Questions concerning the gifts

Since Yeshua only did what He saw the Father doing ([FONT=&quot]John 5:19[/FONT]), you might want to start by asking Yahweh how to pray for someone. If you don't get a response, then pray Scriptures such as "by Your stripes, we are healed." (I Peter 2:24).

In regards to being possessed or obsessed, as believers we can't be possessed but we can need deliverance. As we read His word and renew our minds with His word, surrender our lives to Him including our thought life, we are being constantly delivered (James 4:8, II Cor. 10:5, Rom 12:2).

God will let you know when you get a gift of the Spirit. For example, God told me I had the gift of prophecy in a tongues and interpretation (I gave a tongues and interpretation at my house; I already had those gifts.) He may not tell you through tongues and interpretation, He may just give you the unction. God also gave me a prophecy, after I had the gift of prophecy, that He would give me the gift of word of knowledge. He may not tell you in a prophecy, He may just give you the unction. Even though God has told me two times in a message that He was giving me a gift of the Spirit, the first gift He gave me (tongues) He just gave me the unction to do it. I would wait until you know for sure you have the gift to tell people they will be healed. I think it is ashamed that there are so many healing crusades and the persons leading it do not have the gift of healing. Another thing to consider is that the Holy Spirit is the one at work. You cannot heal people yourself. The Holy Spirit has to do it. You cannot decide to heal someone or not heal someone; it is the Spirit who decides, just like you cannot make God give a message in tongues and interpret because it is God speaking and no one can make God give a message.

If God wants you to be a healer, he'll make it happen in due time.

I'm praying for the gift of healing.

That would be a good thing to pray for -

"How long does it take for the typical gifted healer to receive the gift?"

No "Pat answer" for that one. Bottom line - when you see a need for healing, pray for 'em. Kathryn KUhlman had a certain reputation as one who had a healing ministry, BUT before every service, she was physically ill with anxiety - fearing that the Lord WOULDN'T come into the meeting and Heal - and she'd be all alone up on stage - just a Spooky totally powerless old lady.

"How I would I know I received that or any other gift?"

If you have to ask - you haven't. But don't let that stop you from praying for folks. When God HEALS (and He DOES heal) it's normally a "Surprise" to both the minister, AND the one healed. When you're "Burdened" by the Holy Spirit to manifest a Gifting, You'll KNOW, because the Spirit will let you know, in terms you can understand, what HE wants you to do.

Our associate pastor was in hospice in the final stages of Cancer - hours to go, and then suddenly he "just got better", and is still cancer free 5 years later. Lots of folks were praying for him.

And SOMETIMES - you're gifted to KNOW just what's going to happen, and all you have to do is minister it.

"Do healers just heal left and right or just when they feel moved by the spirit?"

To begin with there no such thing as a "Healer". There are "Christians" who are USED in the Gifts of Healings by the Holy Spirit. Sometimes in an ongoing, and relatively continuous manner. But the "Gifts of Healings" is "Burdened" by the Spirit at HIS pleasure. I've prayed for many, but only ONCE was the "Gift" consciously there.

"Also, I know of someone who has cast off/out demons for 30 years and each person was a christian."

Not unusual, everybody I know who has had deliverance over the years has been Christian also, Generally "Spirit Filled" Christians, in fact (since I hang around "Full Gospel" groups).

"Is that possible to be christian and possessed or is it just oppression?"

"Possession" is an unfortunate King James translation of "Daemonizomai" (to be oppressed by, or to be under the power of a demon). So it's NOT an "Ownership situation" but an oppression which CAN BE intense enough to require external ministry to "Break free" of it.

And being a Christian - PARTICULARLY with the gross ignorance that surrounds the whole issue, the average Christian's typical gross ignorance of the Word (since they don't bother with it), and the reluctance of Churches to have anything to do with it, doesn't "insulate" us from "demonization" - which many times we're "Complicit" in when we "Give place" to the enemy in our lives.

But it's DEFINITLY not the situation presented in "the Exorcist" movies where the "Hollywood demons" were (as they always are) stronger than the Ministers, and unfazed by the name of Jesus.

"I know of someone who has the gift of healing and went around town and prayed over people for healing. It so happened that it didn't work right away, then 1 in 100 than 1 in 50 were healed (they claimed to have faith) and so forth. Its like he had to practice or something. Can someone explain what that's about?"

Simple - he had received some LOUSY teaching - probably from a "Faith Based" group that taught him to move out on presumption, and he never had the "Gifts of Healings" at all regardless of what he "Thought" he had. The GIFTS of the Holy Spirit are either THERE, or they're NOT, and they don't require "Practice", or Development - only obedience to the Word of God to YOU.

