Salvation? Bad thoughts? Help!

HawkBlue27 · Jan 8, 2013

yellowfree said:
Did you look at the youtube vid I suggested?
its called:
Dan Mohler-How to Resist the Devil

Please check him out

Okay...I will have a look. Is it this one?

Dan Mohler - How to Resist the Devil - YouTube

*Charis* · Jan 8, 2013

HawkBlue27 said:
I always want to get to the bottom of these things. It's like I can say I acknowledge Christ as Lord and Savior but then my mind the thought says "no you do not you don't even love him" that's basically the type of thoughts which enter my mind. It's like I huge wave of either conviction or condemnation, one of the two, comes over me after that.

You've shown love to the Lord by obeying Him in
placing faith in Him for salvation. That faith 'gives
you the right to become a son of God'. It's a
process that often is accomplished by baby steps.

Instead of being overcome with feeling from these
thoughts, tell the Lord what you're facing, knowing
He truly cares and gives you all that pertains to life
and godliness. (2 Peter 1:3) Then rest in HIS
embrace.

HawkBlue27 · Jan 8, 2013

Thanks...I heard John Piper once say "trusting God's promises gives glory to God". When you trust someone as your only hope you show that they are strong and without them you're weak. I ask God that I'd be forced to feel with a firm conviction that I love Christ so that I can follow Him.

yellowfree · Jan 8, 2013

Yes!
that's the one HawkBlue27

COG2013 · Jan 8, 2013

HawkBlue27 said:
Every so often I find myself plagued by thoughts and feelings which I have no control over. I had heard of a book written by a man named John Bunyan in which he mentioned his own personal problems with this type of thing-I have not actually read it, but I just found this excerpt. It says: "While I was in this torment, I often found in my mind a sudden urge to curse and swear, or to speak some grievous thing against God, Christ His Son, or of the Scriptures. Now I thought, surely I am possessed of the devil. At other times, I thought I would lose my mind; for instead of praising and magnifying the Lord with others, if I but heard Him spoken of, presently some most horrible blasphemous thought or other would bolt out of my heart against Him. So whether I did think that God was, or again did think there was no such thing as God, no love, peace or gracious disposition could I feel within me. These things did sink me into very deep despair, for I concluded that such things could not possibly be found among those who loved God."

The whole thing can be found here: The famous John Bunyan’s battle with blasphemous thoughts, feeling unforgivable, reprobate and demon possessed

This is exactly how I feel. Almost perfectly. I do not even know if I even love God and I have resorted to basically constantly asking the Lord to "save me if I am not saved and change my heart so I do not get these things coming back". And always the thought or feeling comes back, and once again fear maybe I am not even saved. It has become a VICIOUS cycle. How could I EVER follow Christ if I am left like this and feel maybe I am not even for him? I have tried avoiding anything that would spark these thoughts and sometimes felt maybe there is hope, but to no avail...what do I do?

I was the same way, only not as bad. You have a LFD problem. That's "Little Freikin Demon". I was able to ignore the suggestions but they just kept coming. I was finally delivered from it, but I had to challenge God to get the deliverance. I told him that this was taking me away from Him and my choice was to stay with Him, so I left it in His hands because I had been unable to stop the attacks myself.

mommy2mybabies · Jan 9, 2013

ezeric said:
First off, you are very normal - everyone gets wicked thoughts. They are not FROM you.

Second, you have to start to learn (its a process) the 3 voices/ thoughts that you hear inside yourself. A) Your own thoughts - like I like a coffee or ice cream.
B) GOD speaking - still small voice, and its always for the best interest of everyone around (including you) and it matches the 'fruit of the SPIRIT' found in Galatians 5:22 "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. " GOD talks like this!
C) The enemy, carnal mind. It is belligerent, bullying, demanding, fear making, often uses the word "should", loud, law-keeping/record keeping, harsh.

You have the 'mind of CHRIST' already, but you still are looking at things the way your carnal mind and natural man see's it. (not by Faith which looks at what can't be seen.).

This is the process, you resist the evil thoughts, and tell them "NO" and force your mind to listen to the SPIRIT which is the SPIRIT of JESUS who is IN you.
As you 'hear the voice of the SPIRIT' you will automatically kill the voice of the enemy.
Thus walking in the SPIRIT you will not satisfy the lusts of the flesh.

Get to war over your thoughts and start to listen only to the LORD - who loves you...and only has your best interest in mind.

This is the beginning to walk in the SPIRITUAL and it opens the doors to miracles.
It comes by GRACE, you don't work it up, or pay anything to get it - no its all yours already!

-eric

I really like how you used the descriptions of the Spirit's voice vs. the evil one's voice. For the past few nights, I've been in agony over a sin I committed many years ago. I had thoughts that maybe I was still living in that sin and because of that; I'm headed for hell. I had immense fear, pain, despair, and hopelessness. I thought that this was God telling me that I had to make a decision that would hurt a lot of people in the process to become right standing with him again. I realize now that this wasn't the Spirit at all. You're right. The Bible teaches exactly what the fruits of the Spirit are. Thank You for that.

tturt · Jan 9, 2013

Yes! we're to take every thought captive (II Cor 10:5) and replace those evil thoughts with His Word (Rom 12:2).

AndrewK9 · Jan 9, 2013

If you "allegiance" to Christ is what you are questioning here, then have a look at this sermon I found. I don't agree with everything on this site, but this may be a help:

Understanding Repentance I | Know I'm Saved

GreatExpectations · Jan 9, 2013

This was Bunyan's solution as presented by John Piper:

To Live Upon God that IsÂ Invisible Suffering and Service in the Life of John Bunyan 1999 Bethlehem Conference for Pastors - Desiring God

HawkBlue27 · Jan 9, 2013

GreatExpectations said:
This was Bunyan's solution as presented by John Piper:

To Live Upon God that IsÂ[bless and do not curse]Invisible Suffering and Service in the Life of John Bunyan 1999 Bethlehem Conference for Pastors - Desiring God

Thanks. I especially like the part which says "there, I say, was my righteousness; so that wherever I was, or whatever I was doing, God could not say of me, he wants [=lacks] my righteousness, for that was just before him. I also saw, moreover, that it was not my good frame of heart that made my righteousness better, nor yet my bad frame that made my righteousness worse, for my righteousness was Jesus Christ himself, "The same yesterday, today, and forever." Heb. 13:8. Now did my chains fall off my legs indeed. I was loosed from my afflictions and irons; my temptations also fled away"

Maybe I have put too much emphasis on these thoughts and not upon Jesus.

ezeric · Jan 9, 2013

mommy2mybabies said:
ezeric said:

First off, you are very normal - everyone gets wicked thoughts. They are not FROM you.

Second, you have to start to learn (its a process) the 3 voices/ thoughts that you hear inside yourself. A) Your own thoughts - like I like a coffee or ice cream.
B) GOD speaking - still small voice, and its always for the best interest of everyone around (including you) and it matches the 'fruit of the SPIRIT' found in Galatians 5:22 "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. " GOD talks like this!
C) The enemy, carnal mind. It is belligerent, bullying, demanding, fear making, often uses the word "should", loud, law-keeping/record keeping, harsh.

You have the 'mind of CHRIST' already, but you still are looking at things the way your carnal mind and natural man see's it. (not by Faith which looks at what can't be seen.).

This is the process, you resist the evil thoughts, and tell them "NO" and force your mind to listen to the SPIRIT which is the SPIRIT of JESUS who is IN you.
As you 'hear the voice of the SPIRIT' you will automatically kill the voice of the enemy.
Thus walking in the SPIRIT you will not satisfy the lusts of the flesh.

Get to war over your thoughts and start to listen only to the LORD - who loves you...and only has your best interest in mind.

This is the beginning to walk in the SPIRITUAL and it opens the doors to miracles.
It comes by GRACE, you don't work it up, or pay anything to get it - no its all yours already!

-eric

I really like how you used the descriptions of the Spirit's voice vs. the evil one's voice. For the past few nights, I've been in agony over a sin I committed many years ago. I had thoughts that maybe I was still living in that sin and because of that; I'm headed for hell. I had immense fear, pain, despair, and hopelessness. I thought that this was God telling me that I had to make a decision that would hurt a lot of people in the process to become right standing with him again. I realize now that this wasn't the Spirit at all. You're right. The Bible teaches exactly what the fruits of the Spirit are. Thank You for that.

Click to expand...

Praise the LORD for HIS Wisdom and Revelation to you!
We've seen many set free from the onslaught of evil (thinking and living) which has NOTHING to do with you or the Kingdom of GOD. (that is in you).

And I love what Tturt reminded all of us of; is that we are to take every thought and make it captive (capture it, subdue it) and make it obedient to CHRIST. (2nd Corinthians 10:5)

We serve this JESUS who is 'full of GRACE and TRUTH'. (John 1:14)
Not counting man's sins against them (2nd Corinthians 5:19)

Wow, that is still really really GOOD NEWS (Gospel).

So guess what?

GOD's not counting your sins or mine or anyone's here -against us.
The devil is the accuser, and he might - but this JESUS never does!
JESUS full of GRACE and TRUTH!
Wonderful JESUS!

-eric

Jonathan95 · Jan 9, 2013

Charles H. Spurgeon also struggled with blasphemous thoughts and so. It seems they struggled with OCD (Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder.) I myself have had struggle with blasphemous thoughts and other wicked thoughts, to the point that I've wanted to commit suicide, I've thought I've been unforgivable. I been hitting myself in the head, getting into depressions due to struggle with thoughts.

But I've started learning how to maintain peace, by not treating all thoughts as my own, for example, but "casting down arguments and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ," 2 Cor 10:5 NKJV. Otherwise we will find OURSELVES being captivated by our thoughts, and they breed into more wicked thoughts. Either you bring them into captivity, or THEY will bring YOU into captivity, if you let them - through Worry, treating them as your OWN etc. We have the flesh as well, and it affects our mind too:

(Romans 8:6 NKJV) For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be.

So our mind, our eyes has to be stayed/fixed on Jesus (Hebrews 12:2), and not on the thoughts, so that we get captivated by them. "You will keep him in perfect peace, Whose mind is stayed on You, Because he trusts in You." Isaiah 26:3 NKJV

Another thing I believe helped me a lot was reading the scripture, meditating on it, confessing it, using it in prayer. I believe much of the struggle was connected to my lack of bible reading and so. Worshipping has helped me a lot too, it doesn't and shouldn't be done only in church, but in the chamber of prayer and worship where we can humbly submit ourselves to God on our knees in intimacy with him, and pour out our hearts to him. "Trust in Him at all times, you people; Pour out your heart before Him; God is a refuge for us. Selah" Psalm 62:8 NKJV.

I also felt a lack of gratitude towards God. I would pray sincerely that I would receive a heart of gratitude like that of David in the Psalms. Thanksgiving is important as well, because look at this:

(Philippians 4:6 NKJV) Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; 7 and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

AndrewK9 · Jan 9, 2013

Jonathan95 said:
Charles H. Spurgeon also struggled with blasphemous thoughts and so. It seems they struggled with OCD (Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder.) I myself have had struggle with blasphemous thoughts and other wicked thoughts, to the point that I've wanted to commit suicide, I've thought I've been unforgivable. I been hitting myself in the head, getting into depressions due to struggle with thoughts.

This. Spurgeon did write about this in his book, "All of Grace".

"I have heard someone say, I am tormented with horrible thoughts. Wherever I go, blasphemies steal in upon me. Frequently at my work a dreadful suggestion forces itself upon me, and even on my bed I am startled from my sleep by whispers of the evil one. I cannot get away from this horrible temptation. Jesus died for those who are guilty of all manner of sin and blasphemy, and I am therefore certain He will not refuse those who are unwillingly the captives of evil thoughts. Cast yourself upon Him, thoughts and all, and see if He is not mighty to save. He can still those horrible whisperings of the fiend, or He can enable you to see them in their true light, so that you may not be worried by them. In His own way He can and will save you, and at length give you perfect peace. Only trust Him for this and everything else."

HawkBlue27 · Jan 9, 2013

Thanks to all for the help about this. I have reached the point where I think I will leave these thoughts or feelings in the dust and start walking with Christ.

*Charis* · Jan 9, 2013

HawkBlue27 said:
Thanks to all for the help about this. I have reached the point where I think I will leave these thoughts or feelings in the dust and start walking with Christ.

You won't be disappointed... the love of God will surround and keep you.
And His strength will be showcased in your life!

My prayers remain with you, brother!

xxxxxxtra · Jan 10, 2013

Hey hawk. Just so ya know. I battle these thoughts quite often.. I know that if you take a tour of martin luther's study, you will still see the ink stain on the wall. The story is that the devil was badgering him and martin threw his ink bottle at the devils head.. I personally just say stop.. Then i sometimes say Lord rebuke you.. Thats pretty much all i can do.. I sometimes think that it humbles us.. Allows us to remember that we need God.. Just remember that as we mature our old sinful nature is going to wrestle with the new man. And as we grow in our walk with Christ. Sin now looks a whole lot worse. So what was once something we enjoyed becomes less tolerable as we are conformed to His image and then it is just detestable.. So please don't fret.. Paul talks of a thorn in his side.. A messenger of satan.. He asked God to remove it.. God said no. But His grace is sufficient.. I think that is what we might be deali g with.. I find whatever it is. It humbles me to the point that i draw closer to God..

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