Job.

Okie dokie.

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
That’s one war to twist it. I’ll stick with the plain reading.

No, its not. Does God attack innocent people?

If Job is read that God Attacked Job, by Satan, via Proxy... The person reading Job and believing that is indicting God of These exact things...

Proverbs 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

Hebrew word for Hate isn't actually "Hate"... It is Sane, Click to link to explanation

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
Okie dokie.

Satan isn't God's Proxy. Do you understand this? Satan is guilty of THESE things. This is about Satan first and foremost.

Proverbs 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

Hebrew word for Hate isn't actually "Hate"... It is Sane, Click to link to explaination

Hammster · May 15, 2024

Grip Docility said:
No, its not. Does God attack innocent people?

If Job is read that God Attacked Job, by Satan, via Proxy... The person reading Job and believing that is indicting God of These exact things...

Proverbs 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

“Simon, Simon, behold, Satan has demanded permission to sift you like wheat; but I have prayed for you, that your faith may not fail; and you, when once you have turned again, strengthen your brothers.”
— Luke 22:31-32

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
Okie dokie.

Direct Quotes from Job: "This man was blameless and upright; he feared God and shunned evil. "

God says, from His own Mouth: "he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.”

If God were having Job attacked as you are asserting, God is now Attacking Job, via Satan as a Proxy. God declared Job blameless. God knew Job was Blameless.

God HATES when people Attack innocent people. I can quote it again. Does God Hate what God does?

Proverbs 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

Hebrew word for Hate isn't actually "Hate"... It is Sane, Click to link to explaination

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
“Simon, Simon, behold, Satan has demanded permission to sift you like wheat; but I have prayed for you, that your faith may not fail; and you, when once you have turned again, strengthen your brothers.”
— Luke 22:31-32

Satan was still in Power, there. This proofs my assertion.

Hammster · May 15, 2024

Grip Docility said:
Satan was still in Power, there. This proofs my assertion.

Those in power don’t demand permission.

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
Those in power don’t ask for permission.

God has supreme authority. God doesn't Micro Manage. God knew Satan's heart and was Testing, Satan. Otherwise, you are indicting God of this:

Proverbs 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: 1:haughty eyes, 2:a lying tongue, and 3: hands that shed innocent blood, 4: a heart that devises wicked plans, 5: feet that make haste to run to evil, 6: a false witness who breathes out lies, 7: and one who sows discord among brothers.

Is God now so petty that He would Create an Agent of Evil, then "Blame" the Agent of Evil, For what was His Plan?

Read Proverbs, please, that I posted. You are a logical person. Read it and ask yourself if God is guilty of those things. Then, ask yourself if a mob boss that hires a hit is guilty of the hit. This is super important.

Hebrew word for Hate isn't actually "Hate"... It is Sane, Click to link to explanation

Hammster · May 15, 2024

Grip Docility said:
God has supreme authority. God doesn't Micro Manage. God knew Satan's heart and was Testing, Satan. Otherwise, you are indicting God of this:

Proverbs 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: 1:haughty eyes, 2:a lying tongue, and 3: hands that shed innocent blood, 4: a heart that devises wicked plans, 5: feet that make haste to run to evil, 6: a false witness who breathes out lies, 7: and one who sows discord among brothers.

Is God now so petty that He would Create an Agent of Evil, then "Blame" the Agent of Evil, For what was His Plan?

Read Proverbs, please, that I posted. You are a logical person. Read it and ask yourself if God is guilty of those things. Then, ask yourself if a mob boss that hires a hit is guilty of the hit. This is super important.

Not only did God give Satan permission to test Job, He gave him greater permission later when his first attempt failed.

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Proverbs 6:16-19 There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.

1: Haughty Eyes - Have you seen my servant Job who is BLAMELESS (Job NEVER believes that God is responsible for the Evil that Occurs)
2: A Lying Tounge - even though you incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
3: Hands that shed innocent Blood - 18 While he was still speaking, yet another messenger came and said, “Your sons and daughters were feasting and drinking wine at the oldest brother’s house, 19 when suddenly a mighty wind swept in from the desert and struck the four corners of the house. It collapsed on them and they are dead, and I am the only one who has escaped to tell you!”
4: A Heart that Devises Wicked Plans: incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
5: Feet that make haste to run to evil: Then Satan went out from the presence of the Lord.
6: A false witness who breaths out lies : incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
7: One who Sews Discord among brothers: Satan caused this: 9 His wife said to him, “Are you still maintaining your integrity? Curse God and die!”