For a Biblical case of the "Gifts of Healings" combined with the Gift of the Word of Knowledge, read Acts 3:
2 And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple;
3 Who seeing Peter and John about to go into the temple asked an alms.
4 And Peter, fastening his eyes upon him with John, said, Look on us.
5 And he gave heed unto them, expecting to receive something of them.
6 Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.
7 And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.
8 And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God.

Note that Peter DIDN'T "Pray for healing" - he just SPOKE IT in the FULL KNOWLEDGE that when He did, the cripple would be healed.

And then Pete picks the guy up - probably at the prompting of the Holy SPirit, knowing that when he did the cripple would receive strength and walk -

And he did.

I wouldn't hesitate to pray for healing when I see a need for it, and I wouldn't be TERRIBLY SURPRISED if the Lord would heal as a result, but there's be no "Gift of healing" involved - just a prayer of hope based in the FACT that God heals.

And I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the Lord Would Burden me to speak healing through the "Gift of healing". When HE tells you to do something - then JUST DO IT. And let the "Chips fall where they may".

ratchet30 said:

Also, I know of someone who has cast off/out demons for 30 years and each person was a christian. Is that possible to be christian and possessed or is it just oppression? I'm confused but I'll be talking with him in a few weeks.

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Impossible for someone who has truly received the Holy Spirit who speaks in tongues.

Matt 4:23 "And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

Luke 13:10 "And he was teaching in one of the synagogues on the sabbath. 11 And, behold, there was a woman which had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bowed together, and could in no wise lift up herself. 12 And when Jesus saw her, he called her to him, and said unto her, Woman, thou art loosed from thine infirmity. 13 And he laid his hands on her: and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God."

This was a spritual problem which manifested as a physical problem.

Mark 1: 21 "And they went into Capernaum; and straightway on the sabbath day he entered into the synagogue, and taught. 22 And they were astonished at his doctrine: for he taught them as one that had authority, and not as the scribes. 23 And there was in their synagogue a man with an unclean spirit; and he cried out, 24 Saying, Let us alone; what have we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy One of God. 25 And Jesus rebuked him, saying, Hold thy peace, and come out of him. 26 And when the unclean spirit had torn him, and cried with a loud voice, he came out of him. 27 And they were all amazed, insomuch that they questioned among themselves, saying, What thing is this? what new doctrine is this? for with authority commandeth he even the unclean spirits, and they do obey him."

The gifts are part of the infilling of the Spirit. When a person is filled with the Spirit and is ministering, the Holy Spirit is able to use that person in any one of the gifts He decides would be appropriate for that situation. It is not that a person takes ownership of a particular gift, but that it is the Holy Spirit who works through the person with the right tool for the job.

When I was a young Christian, there was a competition to see how long it took for us to get all nine gifts of the Spirit. Now that I am experienced in the things of the Spirit, I realise that what we were trying to do was just nonsense and showed a complete lack of understanding about how the Holy Spirit works through a person.

The Holy Spirit does not make a person a "healer". There is only one person who has the anointing for healing. His name is Jesus. We do not heal people in our own right. We use the Name of Jesus to minister healing to a sick person. It is up to the Holy Spirit to do the actual healing. Our responsibility is to use our faith, expressing our belief in God's Word. This opens the way for the Holy Spirit to bring healing to the sick person.

But we must remember that God is sovereign and that there may be many reasons why He decides not to heal the person. For example, a person who has spent 40 years unbelieving, and then gets sick and wants healing, he has to unlearned all those years of unbelief before anything can happen. God is not a vending machine and He does not do command performances. He is God, and does things His way.

If we could work out everything to do with God and why He does or does not do things, He would no longer be God. We pray the prayer of faith, and then trust God to do the rest. We pray for people in obedience to His Word, and not for success. Success in healing is God's domain. Believing in faith is ours, no matter whether the person shows physical evidence of being healed or not.

"It is not that a person takes ownership of a particular gift, but that it is the Holy Spirit who works through the person with the right tool for the job."

BINGO!!!! Right on!!

There seems to be a growing confusion about this, among Full Gospel Folks.

In Matt 8, the Centurion understood authority and said to Yeshua "Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed." So it's not necessary to lay hands on those we're praying for every time. That's the same reason we can pray for the folks in the "prayer requests" section, requests from church, friends, etc. We don't even know their real names from the prayer requests section of CF most of the time but Yeshua does.

At other times, we have James 5:14 "Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:"

I must admit that after over a decade in the COG I am struggling with staying. Much of that revolves around the gifts. I do think they are valid and real. I do have the gift of tongues and have gotten interpretation. The validity of them is not my struggle.

