ST. John Calvin

Benedicta00 · Oct 29, 2007

Reformationist said:
Well, I'm terribly sorry to have pointed out that you bore false witness against me. It is clear that doing so means very little to you. I'll know in the future to not waste your time with such expectations as honesty and accuracy.

I'll show you mine if you show me yours...

No.. you insulted me, don't do it no more, k?

Reformationist · Oct 29, 2007

Benedicta00 said:
No.. you insulted me, don't do it no more, k?

I'll show you mine if you show me yours...

See how beneficial it is to just keep repeating the same thing. Hey..., I've got an idea..., how about you focus on controlling your own ungodly behavior and I'll focus on controlling mine? And I promise that I won't repeatedly request that you be banned, especially not when you're simply exhibiting behavior of which I am likewise guilty. I've heard there are people around that do that sort of thing. Watch out for them.

simonthezealot · Oct 29, 2007

How about we drop it! and get back to talking about our Saintly forefather St. John Calvin! One of the men whom showed that the church cluttered up the simplicity of salvation with a works/righteousness system and helped shine the light on the true salvation path which is taught in the written word of God, grace and faith salvation...God blessed St. John Calvin!

Reformationist · Oct 29, 2007

simonthezealot said:
How about we drop it! and get back to talking about our Saintly forefather St. John Calvin! One of the men whom showed that the church cluttered up the simplicity of salvation with a works/righteousness system and helped shine the light on the true salvation path which is taught in the written word of God, grace and faith salvation...God blessed St. John Calvin!

I'm all for that.

Yeznik · Oct 29, 2007

simonthezealot said:
How about we drop it! And get back to talking about our Saintly forefather St. John Calvin! One of the men whom showed that the church cluttered up the simplicity of salvation with a works/righteousness system and helped shine the light on the true salvation path which is taught in the written word of God, grace and faith salvation...God blessed St. John Calvin!

True light of salvation?

And the Apostle most distinctly testifies, that death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned, (Rom. 5:12); that is, are involved in original sin, and polluted by its stain. Hence, even infants bringing their condemnation with them from their mothers womb, suffer not for anothers, but for their own defect. For although they have not yet produced the fruits of their own unrighteousness, they have the seed implanted in them. Nay, their whole nature is, as it were, a seed-bed of sin, and therefore cannot but be odious and abominable to God.

John Calvin

In short Calvin believed if infants arent baptized they are going to Hell.

mont974x4 · Oct 29, 2007

So there's a place where I disagree with Calvin. So what? There's plenty of things I don't agree with that many saints believe.

As for babies? The issue isn't directly addressed in Scripture. I see no evidence for infant baptism, but baptism doesn;t save anyone anyways. As for infants in general, I prefer to believe that Gods grace has them covered.

Benedicta00 · Oct 29, 2007

He also burned a man at the stake for not believing in the Trinity... he was no Saint and he or his beliefs should not be honored, he mostly taught heresy.

So we are just trying to figure out what is it that you are admiring him for?

mont974x4 · Oct 29, 2007

Well, then praise God for heretics. They challenged the RCC status quo and brought the message of the truth of Gods grace.

Still, Calvin is a saint because he's a believer, no matter what the rcc says.

mont974x4 · Oct 29, 2007

Benedicta00 said:
He also burned a man at the stake for not believing in the Trinity... he was no Saint and he or his beliefs should not be honored, he mostly taught heresy.

So we are just trying to figure out what is it that you are admiring him for?

How many innocents have the rcc murdered through its history?

Hardly a good measuring stick for you to bring up, is it?

Yeznik · Oct 29, 2007

mont974x4 said:
So there's a place where I disagree with Calvin. So what? There's plenty of things I don't agree with that many saints believe.

As for babies? The issue isn't directly addressed in Scripture. I see no evidence for infant baptism, but baptism doesn;t save anyone anyways. As for infants in general, I prefer to believe that Gods grace has them covered.

Well Calvin disagree's with you on this one:

"Every one must now see that pædobaptism, which receives such strong support from Scripture, is by no means of human invention. Nor is there anything plausible in the objection, that we nowhere read of even one infant having been baptised by the hands of the apostles. For although this is not expressly narrated by the Evangelists, yet as they are not expressly excluded when mention is made of any baptised family (Acts 16:15, 32), what man of sense will argue from this that they were not baptised? If such kinds of argument were good, it would be necessary, in like manner, to interdict women from the Lords Supper, since we do not read that they were ever admitted to it in the days
of the apostles. But here we are contented with the rule of faith. For when we reflect on the nature of the ordinance of the Lords Supper, we easily judge who the persons are to whom the use of it is to be communicated. The same we observe in the case of baptism. For, attending to the end for which it was instituted, we clearly perceive that it is not less applicable to children than to those of more advanced years, and that, therefore, they cannot be deprived of it without manifest fraud to the will of its divine Author. The assertion which they disseminate among the common people, that a long series of years elapsed after the resurrection of Christ, during which pædobaptism was unknown, is a shameful falsehood, since there is no writer, however ancient, who does not trace
its origin to the days of the apostles."

