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It's really this simple:LOL. Yeah. Sure.
It's really this simple:
God works in mysterious ways.
Sorry, I guess my point was misunderstandable: I´m a bit reluctant to accept someone as an authority just because they have declared themselves such. IOW, your approach to this appears to be a bit too circular, for my taste.Who do you suggest he appoints?
Yeah, funny."Hello Mr Trump, I hear you are getting a bit tired of being President of the USA.
Perhaps you would like to try your hand as Lord of The Universe instead?"
I am always a bit disappointed when a long and complicated explanation turns out to come down to "it´s a mystery". I mean, that´s the very opposite of an explanation, and you could say that upfront - because the rest is just redundant.It's really this simple:
God works in mysterious ways.
You can't figure that out for yourself?I am always a bit disappointed when a long and complicated explanation turns out to come down to "it´s a mystery". I mean, that´s the very opposite of an explanation, and you could say that upfront - because the rest is just redundant.
Free will, as much as anything else, is a way of giving expression to the fact that we are not subjectively aware of anything causing us to choose one way, rather than another.
Given the causal nature of physical laws, at a macroscopic level, a completely autonomous will is already a problematic idea, even before you get into theology.
I do can figure out that your explanations regarding the so-called supernatural will at some point come down to "it´s a mystery". That´s why I don´t pay much attention to those longwinded pretenses of explanations.You can't figure that out for yourself?
I think there´s a huge difference between "I don´t know how it works" and "I know how it works [drum roll]: it works in mysterious ways.".With all that science in your head, and you still have questions ... and you can't figure out ahead of time that it's because God works in mysterious (non-scientific) ways?
....... but I also realize that many believers are incapable of dealing with any conceptions of God outside of their carefully crafted variant. And I suppose that is fine.
I agree.
The thing is though, the theology isn't really ambigous concerning the claims about free will existing, within that context.
The contradiction in terms I am pointing to, is a contradiction that exists within the theology itself.
Theology doesn't call "free will" problematic. It doesn't say that it might not actually exist.
It says that it exists, period. In the same universe as pre-ordained events.
None that you recognize.
As I pointed out: whether God exists or not, you've seemed to convince yourself you have no free choice.
If the Newtonian picture of how the universe works on a macroscopic scale is anything likeaccurate, as it very obviously is, then there would appear to be only one option anyway.
No. If the Christian God exists at all, he is creator of all things and Lord of all things.
But this fails to take into account quantum mechanics, which is definitely true.
Mighty big IF there...
You are assuming your conclusion, and that's a logical fallacy.
I would regard it as debatable whether or not quantum effects are of any relevance in the macroscopic world. Even if they were, it would only make somebody's actions dependent upon random events, and you must decide whether that is any more acceptable to your conception of free will.
If you want to debate Christian theology, you had better have the existence of God as a working hypothesis, because Christian theology presupposes it.
There is no proof, or disproof, that God exists.
That makes no sense.
In order to debate the position that Christian theology is wrong, I have to start form the assumption that it is NOT wrong?
Actually, I do think this would be a good start - the beginning of a reductio ad absurdum, which can be a pretty powerful means of refuting an idea.That makes no sense.
In order to debate the position that Christian theology is wrong, I have to start form the assumption that it is NOT wrong?
I would regard it as debatable whether or not quantum effects are of any relevance in the macroscopic world. Even if they were, it would only make somebody's actions dependent upon random events, and you must decide whether that is any more acceptable to your conception of free will.
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