It is the emphasis placed on them. Sometimes we seem to place so much emphasis on "getting tongues" that we leave other things out. "Getting tongues" is more a beginning than an ending. It does not mean an end to troubles, nor an end to growth.

I struggle greatly with so much emphasis placed on tongues, prophesy, physical manifestations (slain in the spirt, etc) and little to no emphasis placed on..well.. everything else in the Word.

I've seen it hurting my brothers and sisters. Like a dog that has finally caught a car they may not know what to do with it and they are actually surprised that they still have issues in their lives.

It says in Corinthians that love is the greatest of the gifts. Why do we preach on and seek after the "flashy" gifts (tongues, healing, prophecy, etc) - but not love?

If love is the greatest shouldn't we seek it and preach on it? Would it be better if less of us had tongues and more of us had love?

Though I understand your concern, just wondering if you're familiar with this purpose of tongues according to Scripture -Jude 1:20-21 “But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost, Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.”

Jethro99 said:

It is the emphasis placed on them. Sometimes we seem to place so much emphasis on "getting tongues" that we leave other things out. "Getting tongues" is more a beginning than an ending. It does not mean an end to troubles, nor an end to growth.

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I’m not sure how we could be over emphasising our Spirit given ability to be able to pray in the Spirit especially when the Scriptures strongly encourage us to do so on a number of occasions. I agree that individuals can be a bit over zealous with their methods but the same goes for being born again as I know that I was not alone for my first 18 months as a believer as I wondered along with many of my youthful peers as to how we can really know that we are saved. Once I received the ability to pray in the Spirit I knew then without any doubt that I was born again which was something that many of my friends who could not speak in tongues were able to say.

As this caused many of us a lot of consternation (and it may very well still do today for some); should we simply stop encouraging people to repent as many of them may not always be able to gain the deep felt knowledge that they are now born again of the Spirit of God.

When it comes to the 8 congregational functions/Offices (1Co 12:28) and with the 9 Manifestations of the Spirit (1Co 12:7-11), unless these are functioning effectively within a congregation we will be less able to encounter the presence of God within our meetings and we definitely will see less of the work of the Spirit in the lives of each individual member.

It says in Corinthians that love is the greatest of the gifts. Why do we preach on and seek after the "flashy" gifts (tongues, healing, prophecy, etc) - but not love?

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Even though it’s not uncommon to hear love being referred to as a gift, it is actually one of the 9 fruits of the Spirit which are not the same as the 9 Manifestations of the Spirit.

ratchet30 said:

The Bible says to earnestly desire the gifts. I'm currently desiring the gifts of healing. If I was used for healing, would I pray in the ill person's presence? and do I lay hands on them?

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You need to be careful in one aspect though. I have read all the posts thus far and don't know much more about your situation but you need to ensure you have your priorities straight. Even desiring a gift above knowing the Lord is wrong and if you seek and seek so much that you forget the more necessary things of faith: prayer, Bible Study, witnessing, doing good, then you may be seeking for a long time. My advice would be to continue doing the things you did at first when you were saved and filled with the Spirit (assuming you are filled). When Jesus instructs you through the Holy Spirit to act with a gift on the behalf of someone else, you will know. There will be no doubt about it. To say though (as has already been stated) that you can possess a gift, that is, the Spirit would just bestow a gift on you and let you have it, is a bit extreme I think. Notice that passage in 1 Corinthians 12 says that the Spirit distributes the gifts as He determines for the common good. So I don't believe the Spirit will just give you a gift/manifestation and let you keep it. Like how I've heard some preach that all true Spirit-filled Christians should just march into hospitals and clear that place out. That's a bit extreme on the view of healing. I once heard someone say that Jesus almost never created opportunities to heal, those opportunities came to Him. Case in point, the beggar in Acts 3 sat at the Beautiful Gate in the Temple for many years and it's highly probable that Jesus had seen him and walked past him several times. So why wasn't he healed by Jesus? Simple, as has been stated already, Jesus did only what He saw the Father doing. So ask the Lord to open your spirit eyes and lead you to where He is working. If you go out to minister and don't feel lead in any one direction then move somewhere else to minister. If you continue to feel unmoved in the Spirit then you could do one of two things, ask God to search you and expose you to the things that are hindering you from hearing His gentle voice AND/OR just start ministering to people fully understanding that it's highly possible not everyone will receive. Some people need to learn that way how to hear the Lord and that's why I believe some will go out and not be able to use a gift at all for a while, then after a period of faithful ministry they will begin to see results. I've been used a few times in healing and I can tell you for certain that you will definitely know when the Lord is telling you to do so.