Six fingers.

mzungu said:

If you want to change the laws of physics then learn some physics. Showing us fake photos which were from a competition regarding altered photos is basically "bearing false witness".

Click to expand...

The photos has nothing to do with past gravity being lower and giants walking the earth. The photos being real or fake doesn't matter.

What matters is that your argument against human giants is also made against dinosaurs. And, yes, it is an argument among scientists who understand physics.

The Impossible Dinosaurs

Doveaman said:

The photos has nothing to do with past gravity being lower and giants walking the earth. The photos being real or fake doesn't matter.

What matters is that your argument against human giants is also made against dinosaurs. And, yes, it is an argument among scientists who understand physics.

The Impossible Dinosaurs

Click to expand...

Hogwash! If you want to use cartoon physics and creationist sites to prove your point then I will try to bring Tom and Jerry in on the debate! I am sure you will find much in common!

Doveaman said:

What matters is that your argument against human giants is also made against dinosaurs. And, yes, it is an argument among scientists who understand physics.

Click to expand...

From the page you linked:
"No animal the same weight as one of these men could be presumed to be as strong."

Even if we only consider the apes, we're relatively weak.

"Inspection of the data presented evinces the finding that, despite the fact that all of the human subjects were adult males but 40 per cent of the chimpanzees were females and 80 per cent were pre-adolescent or earliest-adolescent, chimpanzees are much stronger than humans per unit of bodyweight. The outpulling by the largest chimpanzee of a human weight-lifter fully 2 1/2 times as large in body-weight seems especially noteworthy."
-- Edwards W.E. Holloman Air Force Base, N.M.: 6571st Aeromedical Research Laboratory; Holloman, New Mexico: 1965. Study of monkey, ape and human morphology and physiology relating to strength and endurance. Phase IX: The strength testing of five chimpanzee and seven human subjects.

Doveaman said:

What matters is that your argument against human giants is also made against dinosaurs. And, yes, it is an argument among scientists who understand physics.

Click to expand...

You have failed totally to comprehend the mechanics involving load bearing structures. Go learn some engineering before you say such fallacies.

You cannot just scale up a skeleton while keeping the ratio constant. A point will be reached where the skeleton will not be able to bear the load.

Why are creationists insisting on dismissing science when most of them cannot even spell the word

mzungu said:

You have failed totally to comprehend the mechanics involving load bearing structures. Go learn some engineering before you say such fallacies.

Click to expand...

In was engineers who made the claim about the giant dinosaurs, not me.

You are asking me to learn engineering despite the fact that you are disagreeing with the engineers.

You cannot just scale up a skeleton while keeping the ratio constant. A point will be reached where the skeleton will not be able to bear the load.

Click to expand...

That's why giant dinosaurs were impossible in our present gravity.

Lower gravity in the past also explains why animals could grow so big compared to the puny ones we have now.

mzungu said:

Hogwash! If you want to use cartoon physics and creationist sites to prove your point then I will try to bring Tom and Jerry in on the debate! I am sure you will find much in common!

Click to expand...

De Nile is not only a river in Egypt.

Doveaman said:

In was engineers who made the claim about the giant dinosaurs, not me.

You are asking me to learn engineering despite the fact that you are disagreeing with the engineers.
That's why giant dinosaurs were impossible in our present gravity.

Lower gravity in the past also explains why animals could grow so big compared to the puny ones we have now.

Click to expand...

Since I will not do your homework for you and since B movies and your ideas are compatible then suffice it to say check out this link and if you can read it all then perhaps you will learn something: The Biology of B-Movie Monsters

Also if you bothered to look at the Elephant skeleton you will see that proportionally the load bearing bones are thicker.

*sigh* Can't believe I'm doing this but...

Doveaman said:

In was engineers who made the claim about the giant dinosaurs, not me.

You are asking me to learn engineering despite the fact that you are disagreeing with the engineers.
That's why giant dinosaurs were impossible in our present gravity.

Click to expand...

Many scientists and researchers have already figured out the so-called 'dinosaur paradox' and trying to argue with them by linking to a Ted Holden article (he is wrong about so many things one doesn't even know where to start) is like trying to climb a mountain using a noodle as rope. You can stand on a nearby rock and claim you've done it, but everyone else is going to see the real thing behind you and laugh you off of it.

Some supporting links:
The Dinosaur Paradox and the Muscle Size/Strength Ratio | The Iron Samurai
Giants in a Giant World: Why Were Dino’s So Darned Big? | Sapien Games
Scientific Theory Solving the Dinosaur Paradox and Numerous Other Paradoxes Regarding Earth's Evolution: the Thick Atmosphere Solution

Lower gravity in the past also explains why animals could grow so big compared to the puny ones we have now.

Click to expand...

Actually, higher oxygen levels and thicker atmosphere explain it much better. And we actually have evidence for those.


But, the whole dinosaur issue is a red herring to the actual conversation here. Dinosaurs predate people by hundreds of thousands of years, and the conditions under which they lived were not the same as those under which the people who wrote the Bible did. During the time period where the giants are described to have lived, after the coming of man, there were no dinosaurs and conditions must have been fairly similar to what we have today.

Your insistence that just because -some- of the images are faked doesn't mean -all- of the images are faked is... well...

I'm reminded of the story of a little girl that I read on a blog by her father; the little girl came to believe there were fairies living under their porch, so she began to leave little presents for them. The father thought this was adorable and sweet, so he took the presents and left her little things in return--flowers, pretty pins, tiny notes. But the little girl got older and older and the father realized that she still believed as much as she had when she was small. Finally he couldn't take the deception much more and he took her aside and told her the truth. She was furious that he had taken the little presents, not because he had made her believe something untrue, but because he had kept the REAL fairies from getting their gifts!

Here's the kicker. You could prove all of us wrong (at least on the subject of giants) by pointing to just one museum or private collector in the whole world who owns a giant bone. One, certifiably humanoid, actual bone. Just one. If you believe those pictures, or believe that even one of those pictures is potentially real, that means there must be dozens of huge humanoid bones somewhere in the world! Has some ebil conspiracy hidden every single one of them from human eyes, but somehow couldn't keep pictures of the find off the internet?

So let's get this conversation back where it started--with giants, and the fact that no evidence ever found suggests their actual existence. And how gullible people can be to obvious photoshops.

mzungu said:

Since I will not do your homework for you and since B movies and your ideas are compatible then suffice it to say check out this link and if you can read it all then perhaps you will learn something: The Biology of B-Movie Monsters

Also if you bothered to look at the Elephant skeleton you will see that proportionally the load bearing bones are thicker.

Click to expand...

It takes bones and muscles to carry a load, not just bones.

The scientific study also explains why giant dinosaurs did not have the muscles to carry their load in our present gravity.

"It appears that the maximum force or stress that can be exerted by any muscle is inherent in the structure of the muscle filaments. The maximum force is roughly 4 to 4 kgf/cm2 cross section of muscle (300 - 400 kN/m2). This force is body-size independent and is the same for mouse and elephant muscle..."

Doveaman said:

De Nile is not only a river in Egypt.

Click to expand...

Indeed, it's the reason you ignored my post.