Hebrew word for Hate isn't actually "Hate"... It is Sane, Click to link to explanation

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
Not only did God give Satan permission to test Job, He gave him greater permission later when his first attempt failed.

So, do you say that God did this through Satan, as a Proxy?

1: Haughty Eyes - Have you seen my servant Job who is BLAMELESS (Job NEVER believes that God is responsible for the Evil that Occurs)
2: A Lying Tounge - even though you incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
3: Hands that shed innocent Blood - 18 While he was still speaking, yet another messenger came and said, “Your sons and daughters were feasting and drinking wine at the oldest brother’s house, 19 when suddenly a mighty wind swept in from the desert and struck the four corners of the house. It collapsed on them and they are dead, and I am the only one who has escaped to tell you!”
4: A Heart that Devises Wicked Plans: Have YOU seen MY servant Job? incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
5: Feet that make haste to run to evil: Then Satan went out from the presence of the Lord.
6: A false witness who breaths out lies : incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
7: One who Sews Discord among brothers: Satan caused this: 9 His wife said to him, “Are you still maintaining your integrity? Curse God and die!”

Hebrew word for Hate isn't actually "Hate"... It is Sane, Click to link to explanation

Hammster · May 15, 2024

Grip Docility said:
So, do you say that God did this through Satan, as a Proxy?

1: Haughty Eyes - Have you seen my servant Job who is BLAMELESS (Job NEVER believes that God is responsible for the Evil that Occurs)
2: A Lying Tounge - even though you incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
3: Hands that shed innocent Blood - 18 While he was still speaking, yet another messenger came and said, “Your sons and daughters were feasting and drinking wine at the oldest brother’s house, 19 when suddenly a mighty wind swept in from the desert and struck the four corners of the house. It collapsed on them and they are dead, and I am the only one who has escaped to tell you!”
4: A Heart that Devises Wicked Plans: Have YOU seen MY servant Job? incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
5: Feet that make haste to run to evil: Then Satan went out from the presence of the Lord.
6: A false witness who breaths out lies : incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause
7: One who Sews Discord among brothers: Satan caused this: 9 His wife said to him, “Are you still maintaining your integrity? Curse God and die!”

And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.
— Job 1:12

While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, Thy sons and thy daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother’s house: And, behold, there came a great wind from the wilderness, and smote the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.
— Job 1:18-19

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.
— Job 1:12

While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, Thy sons and thy daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother’s house: And, behold, there came a great wind from the wilderness, and smote the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.
— Job 1:18-19

No! Why Does God say this? "even though you incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause"

Hammster · May 15, 2024

Grip Docility said:
No! Why Does God say this? "even though you incited Me against him, to destroy him without just cause"

No? I posted the actual scripture.

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.
— Job 1:12

While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, Thy sons and thy daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother’s house: And, behold, there came a great wind from the wilderness, and smote the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.
— Job 1:18-19

SATAN is the MICROMANAGER that DEMANDs Worship and PERPETUAL application of Authority.

God indicts the Pharisees as Son's of the Devil for these very things.

Grip Docility · May 15, 2024

Hammster said:
No? I posted the actual scripture.

The scripture isn't being contextually grasped, which happens to all of us. It's okay. But, it is not being understood.

Hammster · May 15, 2024

Grip Docility said:
SATAN is the MICROMANAGER that DEMANDs Worship and PERPETUAL application of Authority.

God indicts the Pharisees as Son's of the Devil for these very things.

I agree.

The New and Improved No-Straw-Man Challenge

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Carpe Chaos

Carpe Chaos

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Carpe Chaos

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Carpe Chaos

Well-Known Member

Carpe Chaos

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Carpe Chaos

Well-Known Member

Carpe Chaos

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Carpe Chaos

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency