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People are raped and killed and hurt every day.But the shepherd kills burns and rapes people. I saying that if there was no god in your life you wouldn't suddenly start killing or raping or hurting people.
People are raped and killed and hurt every day.
Evil exists, with or without God in our lives.
This is not about whether or not God is in our lives. This is about who we are.
I can't remember disputing the terribleness of God on this thread. Those without the Spirit within them will indeed find God offensive.But the bible says HE caused them to be raped burned and killed, he is responsible, they are attributes of HIS character.
Christians would only note that we all have sinned. Catholics might note that a third of every generation in the modern era have been swept away by abortion, which is the killing of a human being. It is not criminal, because, as I have already noted, corruption of human morality is such that good becomes regarded as evil, and evil as good, very, very easily.But your assumption of who we are is based on a book that isn't established as true or meaningful. I was trying to say that there is no god keeping you from raping and killing people, if you left Christianity one day you wouldn't start doing those things. The VAAAAAAST majority of humans are not criminals.
One third of every generation being swept away by abortion is vast too.
I can't remember disputing the terribleness of God on this thread. Those without the Spirit within them will indeed find God offensive.
Christians would only note that we all have sinned. Catholics might note that a third of every generation in the modern era have been swept away by abortion, which is the killing of a human being. It is not criminal, because, as I have already noted, corruption of human morality is such that good becomes regarded as evil, and evil as good, very, very easily.
One third of every generation being swept away by abortion is vast too.
Wait a minute. You are all upset because God sent the Medes, who were a very violent people, to punish the Babylonians, who were also very violent...is that right?
But ripping a million of so innocent babies from their mothers' womb...that's okay?
There's something wrong with that reasoning...
I don't agree with you that ending a pregnancy is always similar to murder first of all.
So you really do think that if you sin and don't repent god could send a man to rape you and that would be ok?
I belong to God. My life is His.
There is nothing more to be said.
And yes...abortion is nothing less than first degree murder.
EDIT:
Let me quickly add...abortion for any other reason than medical reasons.
Of course you don't.I don't agree with you that ending a pregnancy is always similar to murder first of all.
The world is a cruel place. That is the reality we have to deal with, whether we are okay with it or not.So you really do think that if you sin and don't repent god could send a man to rape you and that would be ok?
Why assume what was not written? The terribleness of God had been a major theme that these posts have been stating clearly from the beginning.SolomonVII
You claimed that rape and hurt occur everyday, I assumed that you said this in order to express that it wasn't necessarily god's fault that it did. So I tried to show that he himself caused it.
There is no circular reasoning in the Bible. There is however an understanding that reasoning alone is not how we ultimately must comprehend the world. Ultimately for even Jesuits, whose logic and reasoning is impeccable, the world of God ultimately is comprehended through faith. Reason alone is not enough to plumb the depths of what is written in the Bible, and what is experienced in life.What the bible calls sin is based on circular reasoning, just because Jesus says so. Jesus' unfounded opinion of what is right and wrong is not enough to establish that we are corrupt or have done anything wrong.
That is not an argument. That is a quibble.The number also probably is not as high 30% as you say. In America the number has been decreasing since the early 80's. About 25% of pregnancies are aborted.
Well I don't accept something as right or wrong because of what I'm told... that kind of moral system is exactly what I am saying we should never use.Of course you don't.
The authorities in our countries, which we obey, tells us different.
That is exactly what I am talking about.
The world is a cruel place. That is the reality we have to deal with, whether we are okay with it or not.
TheBarrd
... Ok, thanks for answering.
I would think your need to clarify proves that is is not murder... but rather a challenge of values, values that even you needed to remember and reevaluate and restate.
Why assume what was not written?
The terribleness of God had been a major theme that these posts have been stating clearly from the beginning.
One hardly needs to read the Bible to comprehend that. Reality has a horror to it, with each life being a tragedy ending in death. The Bible has been true to that reality.
The problem of evil is a real problem for Christians who believe in the goodness of the Creator of all things seen and unseen, and the Book of Job is probably the earliest book to state clearly that this problem is not one that will be reasoned away.