John Calvin

So who would you say is right, you or Calvin? Are you a Calvinist? ( I don't know thats why I am asking)

Yeznik · Oct 29, 2007

mont974x4 said:
How many innocents have the rcc murdered through its history?

Hardly a good measuring stick for you to bring up, is it?

Well Protestants killed innocent people as well, from the time of Luther starting from the Peasant Wars.

mont974x4 · Oct 29, 2007

I'm a Christian, and that makes me a saint, as it does Calvin, Luther, and anyone else who is in Christ....whether we agree on everything or not and whether the rcc thinks we are or not.

Benedicta00 · Oct 29, 2007

mont974x4 said:
How many innocents have the rcc murdered through its history?

Hardly a good measuring stick for you to bring up, is it?

Not nearly as many as you have been led to believe and not nearly as many of the Protestant inquisition has.

Benedicta00 · Oct 29, 2007

mont974x4 said:
I'm a Christian, and that makes me a saint, as it does Calvin, Luther, and anyone else who is in Christ....whether we agree on everything or not and whether the rcc thinks we are or not.

So being a murderer is okay as long as you believe? That is what defines sanctity to you, belief?

mont974x4 · Oct 29, 2007

Benedicta00 said:
Not nearly as many as you have been led to believe and not nearly as many of the Protestant inquisition has.

And does that make the rcc any better?

It isn;t us that makes us saints. It is Christ. It is His blood that washes away our every sin. It is His sacrifice that redeemed us. It is because of Him and who we are in Him that makes us saints.

mont974x4 · Oct 29, 2007

Benedicta00 said:
So being a murderer is okay as long as you believe? That is what defines sanctity to you, belief?

I beleive that God is faithful to forgive us our sins...no matter what they are.

Benedicta00 · Oct 29, 2007

Yeznik said:
Well Protestants killed innocent people as well, from the time of Luther starting from the Peasant Wars.

They killed a considerable larger amount and Luther indeed accepted responsibility.

mont974x4 · Oct 29, 2007

Good, if Luther accepted repsonisbility for his sins, as we all should, then they are forgiven.

WHo are you to bring charges against him?
NASB
Rom 8:31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us?
Rom 8:32 He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him over for us all, how will He not also with Him freely give us all things?
Rom 8:33 Who will bring a charge against God's elect? God is the one who justifies;
Rom 8:34 who is the one who condemns? Christ Jesus is He who died, yes, rather who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us.
Rom 8:35 Who will separate us from the love of Christ? Will tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
Rom 8:36 Just as it is written, "FOR YOUR SAKE WE ARE BEING PUT TO DEATH ALL DAY LONG; WE WERE CONSIDERED AS SHEEP TO BE SLAUGHTERED."
Rom 8:37 But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us.
Rom 8:38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
Rom 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Benedicta00 · Oct 29, 2007

mont974x4 said:
And does that make the rcc any better?

It isn;t us that makes us saints. It is Christ. It is His blood that washes away our every sin. It is His sacrifice that redeemed us. It is because of Him and who we are in Him that makes us saints.

Calvin killed a man in the name of God... that is sanctity to you? If I killed someone and said, well I believe that Christ forgives this, I would be a saint to you? Holy?

Saying "I believe "when our actions say something else, is what holy is to you?

And JP2 apologize and reached out and make amends to all faiths everywhere for any wrong the Church may have done.

What has the Protestant community as whole done? They won't even admit to any of the acts their "Saints" committed.

Benedicta00 · Oct 29, 2007

mont974x4 said:
Good, if Luther accepted repsonisbility for his sins, as we all should, then they are forgiven.

WHo are you to bring charges against him?
NASB
Rom 8:31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us?
Rom 8:32 He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him over for us all, how will He not also with Him freely give us all things?
Rom 8:33 Who will bring a charge against God's elect? God is the one who justifies;
Rom 8:34 who is the one who condemns? Christ Jesus is He who died, yes, rather who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us.
Rom 8:35 Who will separate us from the love of Christ? Will tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
Rom 8:36 Just as it is written, "FOR YOUR SAKE WE ARE BEING PUT TO DEATH ALL DAY LONG; WE WERE CONSIDERED AS SHEEP TO BE SLAUGHTERED."
Rom 8:37 But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us.
Rom 8:38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
Rom 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

No, he said "let their blood be on my hands..."

That is holiness to you?
Tell you what, prove to us these dudes are in heaven...

Pray to them and see if they can grant you a miracle from God. Becuase God was so darned pleased with all the accomplished he will hear their prayers...

ST. John Calvin

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Non nobis domine sed tuo nomine da gloriam

have you not read,what God has spoken unto you?

Non nobis domine sed tuo nomine da gloriam

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