There is no circular reasoning in the Bible. There is however an understanding that reasoning alone is not how we ultimately must comprehend the world. Ultimately for even Jesuits, whose logic and reasoning is impeccable, the world of God ultimately is comprehended through faith. Reason alone is not enough to plumb the depths of what is written in the Bible, and what is experienced in life.
That is not an argument. That is a quibble.
That you need to show the different times when killing what you perceive to be a human is excusable seems to say that no this should not be considered murder, because you'd do it, under the right circumstances.Not really. That is usually the pro choice's first objection...if the mother's life is at stake.
You're comparing me to a rapist? You're really saying I am a lot like a rapist? That my moral values are no different than a rapists? Honey I wouldn't hurt you for the world... you have lost your ever loving mind. I am not really interested in talking about the people in your town or what you think about abortions. Sorry. The difference between you and me is you believe it's a human being and you're still willing to kill it under certain circumstances...The only difference is, that you share the guilt, because you are helping to enable the murderers.
You fully support god raping you if he chooses to, am I supposed to even think your statement to be criticism?The blood of those innocent children is as much on your hands as the abortionist's.
Sleep well....
This is not a forum where Christians debate one another. The responses that I give are coherent with my responses. and there is no need to assume that I am being an echo chamber for any other Christian poster.SolomonVII
Your statement wasn't coherent. I worked with it the best I could without actually asking you to say it differently and considering the nature of the conversation I don't think my was unreasonable. That god IS horrifying and terrible is not the trend in responses.
That is your choice, but at least you are responding to my points this time. I am not, nor have I ever been, sugar coating God to make him more palatable.I do think the bible provides a terrible god, I'm not just willing to accept that it's excusable.
Yes. I disagree that it is the nature of Jesus' system and it is not the nature of the Catholic moral system either, which is based on Jesus.The idea that something is right because someone says so is circular in to the greatest degree. Do you disagree that this is the nature of Jesus' moral system?
Circa 33 percent falling to 25 percent in recent years is a quibble.I did not express it as an argument, but productive information on something you chose to bring up. .
This is not a forum where Christians debate one another. The responses that I give are coherent with my responses. and there is no need to assume that I am being an echo chamber for any other Christian poster.
That is your choice, but at least you are responding to my points this time. I am not, nor have I ever been, sugar coating God to make him more palatable.
Yes. I disagree that it is the nature of Jesus' system and it is not the nature of the Catholic moral system either, which is based on Jesus.
Circa 33 percent falling to 25 percent in recent years is a quibble
You deny that the bolded portions in the passages I provided to you say that god caused those things?
"I will make them eat the flesh of their sons of daughters"
and the various bolded words in Chapter 13 of Isaiah.
You don't think god caused it when the passages say he caused it?
A warning that he is going to do it... is still him doing it.
Guess, I thought I was done here but......do you understand that what was prophesied was a warning of something that later happened? It was a warning of warfare that was approaching and the consequences that would result. The warning was that the Babylonians were on the attack & that they later laid siege to Jerusalem. During the siege the tragedy & suffering that resulted included mothers cannibalizing their children. The same things happened centuries later during the siege of Jerusalem by the Romans a generation after the Lord Jesus Christ was crucified. There was cannibalism during the siege of Leningrad during World War 2. Mind you that people in their desperation resorted to these horrid measures on those already dead. As I have repeatedly said that 3000repeat 3000 years ago people understood this in much more personal terms of divine punishment being given to them.
The thing is a prophecy was given as a warning of approaching tragedy. What was being warned about might have been collectively impossible to avoid but the message of repentance is what is being relayed so people will have salvation in everlasting life when this world is (tragically) reduced to an ash heap. I have already provided a Gospel passage in which the Lord rebuked the apostles for wanting old testament divine wrath to fall on an unbelieving Samaritan village. I previously relayed a passage where the Lord said that people killed in a building collapse & a civil disturbance were not any worse than anyone else but that he told those speculating about it that what they need to be concerned with in their present moment was repentance.
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